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What Are Your Ideas For Controlling the Borders?
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Doc Farmer
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Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana, USA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:32 pm    Post subject: Immigration Amnesty? No, Mr. President, No! Reply with quote


Immigration Amnesty? No, Mr. President, No!
Written by Doc Farmer
Friday, January 09, 2004



(My Letter to the President)


To: President George W. Bush
White House

Subject: Your Proposed Immigration ''Reform'' Proposals

Mr. President,

As a native-born American citizen, I offer my respectful dissent to your proposal of 07 January 2004.

I watched your speech on Wednesday, and was immensely dismayed by your action. You are, in effect, legalizing the millions of illegal immigrants (not ''undocumented aliens'' or other such euphemism) who broke American law to enter this nation. I know you stated that you oppose amnesty. Yet, this is exactly what you are doing, sir. In effect, you are telling illegals that their lawbreaking has been rewarded by legal recognition and rights. Rights that they are NOT fairly eligible to receive.

You spoke of the great period of immigration, in which 18 million people came to America in a thirty-year span, to make this nation the preeminent country on earth. What you didn’t say, but should have, was that they came to America legally. They followed the rules. They took the time to learn the language, learn the Constitution, and learn the history of our nation before they became citizens.

None of the illegal aliens in America today did that. And the number of illegals today is getting quite close to the number of legals of yesteryear.

You spoke of ''Americans by choice'' of which there were many in your audience that day. And I’m sure some of them told you how illegal aliens were the downtrodden, the abused, the huddled masses yearning to breathe free. Well, if that were true, they should’ve come knocking at the FRONT door, not sneaking in a back window and hiding in the basement.

We are a nation of compassion, and a nation of welcomers. This much is true. But America is also a nation of LAW. And these people have violated the law. They do not deserve the right to work in America or, for that matter, to be allowed to become Americans.

You stated that illegal aliens would only be taking jobs that American citizens ''didn’t want.'' How do you know? You’re implying that there are some jobs beneath Americans, but not beneath immigrants. I was always taught that no job is beneath a man if it is done honestly and to the best of his ability. Whether that’s digging a ditch, picking tomatoes, flying a 747, or running a nation, all of them are equal in the honor and the dignity of wholesome labor.

We have around three million people who are unemployed. We have anywhere from 10 to 15 million illegal aliens, perhaps more still than that. Assume one third of those are the breadwinners of the family (the proportion is probably higher, but bear with me here). You’d wipe out unemployment in a single stroke. You’d increase the income tax roles, which would have a positive effect on the budget. You’d reduce the welfare roles, both for the American citizens who would now have jobs, and for the illegal aliens who would no longer be in America.

Because they’d be arrested and deported post haste.

Yes, deported. Give them the old heave-ho. Common sense and fairness, as well as U.S. law, states that people who are in America illegally have broken the law, and deserve a swift trip back to wherever they came from. Are they going to have problems because of this? Yes. However, when people break the law, they automatically must accept the consequences of the illegal action. That means a boot to the backside hard enough to carry them across the border.

I know there’s an election coming up. And I’m sure you’ve been told that this is the only way to get the immigrant vote. But it’s a Pyrrhic victory for you. Because you’d be getting only a handful of votes in exchange for handing far more of them to your opponents. Lib/dem/soc/commies will garner the lion’s share of immigrant votes. Legal immigrants, illegal immigrants, dead immigrants, pet immigrants, etc., seem to vote primarily for lib/dem/soc/commies. Often. Get rid of the illegals and you’ll lose a few votes, true. But your opponents will lose far more. Because some of their voting base will have been put on a bus with a box lunch and a ''don’t call us, we won’t call you'' greeting card.

As mentioned before, we’ve got a lot of illegals here. How many are potential terrorists? You don’t know. Nobody does. But even one of them is one too many. You are, with your proposal, giving the opportunity for some terrorists already here illegally to continue to plan against, and potentially act against, the safety and welfare of American citizens. Citizens you have sworn to protect. Explain to me, please, how letting illegals stay here is a good thing for Homeland Security.

I know you want to stem the tide of illegal immigration. There’s a way to do that. It’s simple, effective, legal, and direct. It also has an incredible deterrent effect, and is well within America’s right to control its borders.

Shoot to kill. Harsh? Yes. But illegal aliens, breaking the law, don’t have constitutional rights as far as I’m aware. If they know the penalty for illegal entry into America is not necessarily a boot to the backside but a bullet in the brain, there’s a very good chance that the flood of illegals could be stemmed to a mere trickle. And we have the technology to monitor the borders with unmanned aerial vehicles (UAV’s) over wide areas at a relatively low cost. We’ve used it against our enemies in Afghanistan and Iraq. Perhaps it’s time to apply this concept closer to home.

If you really want to protect America, you should remember the old adage that ''good neighbors make good fences.'' You should also worry less about what your counterparts north and south of us think, sir. They weren’t exactly helpful in the recent War to Liberate Iraq. Why the heck should you help them now? By legalizing illegals, you’re helping their economies more than our own.

Please, Mr. President, reconsider this immigration policy that you’ve announced. The potential short-term political gains are far outweighed by the long-term risks for America. And we, as a nation, deserve better than that.

Yours sincerely,

Doc Farmer

cc: Senator Evan Bayh (D-IN)
Senator Richard Lugar (R-IN)
Representative Mark Souder (R-IN)
U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services
Mr. Vicenté Fox (President, Mexico)
Mr. Paul Martin (Prime Minister, Canada)
Secretary John Ashcroft (Justice)
Secretary Colin Powell (State)
Secretary Tom Ridge (Homeland Security)

This Article Was First Published In ChronWatch At: http://www.chronwatch.com/content/contentDisplay.asp?aid=5540

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SBD
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhantomSgt wrote:
Well the American driver said they were stowaways and he didn't know they were there........ They switched pinatas on him at the supermarket Shocked


Let's see, they switched the pinata and managed to stuff a little boy in a compartment behind the back seat and they didn't see the mother laying doen on the back seat as they covered her with more pinatas.

Girl in piñata found during border check
The car carrying the piñatas bore California plates and was driven by a female U.S. citizen; a man in the passenger seat also is a U.S. citizen. Their names were not available.

Neither will be prosecuted, Bond said, in part because of the sheer volume of immigrant-smuggling cases.

"The arrests of individuals smuggling people far exceeds the ability to prosecute all these people," he said. "The more egregious cases obviously will be considered for prosecution, but if there is no prosecution, we must release them."

If that isn't an open invitation to break the law, then what is?

PhantomSgt wrote:
Seriously though I have lived in NOCAL and SOCAL and I always called them the Republic of Northern California and The Republic of Northern Mexico. When Cinco de Mayo is bigger than the Fourth of July it makes my point. Wink

This is probably true but SoCal does have the best Mexican Food. Have you ever eaten Mexican Food in the medwest or east? They makes Taco Bell seem authentic. Smile

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PhantomSgt
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:43 pm    Post subject: Can't Argue With that Reply with quote

SBD wrote:


This is probably true but SoCal does have the best Mexican Food. Have you ever eaten Mexican Food in the medwest or east? They makes Taco Bell seem authentic. Smile

SBD


Hey your right SOCAL does have the most authentic MEX Food in the USA. Why not they are Northern Mexico after all. The difference between South of the Border MEX and SOCAL MEX is it takes you an hour longer to get the runs with SOCAL MEX.

WOULD THE LAST AMERICAN OUT OF SOCAL PLEASE BRING THE FLAG? Cool
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lthrneck
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have an idea, after a recruit completes training at the rifle range they then put them on 30 days of border duty prior to graduation. If they get a kill they can go on and graduate. No kill no Eagle Globe and Anchor. Women and children only count for partial kills.
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PhantomSgt
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2004 8:55 pm    Post subject: Dead or Alive Noooooooo Reply with quote

lthrneck wrote:
I have an idea, after a recruit completes training at the rifle range they then put them on 30 days of border duty prior to graduation. If they get a kill they can go on and graduate. No kill no Eagle Globe and Anchor. Women and children only count for partial kills.


Not a good idea No Neck. Visualize peace activists lining up on the border singing Cumby a when your sighting in on your next target. Hey wait a minute something else came to mind. I might be wrong.

