SwiftVets.com

Polaris · Rear Admiral Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 626

Herb,

Ah, but most of the voters out there that haven't been following this are behind the curve. For them the goalposts have not been moved. Note the language of the ad. Gardner pulls no punches in calling Kerry a liar and deceitful, and he gives a very specific reason why he thinks so, and states his qualifications admirably.

That makes this ad powerful and highly believable (much like the first one was). I would like to see some polling research on this new ad, but IMHO it will be about as effective as the first ad.
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-Polaris

Truth is Beauty

producehawk · PO1 Joined: 14 Aug 2004 Posts: 463

John O. and the swiftys are building a case for the jury, the American people. The case needs to be made in a logical way. Kerry has no idea how to rebut. Most can see he is not telling the truth but relying upon slander and lies. This is a plan that is coming together beautifully. The add is perect.

Herb · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:01 am Post subject:

lrb111 · Captain Joined: 28 Jul 2004 Posts: 508

Herb · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:13 am Post subject:

Polaris · Rear Admiral Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 626

Herb,

I will quibble slightly. I fully agree that we have had an incredibly inpact for the megre resources we have had. That said I disagree that the Dem 527 ads have not been effective.

They have. IMHO that is why the ABB (Anybody But Bush) crowd is so vorcifious and noisy. Just looking at the objective data, Bush should be breezing towards reelection. The reason he's not is because a lot of lies and twisted gossip has become "accepted truth" in a large part of the electorate and that is due to a three year barrage by the negative ads by Dem leaning 527s.

The problem that Kerry is facing is that a 527 can only do a negative ad legally. They can not endorse a candidate making positive ads difficult. My point is this: The reason new attack ads have been ineffective against Bush is because anyone that would have been affected by attack ads against Bush already has been. This is not true for Kerry. This is why Kerry's support is generally softer than the president's IMHO...and it is why (IMHO) Bush will get a bounce out of the RNC while Kerry did not.
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-Polaris

Truth is Beauty

Herb · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:49 am Post subject:

rbshirley · Founder Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 394

ArmyWife · Lieutenant Joined: 06 Aug 2004 Posts: 218

I like the ad. I have been appalled at the number of people that have bought into the myth that none of the SBVfT were on Kerry's boat, so that needed to be dealt with head on. Just because we here knew the truth about that claim doesn't mean that MOST people did.

I hope Steve Gardner is prepared for some angry personal attacks. I'm a little worried for him. Sad

I hope there will be enough money to follow up with some more ads about Kerry's post-Vietnam activities. Too many folks like Bill O'Reilly, with no military experience of their own, just beg confusion over the medals and differing action accounts. They don't know how to read and understand the story, so they give Kerry the benefit of the doubt because the citations are real. The post-Vietnam activities are indisputable and are the real reason we are all here, anyway. Those need some more publicity.

GoophyDog · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 9:42 am Post subject:

Mr. Gardner is a cannon cocker. Like the guns he serviced, he's a straight shooter and one who can stand the incoming.

Hat's off to him.
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Why ask? Because it needs asking.

Stop Hanoi John · Ensign Joined: 06 Aug 2004 Posts: 71

The ads have all been crushing knees to the groin of the Kerry camp.

You can't just jump all over the place with the ads like some suggest. There is still plenty of time to bring Kerry's anti-war activities into play(they have actually been mentioned a bit). You have to lay it out in a kind of timeline. You cant go from focusing on Christmas in Cambodia to focusing on meeting with the VietCong, back to his first purple heart, ahead to his 71 Senate testimony, etc. without confusing the public.

The ads have been about as effective as any I've seen recently. Willie Horton would be the closest competitior, and I think this ad campaign crushes Wille Horton for damage. SBVFT are laying their story out piece by piece so Americans can see exactly how Kerry performed from beginning to end.

There is only 4 months of service to focus on here. Give them a little time to explore it. I'm sure the SBVFT have quite a few things to say about how he performed after Vietnam.

The story is no good if you skip right to the end and spoil it.

I also think the timing of the release of these ads capitalized on (if not created) the bounceless DNC. Kerry hasn't been able to focus on much else.

Bush could be in for a nice little bounce that puts him in the WH.

Son Of The Godfather · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 11:56 am Post subject:

I agree with Stop Hanoi John,

The SBVT has been expert at exposing Kerry, layer by ugly layer.
They have properly planned and are executing a hellish time-release capsule which doesn't over-saturate but chips slowly away.

Here's a huge lie of Kerry's... MSM = ignore
Here's another lie... Fox = "buzz buzz buzz"
Here's another lie... John Kerry = "Bring it on!"... FOX/MSM = "BUZZ BUZZ BUZZ"
Here's another lie... John Kerry = "Mr. President, make it stop! - Here's Max Cleland."
Here's another lie...

Significant and unrelenting damage to Kerry's character.
From the SBVT campaign to date, most logical folks understand that Kerry is a liar, a traitor, a medal harvester, a coward, and a whiner.
What's next I wonder?

SOTG
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"Which candidate would enemies of the United States prefer to see in the White House?"

jataylor11 · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 12:51 pm Post subject:

The timing of the release of this Ad was brilliant. Again you guys amaze me.

Three hours before the release of AD III Kerry spoke in Minnesota saying (I paraphrase) the guys in this boat support him and he never lied.

Bam!!! Garner: I was in Kerry's boat longer than anyone.

Bam!!! Garner: Kerry lied.

I wish I could find the exact quote. It was running all over ABC yesterday until the ad was released, then the MSM deleted that soundbite.

jataylor11 · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 12:53 pm Post subject:

Found it --- Here is the news story:

At a health care town hall meeting in Anoka, Minnesota, Senator John Kerry faced a direct question from a self-proclaimed Independent male voter who asked at 12:31pm EST, "The two things they say about you is that you waffle on the issues and that you lied about Vietnam. So, do you waffle on the issues and did you lie about Vietnam?"

A revved up Kerry addressed Vietnam first retorting, "All the guys who were with me on my boat absolutely document what I've said...you're now hearing about the lie. I am absolutely telling you the God's honest truth with regard to what happened over there."

The Senator, who has faced increasing criticism from groups such as the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth in recent weeks, argued that this was all a part of "Republican playbook" and that both issues were simply meant to build a buzz until they broke through to the public, never having a solid base in fact.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/DailyNews/Kerry%20Pushes%20Back%20on%20Nam%20Accusations.html

Son Of The Godfather · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 12:57 pm Post subject: