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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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 Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:19 pm Post subject: Two G.I. Deaths Probed--Update:Murder Charges Filed!! |
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Another Fragging?????
http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/318015p-271965c.html
| Quote: | Two G.I. deaths probed as crime
Guardsmen from N.Y. slain while they slept in Iraqi palace
By JOSE MARTINEZ
and CORKY SIEMASZKO
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS
June 11, 2005
New York National Guard 1st Lt. Louis Allen (above) was killed Tuesday in Iraq, along with fellow officer Capt. Phillip Esposito. Military authorities initially said they had died in a mortar attack.
The U.S. Army launched a criminal investigation yesterday into the deaths of two New York National Guard officers who were killed while they were sleeping in one of Saddam Hussein's former palaces.
The military initially reported that Capt. Phillip Esposito and 1st Lt. Louis Allen, both assigned to the 42nd Infantry Division, died late Tuesday as the result of an "indirect fire" attack on the palace in Saddam's hometown of Tikrit.
Col. Bill Buckner, spokesman for the Multi-National Corps in Iraq, revised the record.
"The evidence indicates that this was not indeed caused by a mortar attack," he said.
A military source told the Daily News, "We don't believe their deaths were caused by an enemy combat attack. We believe there was a crime here."
Esposito was a company commander and Allen served as a company operations officer.
Buckner said investigators have not detained any suspects. Nor would he speculate on whether the killers could have been fellow soldiers or what caused the blasts.
Word that Esposito, a Wall Street broker, and Allen, the son of a retired a city cop, died under suspicious circumstances sent waves of anguish through the soldiers' families.
"Right now they don't know for sure what happened," said a friend of Esposito's parents who was reached at the slain soldier's Pearl River home. "Their son paid the ultimate sacrifice and they're both very upset."
In Milford, Pa., where Allen lived with his wife, Barbara, and four young sons, a neighbor said she wasn't certain the widow even knew about the Army investigation.
"She was crushed when Lou died," said the neighbor, who declined to give her name. "This ... this will kill her."
Esposito, 30, a 1997 West Point graduate, was married to Siobhan McMahon and they had a young daughter, Madeline Rose. He worked for Salomon Smith Barney in Manhattan and was deployed to Iraq six months ago.
Allen, 39, was the son of retired NYPD cop Robert Allen. He was one of the guardsmen deployed to Manhattan after the Sept. 11 attacks and had been in Iraq for just 10 days.
Soldiers reported four explosions destroyed the ground-floor room where Esposito and Allen had been sleeping in one of the many marble buildings of the sprawling palace complex built around a man-made lake. The Army occupied the facility in 2003 and renamed it Forward Operating Base Danger. Despite its name, attacks on the base have been so rare that soldiers there are not required to wear their body armor.
"We are evaluating all possible threats to our soldiers," Buckner said. "We are taking all measures to ensure the safety of our soldiers."
Known as the "Rainbow Division," the 42nd is based upstate and draws soldiers from several Northeastern states.
The only confirmed "fragging" of officers in the Iraq war occurred in the days before the invasion began. A court-martial in April convicted an Army sergeant of murdering two officers in a grenade attack in Kuwait. |
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776)
Last edited by shawa on Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:18 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Rdtf
CNO
Joined: 13 May 2004
Posts: 2209
Location: BUSHville
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:22 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know what they mean by 'fragging,' but we are on the same side and need each other!
Below is also another troubling story - when I first read the headline I thought, 'oh no, not again, someone bashing our military' but if it's true it's terrible. These folks are in a stressful, tense situation over there, but some may need to do a better job of identifying the enemy! maybe better training or some relief. I am a DOD contractor and can only imagine what it must be like to go over there and then be treated like this. And to a fellow Marine!
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/06/10/iraq.contractors.ap/index.html
| Quote: | Contractor alleges abuse by Marines
Was one of 16 security personnel detained in Iraq
Friday, June 10, 2005 Posted: 11:28 PM EDT (0328 GMT)
RENO, Nevada (AP) -- Security contractors were heckled, humiliated and physically abused by U.S. Marines in Iraq while jailed for 72 hours with insurgents, one of the detainees said Friday.
