SwiftVets.com

[SBD]

Title 32----National Defense; Revised as of July 1, 1981
Subtitle A----Department of Defense
CHAPTER VI----DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY
SUBCHAPTER C----PERSONNEL
PART 724----NAVAL DISCHARGE REVIEW BOARD
Subpart K----Responsibilities in Support of the Naval Discharge Review Board
§ 724.Appendix E ---- VETERAN'S BENEFITS
32 CFR 724.Appendix E 91 Stat. 1106
Public Law 95--126, Oct. 8, 1977 95th Congress

To deny entitlement to veterans' benefits to certain persons who would otherwise become so entitled solely by virtue of the administrative upgrading under temporarily revised standards of other than honorable discharges from service during the Vietnam era; to require case--by--case review under uniform, historically consistent, generally applicable standards and procedures prior to the award of veterans' benefits to persons administratively discharged under other than honorable
conditions from active military, naval, or air service; and for other purposes.

Be it enacted by the Senate and the House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

That (a) section 3103 of Title 38, United States Code, is amended by ----
(1) inserting "or on the basis of an absence without authority from active duty for a continuous period of at least one hundred and eighty days if such person was discharged under conditions other than honorable unless such person demonstrates to the satisfaction of the Administrator that there are compelling circumstances to warrant such prolonged unauthorized absence." after "deserter," in subsection (a), and by inserting a comma and "notwithstanding any action subsequent to the date of such discharge by a board established pursuant to section 1553 of title 10" before the period at the end of such subsection; and

(2) adding at the end of such section the following new subsection:
"(e)(1) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, (A) no benefits under laws administered by the Veterans' Administration shall be provided, as a result of a change in or new issuance of a discharge under section 1553 of title 10, except upon a case--by--case review by the board of review concerned, subject to review by the Secretary concerned, under such section, of all the evidence and factors in each case under published uniform standards (which shall be historically consistent with criteria for determining honorable service and shall not include any criterion for automatically granting or denying such change or issuance) and procedures generally applicable to all persons administratively discharged or released from active military, naval, or air service under other than honorable conditions: and (B) any such person shall be afforded an opportunity to apply for such review under such section 1553 for a period of time terminating not less than one year after the date on which such uniform standards and procedures are promulgated and published.

"(2) Notwithstanding any other provision of law ---- "(A) no person discharged or released from active military, naval, or air service under other than honorable conditions who has been awarded a general or honorable discharge under revised standards for the review of discharges, (i) as implemented by the President's directive of January 19, 1977, initiating further action with respect to the President's Proclamation 4313 of September 16, 1974, (ii) as implemented on or after April 5, 1977, under the Department of Defense's special discharge review program, or (iii) as implemented subsequent to April 5, 1977, and not made applicable to all persons administratively discharged or released from active military, naval, or air service under other than honorable conditions, shall be entitled to benefits under laws administered by the Veterans' Administration except upon a determination, based on a case--by--case review, under standards (meeting the requirements of paragraph (1) of this subsection) applied by the board of review concerned under section 1553 of title 10, subject to review by the Secretary concerned, that such person would be awarded an upgraded discharge under such standards; and "(B) such determination shall be made by such board, (i) on an expedited basis after notification by the Veterans' Administration to the Secretary concerned that such person has received, is in receipt of, or has applied for such benefits or after a written request is made by such person or such determination, (ii) on its own initiative within one year after the
date of enactment of this paragraph in any case where a general or honorable discharge has been awarded on or prior to the date of enactment of this paragraph under revised standards referred to in clause (A) (i), (ii), or (iii) of this paragraph, or (iii) on its own initiative at the time a general or honorable discharge is so awarded in any case where a general or honorable discharge is awarded after such enactment date.

"If such board makes a preliminary determination that such person would not have been awarded an upgraded discharge under standards meeting the requirements of paragraph (1) of this subsection, such person shall be entitled to an appearance before the board, as provided for in section 1553(c) of title 10, prior to a final determination on such question and shall be given written notice by the board of such preliminary determination and of his or her right to such appearance. The Administrator shall, as soon as administratively feasible, notify the appropriate board of review of the
receipt of benefits under laws administered by the Veterans' Administration, or the application for such benefits, by any person awarded an upgraded discharge under revised standards referred to in clause (A) (i), (ii), or (iii) of this paragraph with respect to whom a favorable determination has not been made under this paragraph.".
(b)(1) The Secretary of Defense shall fully inform each person awarded a general or honorable discharge under revised standards for the review of discharges referred to in section 3103(e)(2)(A) (i), (ii), or (iii) of title 38, United States Code, as added by subsection (a)(2) of this section, of his or her right to obtain an expedited determination under section 3103(e)(2)(B)(i) of such title and of the implications of the provisions of this Act for each such person.

(2) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary of Defense shall inform each persom who applies to a board of review under section 1553 of title 10, United States Code, and who appears to have been discharged under circumstances which might constitute a bar to benefits under section 3103(a) of title 38, United States Code, (A) that such person might possibly be administratively found to be entitled to benefits under laws administered by the Veterans' Administration only through the action of a board for the correction of military records under section 1552 of such title 10 or the action of the Administrator of Veterans' Affairs under section 3103 of such title 38, and (B) of the procedures for making application to such section 1552 board for such purpose and to the Administrator of Veterans' Affairs for such purpose (including the right to proceed concurrently under such sections 3103, 1552 and 1553).

Section 2. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Administrator of Veterans' Affairs shall provide the type of health care and related benefits authorized to be provided under chapter 17 of title 38, United States Code, for any disability incurred or aggravated during active military, naval, or air service in line of duty by a person other than a person barred from receiving benefits by section 3103(a) of such title, but shall not provide such health care and related benefits pursuant to this section for any disability incurred or aggravated during a period of service from which such person was discharged by reason of a bad conduct discharge.

Section 3. Paragraph (1 of section 101 of Title 38, United States Code, is amended to read as follows:
"(1 The term 'discharge or release' includes, (A) retirement from the active military, naval, or air service, and (B) the satisfactory completion of the period of active military, naval, or air service for which a person was obligated at the time of entry into such service in the case of a person who, due to enlistment or reenlistment, was not awarded a discharge or
release from such period of service at the time of such completion thereof and who, at such time, would otherwise have been eligible for the award of a discharge or release under conditions other than dishonorable."

Section 4. In promulgating, or making any revisions of or amendments to, regulations governing the standards and procedures by which the Veterans' Administration determines whether a person was discharged or released from active military, naval, or air service under conditions other than dishonorable, the Administrator of Veterans' Affairs shall, in keeping with the spirit and intent of this Act, not promulgate any such regulations or revise or amend any such regulations for the purpose of, or having the effect of, (1) providing any unique or special advantage to veterans awarded general or honorable discharges under revised standards for the review of discharges described in section 3103(e)(2)(A) (i), (ii), or (iii) of title 38, United States Code, as added by section 1(a)(2) of this Act, or (2) otherwise making any special distinction between such veterans and other veterans.

Section 5. This Act shall become effective on the date of its enactment, except that ----
(1) section 2 shall become effective on October 1, 1977, or on such enactment date, whichever is later; and (2) the amendments made by section 1(a) shall apply retroactively to deny benefits under laws administered by the Veterans' Administration, except that, notwithstanding any other provision of law. (A) with respect to any person who, on such enactment date is receiving benefits under laws administered by the
Veterans' Administration, (i) such benefits shall not be terminated under paragraph (2) of section 3103(e) of title 38, United States Code, as added by section 1(a)(2) of this Act, until, (I) the day on which a final determination not favorable to the person concerned is made on an expedited basis under paragraph (2) of such section 3103(e), (II) the day following the expiration of ninety days after a preliminary determination not favorable to such person is made under such paragraph, or (III) the day following the expiration of one hundred and eighty days after such enactment date, whichever day is the earliest, and (ii) the United States shall not make any claim to recover the value of any benefits provided to such person prior to such earliest day;

(B) with respect to any person awarded a general or honorable discharge under revised standards for the review of discharges referred to in clause (A) (i), (ii), or (iii) of such paragraph who has been provided any such benefits prior to such enactment date, the United States shall not make any claim to recover the value of any benefits so provided; and
(C) the amendments made by clause (1) of section 1(a) shall apply, (i) retroactively only to persons awarded general or honorable discharges under such revised standards and to persons who, prior to the date of enactment of this Act, had not attained general eligibility for such benefits by virtue of (I) a change in or new issuance of a discharge under section 1553 of title 10, United States Code, or (II) any other provision of law, and (ii) prospectively (on and after such enactment date) to all other persons.
SOURCE: 44 FR 76509, Dec. 27, 1979
AUTHORITY: 10 U.S.C. 1553

SBD[/b]

edited your topic SBD/kate

[SBD]

FYI-It looks like all of his Military Records have been removed from his website or am I just not looking hard enough. All pages come up not found.