If you get all those peace activists lined up you could push them over the border and then don’t let them back. No we can’t do that.

This is why I proposed a bounty on live illegal aliens Neck. I had a vision of a group of Necks capping a bunch of illegal aliens and piling their carcasses into the back of the Ford F-150 for a trip to the local collection station. Let me break this down into more basic elements for our Ex-Marines:

Bring them in alive get money. Bring them in dead get no money.


Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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PhantomSgt
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 9:12 am    Post subject: L.A.: End of the American Dream? Reply with quote

I rest my case. Cool

L.A.: End of the American Dream?
By Nicholas Stix

As the sayings go, as Los Angeles goes, so goes California; and as California goes, so goes the nation. If the deterioration of the Left Coast’s multicultural paradises is permitted to continue apace, all of America will soon look just like them.

For the past 15 years or so, radical multiculturalists have gleefully predicted that by the year 2050, whites will be a minority in America. Actually, with the 80 percent increase in illegal immigration since Pres. Bush’s December, 2003 announcement of his amnesty proposal, whites could be a minority as soon as 2030. In Los Angeles, they already are.

At present, L.A. is only 29.7% non-Hispanic white. (And only 10.9% black; the black middle class is engaging in “black flight.”) Only 59.1% of its residents were born in America, an increasing proportion of whom are the “anchor babies” of young Mexican women, who entered the U.S. illegally for the sole purpose of giving birth, in order to exploit social services.

To read the entire article go here: http://geocities.com/nstix/cal.html
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tony54
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank God we still have the Second Amendment,
some day we all may realize why our forefathers gave us that all important right in the first place.

“GOD, GUNS AND GUTS made America free! (Let fight to keep all three!)”
(quote from a bumper sticker)
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highwayman
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the focus of this topic seems to be the influx from south of the border, my question is what about the people that came to this country legaly, wether through a school or visitar visa and allow the visa to lapse but stay...

to begin with, in my opinion, the illigles that come up from down south do the work that able body americans won't do because it is beneath them, wether it is pay or other reasons..

what i don't like, in fact i find distasteful, is that these illigles come up here and during there "visit" someone becomes pregnat and if the child is born in this country the child is automaticly an american citizen, iregardless of the nationality of the mother, intitled to welfare and medicaid. then after the birth the mother applies for and gets welfare, then skips back down south and lives like royalty on american tax payers behalf..

to begin with there should be a better or at least improve the system so to have a way to keep track of the resident legal alians so as not to allow the visa's to lapse and the now illegal alien to stay... good example would be the 911 pilots...

that's my 2 cents...
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PhantomSgt
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

highwayman wrote:
the focus of this topic seems to be the influx from south of the border, my question is what about the people that came to this country legaly, wether through a school or visitar visa and allow the visa to lapse but stay...

to begin with, in my opinion, the illigles that come up from down south do the work that able body americans won't do because it is beneath them, wether it is pay or other reasons..

what i don't like, in fact i find distasteful, is that these illigles come up here and during there "visit" someone becomes pregnat and if the child is born in this country the child is automaticly an american citizen, iregardless of the nationality of the mother, intitled to welfare and medicaid. then after the birth the mother applies for and gets welfare, then skips back down south and lives like royalty on american tax payers behalf..

to begin with there should be a better or at least improve the system so to have a way to keep track of the resident legal alians so as not to allow the visa's to lapse and the now illegal alien to stay... good example would be the 911 pilots...

that's my 2 cents...


This is another good point well taken. As I have said before in this forum, Visa overstays are a huge problem for the INS, one they have never been able to control in the past. Part of the problem was no central database existed to track entry and exit of visitors. As it stood before it wasn’t that we didn’t know they were here, we just didn’t know if they left or not. Yep, this was a pretty dumb system, if they slipped across the border to Canada or Mexico we would let them back in with a multiple entry visa. As far as we knew they left when they were supposed to leave. This may be over a million people who overstay their visa, we just don’t know.

On top of this, before the Patriot Act we couldn’t track them by credit card purchases, car rentals, hotels reservations or airline reservations and had little hope in finding them. Now that we can find them there just isn’t enough manpower or facilities to pick them up, put them through a deportation hearing and hold them for deportation. This is why the INS uses the catch and release program for overstays. They issue a summons to appear at a deportation hearing and run a criminal check. No criminal records on file kick them loose with the promise to appear at a hearing.

This may work for fish, but not people.



Cool Rolling Eyes Cool Rolling Eyes
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ScottyDog
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

highwayman wrote:
the focus of this topic seems to be the influx from south of the border, my question is what about the people that came to this country legaly, wether through a school or visitar visa and allow the visa to lapse but stay...

to begin with, in my opinion, the illigles that come up from down south do the work that able body americans won't do because it is beneath them, wether it is pay or other reasons..



If you are mason, carpenter, painter, I hardly think that you would think that the Illegals coming from Mexico that do the work you used to do for union scale and now the Illegals do it for 20 bucks a day are doing work that you refuse to do.

In short, my point is that the Border Lobby has brainwashed people into thinking there is no impact of the massive immigration. I know people that own contracting businesses that cannot compete with workers that are willing to work for 15 or 20 bucks a day. They have to carry Workman's Comp ect while the contractors that hire Mexican day workers shirk the benefits off on the US taxpayers.

BTW-Who mows the lawns in Wyoming?

I guess my biggest gripe is that people do not realize how these Illegals are destroying our standard of living and pushing down peoples wages.

Southern California is a third world country and getting worse.

No offense Highwayman but I hardly disagree that Illegals do work Americans will not do. The question is should Americans work below minimum wages like the Illegals do?
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highwayman
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ScottyDog wrote:

If you are mason, carpenter, painter, I hardly think that you would think that the Illegals coming from Mexico that do the work you used to do for union scale and now the Illegals do it for 20 bucks a day are doing work that you refuse to do.


No offense Highwayman but I hardly disagree that Illegals do work Americans will not do. The question is should Americans work below minimum wages like the Illegals do?


to begin with it looks like we are in more of an agreement then what you may want to admit, and i should have expanded more.. the type of work that i was talking about is the manual labor such as field work or as you put it mowing lawns, it may not be in wyoming. if you were looking to have yard work done would you give the work to highest bidder? would you pay a grand to have your lawn mowed once? i know i wouldn't...

as far as skilled labor personaly i would give preference to the american worker..
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ScottyDog
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

highwayman:

Guess what, Americans mow lawns in Wyoming and many other states that have not been invaded by Illegals that are willing to work for what they get in their own corrupt country.

I just moved back to California to take care of my aging mother and am appalled in how much So Cal has changed in the 15 years I was away. It literally has become little Mexico.

I guess we will have to disagree but there many Americans being driven out of the jobs that "they will no longer do".

In Wyoming, a white neighborhood kid mowed my lawn to make money to save for his first car.

Not a grand but 100 bucks a month.

Think about it next time you think you can save a buck employing an Illegal Alien. Whose job are you giving to somebody that owes no allegiance to this country or our way of life.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone remember paper routes? I had one with 170 customers and I delivered everyday before school when I was 12 years old. Christmas tips were excellent. Now somebody no one knows, driving by at 50 MPH tosses one in the general direction of the house.

Cutting grass in the summer and shoveling snow in the winter was another source of income for me and I worked my butt off, but I never asked for an allowance or money from anyone in the family. My kids didn't have these same opportunities and the chance to learn what it was like to earn. So we are now creating generations that only know what is given to them not how to sweat and earn it.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the long term the ability to be free and pursue happiness within ones homeland is the key for securing our borders. However several countries are not free or the pursuit of happiness has been drowned out by the pursuit of essential elements of survival.

It will not be until all people of all lands are free and have the basic needs of human existence met will America be free from the burden of taking in people from less fortunate circumstance.

Since it is unlikely that America will ever be able to turn away all those who would like to live here we at the very least need to identify any evil doers and keep them from entering into America and we also need to identify all alien evil doers and expel them.

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blue9t3
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Scottydog, I deserted Calif. about 10 years ago and the day I left it was at its best (in my rear-view mirror). Cal. was real, and it was fun,but it wasnt real-fun! Shocked
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