"It was disbelief the whole time. I couldn't believe what was happening," said Matt Raiche, 34, an ex-Marine who was one of 16 American and three Iraqi contractors detained at Camp Falluja last month.
"I just found it crazy that we were being held with terrorists, that we were put in the same facility with them," he told The Associated Press in an interview at his lawyer's office. "They were calling us a rogue mercenary team."
Defense officials said Thursday that the security guards for Charlotte, North Carolina-based Zapata Engineering were detained for three days. The contractors fired on Iraqi civilian cars and U.S. forces in Falluja, 40 miles west of Baghdad, the Defense officials said.
Company president Manuel Zapata said the only shot fired by his workers was a warning blast after they noticed a vehicle following them. (More on Falluja incident)
The military has denied the contractors were abused. No charges have been filed against any of the contractors, who the military said were separated from suspected insurgents.
Raiche, of Dayton, Nevada, said the contractors were stopped and taken into custody on May 28. He said a Marine told him that shots had been fired, and Raiche told him, "It wasn't us."
Raiche said several of the contractors were interrogated before they were released June 1 with no official explanation for their detention.
A detainee's allegations
Raiche said guards intimidated the detainees with dogs, made them strip and told them to wear towels over their heads going to the restroom, so insurgents in the facility would not recognize and harm them, Raiche said.
One of his colleagues was slammed to the ground by a guard, he said.
"His head bounced off the asphalt." Raiche said. "He told me he heard one guard say to another, `If he moves, let the dog loose."'
Raiche said his colleague told him that a guard then reached down and "squeezed his testicles so hard he could barely move."
When Raiche first arrived at the facility, he said a guard ordered him to the ground and put a knee in his back. He said he heard one Marine say, "How does it feel now making that big contractor money?"
Raiche said the Marines handcuffed them with "zip lock ties." When the detainees complained they were so tight they were losing circulation in their hands, they were cursed at and told to shut up, Raiche said.
Raiche returned to Reno on Thursday night. He said he had been in Iraq for about two years before returning to Nevada earlier this spring, then headed back to Iraq on May 2.
An estimated 20,000 Americans, many of them former military personnel, are believed to be working in Iraq for contractors. More than 200 private workers have died in Iraq.
Zapata Engineering contracts frequently with the Defense Department and Zapata said he was waiting for completion of the military's investigation before he draws conclusions about how the military treated his workers. |
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LewWaters
Admin
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 4042
Location: Washington State
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I don't know what they mean by 'fragging,' |
Rdtf, the term "fragging" became popular during Viet Nam. The practice is as old as the hills. It is where subordinates decide they don't like another soldier, usually a Top Sargeant or Officer and kill them. It is nothing more than outright murder and was indirectly encouraged by the anti-war left during Viet Nam. It gained the term by the murderer simly tossing a fragmentation into the victims tent or room, as was done early on by the one soldier in Kuwait.
A quote from one of Hanoi Janes broadcasts from North Viet Nam in 1972;
| Quote: | | “[Although] we do not condone the killing of American officers . . . we do support the soldiers who are beginning to think for themselves.” |
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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:17 am Post subject: |
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LewWaters said
| Quote: | | “[Although] we do not condone the killing of American officers . . . we do support the soldiers who are beginning to think for themselves.” |
I had not heard that statement before. That is beyond the pale!!
She is couching with the "do not condone" while supporting the
"think for themselves" fragging!!
My God, what a despicable EVIL woman!!!
Lew, is there a website devoted to Hanoi Jane's traitorous words and activities? I have occasionally come across a few quotes, but I would like to apprise myself of the full depth of her treason.
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776) |
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mtboone
Founder
Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 470
Location: Kansas City, MO.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| shawa wrote: | LewWaters said
| Quote: | | “[Although] we do not condone the killing of American officers . . . we do support the soldiers who are beginning to think for themselves.” |
I had not heard that statement before. That is beyond the pale!!