SBD

[SBD]

Check out the recommendation for the Bronze Star of March 13, 1969.

The one from John Kerry
http://www.swiftboatarchives.com/docfile/bronze_star_recommendation.pdf

A real one from Thurlow
http://www.swiftboatarchives.com/docfile/veterans_awardrecommendation.pdf

Other than the obvious difference in the way the documents look, take a look at the previous awarded medal section. Notice Silver Star awarded for action on March 6, 1969. I don't remember a battle on March 6, I thought it was February 28, 1969.

Other differences include Thurlow being marked as status Reserve and Kerry marked as status Regular.

Thurlow is part of Coastal Division Eleven currently and at time of Award.

Kerry's says he is currently part of Coastal Squadron one and Coastal Division Eleven at time of award.

He'll never release his real records.

SBD

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

Heh heh heh.... those swiftboatarchives are already coming in pretty handy, aren't they?

I have noooooo clue as to what you found with regard to the first post in this thread... I can follow about three consecutive words of legalese before my brain blows a circuit.


Soooo.... clue me in... what're ya thinkin'?
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[ncoic6]

SBD:

Why is Lambert's award recommendation (for the Bronze Star) missing from the National Personnel Records Center?

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/capitalgames?bid=3&pid=1692

[SBD]

I wish I knew the answer to that myself.

SBD

[SBD]

[SBD]

Title 32----National Defense
Subtitle A----Department of Defense
CHAPTER VI----DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY SUBCHAPTER C----PERSONNEL
PART 730----ADMINISTRATIVE DISCHARGES AND RELATED MATTERS
CONCERNING SEPARATIONS FROM THE NAVAL SERVICE
Subpart B----Marine Corps

§ 730.72 Giving and recording of advice to a respondent, both when the respondent is and when he is not under military control.

32 CFR 730.72
(a) Requirements. Whether or not a respondent is under military control, no administrative discharge under conditions other than honorable, and, in the case of a member with 8 or more years of continuous active duty no administrative discharge by reason of unsuitability, will be effected unless the respondent is tendered the advice prescribed below:

(1) Advice to respondent under military control. In each case where a member on active duty and under military control is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or has 8 or more years of continuous active military service and is recommended for a discharge by reason of unsuitability, or requests a discharge for the good of the service within the purview of § 730.70, the officer empowered to convene an administrative discharge board having jurisdiction over the member will take or cause to be taken the following action:

(i) Notify the member, in writing, of the proposed discharge action and the general and specific bases therefor.
(ii) Advise the member of the purpose and scope of the Navy Discharge Review Board and the Board for Correction of Naval Records. See § 730.50(c)(2).
(iii) Advise the member that he has the following rights, which will, unless he waives such rights in writing, be afforded him: To present to and have his case considered by an administrative discharge board of not less than three officers, at least one of whom will be a field grade officer, and composed in accordance with § 730.73(b); to appear in person before such board, subject to his availability; and to be represented by military counsel, who will be a lawyer within the meaning of article 27(b)(1) of the Uniform Code of Military Justice unless appropriate authority certifies in the
permanent record the nonavailability of a lawyer so qualified and sets forth the qualifications of the substituted nonlawyer counsel. Advise the member that if he does not waive a hearing before an administrative discharge board, and upon the hearing of his case before such board, he will be entitled to those rights set forth in § 730.73(c) (2) through (5), (12), (14),
(15), (1; (f), and (g). The advice as to the respondent's rights contained in the cited paragraphs of § 730.73 may be given in a summarized form. Further advise the member that before waiving any of these rights, in writing, it would be to his advantage to consult with counsel and that he will be given the opportunity to do so.
(iv) Advise the member who indicates that he wishes to submit a request for discharge for the good of the service,
pursuant to § 730.70, that, if such request is accepted, he may receive a discharge under other than honorable conditions
without administrative discharge board action, and further advise him of the adverse nature of such discharge and the possible consequences thereof. Before a member is permitted to actually submit a request for discharge for the good of the service, he will be advised that it would be to his advantage to consult with counsel and he will be given the opportunity
to do so.

(2) Advice to respondent not under military control. In each case where a member on active duty is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or has 8 or more years of continuous active military service and is recommended for a discharge by reason of unsuitability, and the member is not under military control because of either his continuous established
unauthorized absence of more than 1 year, or because of his confinement by civil authorities, the officer empowered to convene an administrative discharge board having jurisdiction over the member will take or cause to be taken the following action: (Where the member is not under military control because of the continuous established unauthorized absence of more than 1 year, the action prescribed by paragraph (a)(2)(ii) of this section will ordinarily be taken or caused to be taken by the Commandant of the Marine Corps. See § 730.54(c)(1).)

(i) Where the member is not under military control and is unable to appear before an administrative discharge board because of his confinement by civil authorities, advise the member, in writing and by registered mail sent to the civil institution where the member is confined:
(a) Of the proposed discharge action and the general and specific bases therefor.
(b) Of the type of discharge certificate that may be issued.
(c) Of the purpose and scope of the Navy Discharge Review Board and the Board for Correction of Naval Records. See § 730.50(c)(2).
(d) Of the fact that administrative discharge action has been suspended to give him the opportunity to exercise the following rights: To request the appointment of a military counsel, who will be a lawyer within the meaning of article 27(b)(1) of the Uniform Code of Military Justice unless appropriate authority certifies in the permanent record the nonavailability of a lawyer so qualified and sets forth the qualifications of the substituted nonlawyer counsel, and to have such counsel represent him, and in his absence, present his case before an administrative discharge board; to submit statements in his own behalf; and to waive the foregoing rights, either in writing, or by the failure to reply to the letter of notification within the prescribed time limit specified therein.

(ii) Subject to the provisions of Title 10, U.S. Code 1163, where the member is not under military control by reason of a continuous established unauthorized absence of more than 1 year, advise the member, in writing and by registered mail sent to the current home of record address of the member, or the current address of his next of kin as reflected in the
member's service records, as appropriate:
(a) Of the proposed discharge action and the general and specific bases therefor.
(b) Of the effective date of the proposed discharge action.
(c) Of the type of discharge certificate that may be issued.
(d) Of the purpose and scope of the Navy Discharge Review Board and the Board for Correction of Naval Records. See § 730.50(c)(2).

(3) Recording advice given respondent under military control. In each case where a member on active duty and under military control is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or has 8 or more years of continuous active military service and is recommended for discharge by reason of unsuitability, or requests discharge for the good of the service within the purview of § 730.70, and after the advice prescribed in paragraph (a)(1) of this section has been given and the opportunity
to consult with counsel has been afforded, the permanent record will contain either the following, or in lieu thereof, a certification by the officer taking the action prescribed by paragraph (a)(1) of this section that such action has been accomplished:
(i) A copy of the written notification to the member of the general and specific bases for the proposed discharge action.
(ii) The member's written acknowledgement of the advice given him of the purpose and scope of the Navy Discharge Review Board and the Board for Correction of Naval Records.
(iii) The member's written acknowledgement that he was given and understands the advice prescribed in paragraph (a)(1) (iii) and/or (iv) of this section.
(iv) The member's written waiver of any or all of the rights prescribed in paragraph (a)(1)(iii) of this section, and/or the member's written request for discharge for the good of the service, together with the member's written acknowledgement that he was afforded the opportunity to consult with counsel prior to effecting such waivers and/or request for discharge.
The member's written acknowledgement will include the fact that he either chose not to consult with counsel prior to effecting such waivers and/or request for discharge, or, if he did so consult with counsel, the specific identity of the counsel and his legal qualifications.

AND HERE IS WHAT IS IN HIS RECORD THAT HE DOES NOT WANT US TO SEE

(4) Recording advice given respondent not under military control. In each case where a member on active duty is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or has 8 or more years of continuous active military duty and is recommended for a discharge by reason of unsuitability, and the member is not under military control because of his continuous established unauthorized absence of more than 1 year, or because of his confinement by civil authorities, and after the advice prescribed in paragraph (a)(2) of this section has been given, the permanent record will contain the following:

(i) A certified copy of the registered letter or letters sent to the member pursuant to paragraph (a)(2) (i) or (ii) of this section, including a certification as to the date any letter was mailed and the address to which it was sent.

(ii) The complete reply or replies of the member and/or his next of kin to the registered letter or letters sent pursuant to paragraph (a)(2) (i) or (ii) of this section, or a certification that no reply from the member and/or his next of kin was received by a specified date.

(iii) Evidence that the registered letter or letters sent pursuant to paragraph (a)(2) (i) or (ii) of this section was delivered, or was not delivered, or was undeliverable.

(iv) The member's written waiver, if any, of any or all of his rights prescribed by paragraph (a)(2) (i)(d) of this section.

(5) Advice to a respondent who is a member of the Marine Corps Reserve on inactive duty.

(i) In each case where a Reservist on inactive duty is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or where such Reservist has 8 or more years of continuous active duty and is recommended for discharge by reason of unsuitability, the officer empowered to convene an administrative discharge board having jurisdiction over the member will take or cause to be taken the following action, in the form prescribed in paragraph (a)(5)(ii) of this section:

(a) Notify the member, in writing, of the proposed discharge action, the general and specific bases therefor, and the type of discharge certificate that may be issued.

(b) Advise the member of the purpose and scope of the Navy Discharge Review Board and the Board for Correction of Naval Records. See § 730.50(c)(2).

(c) Advise the member that if he is reasonably available to appear before an administrative discharge board, he has the following rights, whichf will, unless he waives such rights in writing, be afforded him: To present to and have his case considered by an administrative discharge board of not less than three officers, at least one of whom will be a field grade officer, and composed in accordance with § 730.73

(b); to appear in person before such board, subject to his availability;
and to be represented by civilian counsel at no expense to the Government, or to be represented by military counsel, who will be a lawyer within the meaning of article 27(b)(1) of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, unless appropriate authority certifies in the permanent record the nonavailability of a lawyer so qualified and sets forth the qualifications of the substituted nonlawyer counsel.

NOTE: Despite the fact that military counsel who is a lawyer within the meaning of article 27(b)(1), UCMJ, will not normally be on active duty within a reserve unit, the availability of such counsel must, nevertheless, be determined in each case in accordance with the general principles contained in § 730.73(f). Advise the member that if he does not waive a hearing before an administrative discharge board, and upon the hearing
of his case before such board, he will be entitled to those rights set forth in § 730.73(c)(2) through (5), (12), (14), (15), (1; (f), and (g). The advice as to the respondent's rights contained in the cited paragraphs of § 730.73 may be given in a summarized form. Further advise the member that before waiving any of these rights, in writing, it would be to his advantage to consult with counsel and that he will be given the opportunity to do so.

(d) Advise the member that if he either fails to reply to the letter of notification and advice within the prescribed time limit specified therein, or if he replies to such letter and does not waive in writing his right to appear in person before an administrative discharge board but, after being notified of the time and place of the meeting of the board, fails to appear, he will be considered to have effectively waived all of his rights before the board and the board will proceed in his absence with the appropriate disposition of his case.

(e) Advise the member that if he does choose to appear in person before an administrative discharge board, such appearance will be at no expense to the Government.

(ii) The giving of the notification and advice required by paragraph (a)(5)(i) of this section will be accomplished by the mailing of a registered letter, containing such notification and advice, addressed to the member concerned at the mailing address which the records of the activity mailing the letter indicate as the most recent one furnished by the member as
an address at or from which official mail will be received or forwarded to him. In addition to, or under appropriate circumstances in lieu of, a letter so addressed, a registered letter addressed to the member concerned containing this notification and advice may be directed to any of the following:
(a) The city, town, or community in which the member has last been reported to be residing, or the post office address apparently nearest his last reported place of residence, or
(b) In care of any person whom the member has at any time designated in his service records (i.e., in blocks 16--18 of DD Form 93--1), as a beneficiary or as one to be notified in the event of his serious injury or death, sent to the mailing address which the records of the authority originating the letter indicate as the most recent one furnished by the member concerned for such person, or
(c) In care of any institution in which the member has been reported to be hospitalized or confined. Neither the absence of an indication of delivery, nor the return as undeliverable, of a registered letter addressed as outlined above, will negate the legal efficacy of such letter as the notification and advice required by paragraph (a)(5)(i) of this
section to be given to the member concerned. It is the responsibility of each member of the Marine Corps Reserve to ensure that the records pertaining to him accurately and currently reflect a mailing address at which he can be reached.

(6) Recording advice given to a respondent who is a member of the Marine Corps Reserve on inactive duty. In each case where a Reservist on inactive duty is recommended for an undesirable discharge, or where such Reservist has 8 or more years of continuous active duty and is recommended for discharge by reason of unsuitability, and after the
notification and advice prescribed by paragraph (a)(5) of this section has been given and the opportunity to consult with counsel has been afforded, the permanent record will contain the following:

(i) A certified copy of the registered letter or letters sent to the member pursuant to paragraph (a)(5) of this section, including a certification as to the date each letter was mailed and the address to which it was sent.