She is couching with the "do not condone" while supporting the
"think for themselves" fragging!!
My God, what a despicable EVIL woman!!!
Lew, is there a website devoted to Hanoi Jane's traitorous words and activities? I have occasionally come across a few quotes, but I would like to apprise myself of the full depth of her treason. |
Welcome to our world that we had to endure since the late 60's. Now you can understand our hatred of Jane and Kerry.
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Terry Boone PCF 90
Qui Nhon 68-69 |
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kate
Admin
Joined: 14 May 2004
Posts: 1891
Location: Upstate, New York
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:54 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | is there a website devoted to Hanoi Jane's traitorous words and activities? I have occasionally come across a few quotes, but I would like to apprise myself of the full depth of her treason. |
shawa, for a start, we have CIA docs for a dozen of Jane Fonda's propaganda broadcasts for the North Vietnamese in this thread on the Winter Soldier forum...disgusting reading
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LewWaters
Admin
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 4042
Location: Washington State
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 4:12 am Post subject: |
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Shawa, sorry for not supplying the link to her quote, but it is found within the article recently posted;
Jane Fonda - An American Traitor
Like mtboone said, now you can see one of the several reasons so many of us hate her.
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Rdtf
CNO
Joined: 13 May 2004
Posts: 2209
Location: BUSHville
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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Article from the NY Times on the Officers' deaths -
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/12/nyregion/12soldier.html?ex=1119153600&en=93e85ee025ff879f&ei=5040&partner=MOREOVERNEWS
| Quote: | Ny Times
June 12, 2005
Dead Guardsmen's Families Must Mourn and Wonder, Too
By DAMIEN CAVE
The friends and family of two New York National Guardsmen who were killed in Iraq on Tuesday said yesterday that their grief would be compounded by confusion until the military finished its criminal investigation into how they died.
Joan Esposito, the mother of one of the soldiers, Capt. Phillip T. Esposito, 30, of Suffern, N.Y., said her son's wife, Siobhan, should be given a clear account of his death as soon as possible. "I just want what's right for my daughter-in-law," Ms. Esposito said. "She needs answers."
Ms. Esposito expressed the same concern for the couple's 18-month-old daughter, Madeline. "My granddaughter deserves to know what happened to her daddy," she said.
Captain Esposito, a 1997 graduate of West Point, and a fellow New York guardsman, First Lt. Louis E. Allen, 34, a teacher who lived in Milford, Pa., were killed Tuesday in what was originally believed to be an insurgent mortar attack at a base in Tikrit.
On Friday, military officials said that they were opening a criminal investigation into the soldiers' deaths and that investigators had determined that they could not have occurred in a mortar attack. Military officials declined to provide more information, citing the continuing investigation.
Ms. Esposito, 68, said Army officials had visited the family to discuss possible explanations for her son's death. But she said she and her husband were too distraught to pay close attention to what they were saying and eventually left the room.
Her son, she said, had wanted to be a soldier since third grade. Barry Lennihan, a close family friend who knew Captain Esposito since he was a boy, said that he had attended space camp and might have been an astronaut if not for his less-than-perfect eyesight.
"He was a very, very solid individual," Mr. Lennihan said.
Friends of Lieutenant Allen described him as quiet, loving father, who took his four children, all boys under age 6, to high school basketball games whenever he could. Joseph P. Zanetti, superintendent of the Tuxedo Union Free School District, where Lieutenant Allen taught physics and earth science for the past five years, said that he was dedicated to his students, and his wife, Barbara.
He said that Lieutenant Allen's friends and colleagues first heard on Wednesday that he had been killed by a mortar attack, and were shocked to discover on Friday that he might have been killed instead by fellow Americans.
"The situation is such a tragedy already, then you talk about these other possibilities of how he died," he said. "It's just so difficult."
Captain Esposito and Lieutenant Allen were the 17th and 18th New York guardsmen to die in Iraq, said Lt. Col. Paul Fanning, a Guard spokesman. |
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Tom Poole
Vice Admiral
Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 914
Location: America
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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We need to be patient because the investigation needs to be thorough. But, leave it to the NYT to use the phrase, "might have been killed instead by fellow Americans" in lieu of "friendly fire." The former conjures up a vision of crime while the latter conjures a vision of a horrible accident. Remember the tragedy of Pat Tillman. No crime there.
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'58 Airedale HMR(L)-261 VMO-2 |
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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, Kate and Lew, for the links.
I have been doing a lot of reading. (incredibly repulsive!!}
Lew, the Holzer's FPM article is an astoundingly stark INDICTMENT
Early last year when Kerry emerged as the frontrunner in the Dem primaries, I knew I didn't like him just because he seemed to be such an empty suit, a sophomoric fraud. I really was not aware of his Vietnam War activities, I just instinctively disliked him. Then, I saw the first SBVT ad and came to this forum to find out more. Boy, were my eyes opened!!!
Now, after reading the links and the Holzer article on Fonda, I am nauseated.
mtboone wrote
| Quote: | | Welcome to our world that we had to endure since the late 60's. Now you can understand our hatred of Jane and Kerry. |
All I can say is Yes, I truly understand what you had to endure!! I am repulsed by her actions and words then, as well as her attitude and lack of apology now.
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776) |
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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:15 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Military Files Murder Charges In Iraq Killings
NBC News
Updated: 7:54 p.m. ET June 16, 2005
NBC: U.S. sergeant accused of ‘fragging’ officers had been disciplined by them |
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8246860/
This guy should hang if it is proven he did it!!
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776) |
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kate
Admin
Joined: 14 May 2004
Posts: 1891
Location: Upstate, New York
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:48 am Post subject: |
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this would explain the premeditated charge
SARGE KILLED GIS BY REMOTE
NY Post
June 18, 2005 | NILES LATHEM & KENNETH LOVETT
| Quote: | Disgruntled National Guard soldier Alberto Martinez used a powerful remote-control Claymore mine to murder his two superior officers in a plot to make the slaying resemble an Iraqi terrorist attack, it was revealed yesterday.
Shocking details of the carefully calculated killing of New York Guard Capt. Phillip Esposito and Lt. Louis Allen in Tikrit were revealed yesterday by retired Army Col. Jack Jacobs, a Medal of Honor winner who spoke to senior military officials familiar with the investigation.
Jacobs said investigators believe the 37-year-old Martinez, a company supply sergeant from Troy, detonated the mine on a window sill. The sill was outside the room where company commander Esposito and operations officer Allen were having a nighttime meeting to plan the next day's operations.
The deadly anti-personnel mine was connected by wires to a "clacker" — a small electrical generator, controlled by Martinez, that set off blasting caps in the mine.
The Claymore contains a pound of plastic explosive and buckshot shrapnel, and it throws off a "shaped" charge that channels the blast in a specific direction.
After the June 7 explosion inside the officer's quarters in one of Saddam Hussein's old palaces, Martinez tossed "a couple" of hand grenades in another direction to make it appear as though there was an Iraqi insurgent mortar attack on the base, Jacobs said.
He also threw the clacker in a nearby lake, but Army investigators later found it after draining the lake, Jacobs said.
"You have to be pretty calculating and pretty determined to do something like that," Jacobs told The Post in an interview after revealing details of the attack on MSNBC.
Military officials in Iraq would not comment.
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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds like this guy was TROUBLE brewing for a long time.
Just what was he planning to do with a 47 lb. BOMB in his basement??
| Quote: | Soldier's troubled past unfolds
By: James V. Franco
06/18/2005
More than 18 months after a December 2002 fire at the Cohoes home of Alberto Martinez, officials found a live 47-pound bomb in the basement.