(ii) The complete reply or replies of the member and/or others acting on his behalf to any registered letter sent to him pursuant to paragraph (a)(5) of this section, or a certification that no reply from the member and/or others acting on his behalf was received by a specified date.

(iii) Evidence that any registered letter was delivered, or was not delivered or was undeliverable.

(iv) Evidence that a respondent, who did not waive, in writing, his right to appear before an administrative discharge board, after being notified of the time and place of the meeting of the board, failed to appear. In this event, all the known circumstances relating to such nonappearance should be reflected.

(v) The member's written waiver of any or all of his rights prescribed by paragraph (a)(5)(i)(c), together with the member's written acknowledgment that he was afforded the opportunity to consult with counsel prior to effecting such waivers, or a certification reflecting that such opportunity was afforded the member. Certification will be made of the fact that the member chose not to consult with counsel prior to effecting such waivers, or if he did so consult with counsel, the specific identity of the counsel and his legal qualifications.

(b) Member's refusal. Should any member affirmatively refuse to either request or waive his rights, and persist in such refusal, an entry in explanation thereof will be made in the record of the case, and the member's case will be disposed of as if he had requested all of his applicable rights.

SOURCE: 31 FR 16528, Dec. 28, 1966
AUTHORITY: Secs. 280, 1162, 1163, 6291--6298 70A Stat. 14, 89, 391--393, as amended, 76 Stat. 508, 517, sec. 301, 80 Stat. 379; 5 U.S.C. 301, 10 U.S.C. 133, 280, 1162, 1163, 1168, 6291--629

Sounds pretty close to me, doesn't it:?:

SBD

[kate]

Closer & closer SBD

When going through the forum archives, I found some threads related to an interview in 1971 where a reporter questioned Kerry about his discharge. I remember the discussion, and had listened to that video. The poster in this thread is right-on. It's the way in which the question was asked -and- answered

http://www.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=15195

[Tom Poole]

Kudos again kate for a great piece of work. I listened to this C-Span recording again and it was just a little too "matter-of-fact" but this time, what struck me was it also seemed rehearsed. This extremely important question seemed out of place and was asked a little too quickly. Additionally, Silky's reply was very fast, unequivocal and much more clearly stated than his other typically "mumbled" responses.
_________________
'58 Airedale HMR(L)-261 VMO-2

[Me#1You#10]

Not to rain on the parade, but the thrust of her question was/is as indecipherable as was Kerry's response.

[kate]

Dunno, but what is interesting is that the topic even came up - about a dishonorable discharge - back then by that reporter.

As Tom notes, it seemed rehearsed. Would be interesting to get that Debbie's take, and why she asked that question.
_________________
.
one of..... We The People

[Me#1You#10]

Ahhh...point well-taken Kate

[SBD]

[manelly]

The first 13 sec. of the 1971 video ...
http://www.c-span.org/classroom/govt/rwh032804.asp
According to Kerry and the interviewer, Kerry had a Dishonorable Discharge and was a "Former Lieutenant" by November 6th 1971 wich is the date of the interview.

Transcript :

GROEBLI: We're looking at a picture of a veteran who is throwing his medals away. This is one of the photographs included in a new book by our guest, John Kerry, former lieutenant.

Deborah Norville interviewed Debbie Groebli April 27, 2004
Link to transcript ..... http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4853585

Deborah Norville never asked Debbie Groebli about the Dishonorable Discharge question and answer.

John Kerry has removed all military records that were posted during the Presidential campaign.

Luckily they were saved here : http://www.swiftboatarchives.com/docfile/johnkerrymilitaryrecords.pdf
pg 17, DD214 re discharge from Naval Officer Candidate school date of entry Aug 19 1966.... date of discharge from Officer Candidate School Dec. 15 1966......Terminal date of reserve obligation Feb. 17 1972.

In the 1971 interview Kerry says he served since 1965. Doesn't this say he joined the Reserves in Aug of 1966 and was due to be discharged from the Reserves in 1972?

pg. 18 basicaly states that Kerry was "Released from Active duty and transferred to Reserve on Jan. 3 1970. Discharge listed on page 18 as "Honorable"
Sometime between Jan. 3 1970 and Nov. 6 1971 Kerry was "Dishonorably dischared" ....Correct?

Oh yeah... Pg. 18 also lists "medals and Awards" includes the "Silver Star with Combat V"


Just trying to get things lined up mentally.
_________________
Enlighten the people, generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like spirits at the dawn of day.
- Thomas Jefferson