When the bomb was found in July 2004, officials opted not to file charges against the 37-year-old National Guard staff sergeant who was arrested earlier this week for "fragging" two of his commanding officers on June 7 near Tikrit, Iraq. Authorities say he detonated an explosive device to kill Capt. Phillip T. Esposito and 1st Lt. Louis E. Allen while they were at a command post in one of Saddam Hussein's palaces.
Cohoes Det. Tom Ross said Friday a caretaker overseeing rehabilitation work on the burned-out house reported the bomb, and Cohoes Police immediately called in the State Police bomb squad who in turn called the Army. There were reports that the bomb was taken to Fort Drum and detonated.
Martinez, his wife and two children had been living with his father in Schaghticoke since the fire while they battled an insurance company over compensation for damage to the house. Presumably, since no one was living there, anyone could have put the bomb in the basement, and by the time it was discovered, Martinez had already been deployed.
In addition, Cohoes Fire Chief Joe Fahd said firefighters found several artillery shells after the fire was extinguished, but they were all unarmed. He said a demolition team from the Watervliet Arsenal checked out the ordinance and eventually confiscated it.
It remains unclear when Martinez actually was deployed overseas. The 42nd Infantry Division - also called the Rainbow Division - went to Fort Drum for training in May 2004, and began being deployed in waves starting in October.
Meanwhile, the Martinez family is refusing to talk to the press. The Associated Press reported that an unidentified woman told reporters to get off the isolated Schaghticoke property and that there will be "no statement today, no statement tonight and no statement tomorrow."
When asked by a reporter if Martinez was falsely accused, she said: "Yes, and that is all we have to say."
Russell Catalano, a rear detachment commander for the 42nd Infantry Division, visited Martinez's wife Friday to let the family know military assistance was available. Catalano, Martinez's supervisor at the National Guard warehouse located on the Watervliet Arsenal property, called the full-time guardsman, "very professional."
"When I asked him to do something he always said 'yes sir,'" Catalano said.
He said he knew little of Martinez outside of work, but did say he never knew Martinez to be a disciplinary problem. He would not comment on Martinez' wife or the family's current state of mind.
Other members of the Rainbow Division were under orders not to talk to the press.
Also Friday, the AP reported Barbara Allen made an emotional statement about the man accused of killing her husband, calling Martinez a "traitor and a coward."
"God may have mercy on him, but I hope no one else will," she said.
Michael Craparo, the husband of Esposito's sister, Alyssa, spoke on the family's behalf Thursday night from the front porch of the Esposito home.
"This doesn't change anything," he said. "This can't bring Phillip back.
What motivated Martinez remains a mystery. Army officials are not commenting on reports that one or both of the West Point graduates disciplined Martinez prior to the killing.
Neighbors of Martinez' burned-out Cohoes home say he was under an enormous amount of stress lately. After his house caught fire, he was forced to move his family back into his boyhood home in Schaghticoke.
On March 13, 2004, his mother died "after a long illness" at 56 years old, according to her obituary. A short time after that, he was deployed.
"It's all very sad," said former Cohoes neighbor Barbara Prevost.
Neighbor Gerald Lahue called Martinez a "hard worker who took care of his family." The retired Cohoes firefighter said "the whole family are good people."
The military initially said the commanders were killed by "indirect fire" on the base - a mortar round that struck a window on the side of the building where Esposito and Allen were.
A criminal investigation was launched after it was determined that the "blast pattern" at the scene was inconsistent with a mortar attack.
Martinez is currently at a military detention facility in Kuwait. He has been assigned a military attorney and has the option of hiring a civilian lawyer, authorities said. |
www.troyrecord.com
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776) |
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GenrXr
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 1720
Location: Houston
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| Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:21 am Post subject: |
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This person if guilty should spend life in Leavenworth, rather then face the death penalty. Hard labor till his last day I say.
_________________
"An activist is the person who cleans up the water, not the one claiming its dirty."
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to stand by and do nothing." Edmund Burke (1729-1797), Founder of Conservative Philosophy |
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