SwiftVets.com

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

I've got a question that I haven't been able find a good answer. Looking at the evidence that the Swift Boat veterans have researched and presented compared with Kerry's response of threatening lawsuits and a host of other things it is more than likely that Kerry has been lying about his war record.

The question I have is "why?" Why, knowing that his past would be dug up, knowing that almost none of his so-called band of brothers supports him (16 yays compared with 250 nays) and knowing that he said, under oath, that he committed war crimes did he make Viet'Nam central to his campaign?

I know that people will do a lot of things for power but his story is so easily dismissable that it was simply stupid for him to try and be a war hero. I simply have trouble believing that Kerry is as evil and as dark a man as is necessary to try and pull the wool over the eyes of the American people with such an incendiary lie.

Any thoughts would be welcome.

Kevin

Twidget · Seaman Recruit Joined: 21 Aug 2004 Posts: 46

He'd played the "war hero" card in previous elections, and nobody had successfully called him on it before.

My guess is that no one had the complete picture on Kerry until Hoffman organized everyone and they compared notes AND Tour of Duty came out and they saw it was a crock. If it were just two or three people saying, "Well, I had a couple issues with Kerry", they'd be written off easily. With 260+, it's a little more difficult.

FF1047 · Lieutenant Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 222

He started in Vietnam, lying on after action reports ... and didn't get caught by the Navy ... then ...

He goes with the Big Lie ... his "fellow" VVAW veterans atrocity ... and the media didn't call him on it ...

he later starts talking about "Christmas in Cambodia" ... and again the media is mute ...

when his book is being written he clearly contradicts himself between his personal recollections, the Navy records and his own journal ... and the journalist writing it doesn't call him on it ...

He actually believes nobody in the media will call him on anything !!! (and he knows they'll help him try to tear down anyone who does ...)
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JJC
USNA class of 1980

SwanLady · Seaman Apprentice Joined: 20 Aug 2004 Posts: 95

taz · Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 7:33 pm Post subject:

also, he never imagined the internet!

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

Covering up a lie usually requires more lies, yes. But if you know you're lying and you decide to run for President why do you make that the centerpiece of your campaign? It's Russian Roulette with a voting machine. It just makes no sense to me.

John Gault · Seaman Recruit Joined: 23 Aug 2004 Posts: 35

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

Perhaps I'm expecting a more "nuanced" explaination. Wink

Maybe I'm just too dense to get it but these explainations just seem too simple of an explaination for someone who wants to be Commander-In-Chief. Not that I want to discount any of the opinions here or shoot anyone here down but there has to be something here besides ego.

For example, if he looked at what he wanted to be in Viet'Nam (namely President), saw that this was his only shot and was desperate to do something besides live in the Senate I could understand it. Or if he had some kind of mental issue (which I don't) then I could understand it. But to make it a centerpiece of his campaign? Makes absolutely no sense to me except to make people think that 4 months in Viet'Nam makes him qualified to run the war on terror. But in that case it's much safer to discount the war on terror and run his campaign on social issues rather than on a deliberate lie.

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

Also, if he were a pathological lier and he actually believed that he committed war crimes and did all this stuff that he's claimed how could be convince himself that he's worthy of running for a Senate seat, let alone President?

John Gault · Seaman Recruit Joined: 23 Aug 2004 Posts: 35

FF1047 · Lieutenant Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 222

Why would Bill Clinton lie about Monica ?

Why would Harkin lie about being a combat pilot ?

Why would Howard Dean accuse Bush of knowing about 9/11 ?

Same reason most men lie ... to obtain power, influence, money, women ... (and in no specific order)

Kerry is lying, and look what it has gotten him in his life ...

1) National recognition at a young age (that he would not have gotten thru real achievement on his own)
2) A foot in the political door that he has parlayed into long, influential public career.
3) That political career has allowed him win over the moneyed women he has married.
4) 4 or 5 Huge houses all over the country ... all the sports toys he could ever want ... (thanks to his wives money ...)

If the lying stops him from being President I'd say he is still WAY AHEAD in life ... so if you want motive, just look at his current results...

If you are a guy, asking "Why would he lie ?" is strange. For some people the answer would be "Who wouldn't lie to get his life ...". and even if you would never lie to get what he has, don't tell me you don't understand the nuance of that answer ...
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JJC
USNA class of 1980

jimlarsen · Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 8:59 pm Post subject:

I used to work for a pathological liar. He said whatever seemed convienent or usefull or necessary to get his way. And, he often called other people liars. John Kerry does seem to have many of the traits of my former boss. The driving force appears to me to be a matter of comfort. The pathological liar abhors discomfort and find the world he makes out of lies to be a comfortable place to live. Kerry's lies about his fellow Fast Boat crewmembers seems to me to fit the "comfort" situation. John Kerry killed some civilians including a young boy. It muct be very difficult for him to live with the fact that he, a peace activist, actually killed innocent people. He can't change that fact, so he tries another tactic to find a level of comfort. By accusing he fellow Fast Boat sailors of committing worse things, he makes a comforting cushion against his own self image. By accusing his superiors of ordering the horrible acts, he packs more cushing under his self image. As long as he's comfortable with the lies he will probably continue to tell them. If somehow, something makes him uncomfortable with the lies, he will, in my opinion start to come unraveled.

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

kschroeder · Seaman Recruit Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 10

...and maybe the "Anybody but Bush" people took the "Anybody" too far and now they're stuck with a fraud.

rb325th · Admiral Joined: 21 Aug 2004 Posts: 1334

Actually the number of people on the Kerry Campaign advising him that served with him on Vietnam is zero. There are a few that were a part of his VVAW days on his campaign staff. Hurley his chief attack dog is a Vietnam Vet and a proven liar himself, after making claims of atrocoties committed by his Unit in Vietnam wich were published in Kerrys book, he was confronted on the lies and had to issue an apology.
So I guess Kerry has surrounded himself with likeminded people who have about the same degree of character as he does.
A bunch of hypocrites, liars and career politicians.
Yep someone should have told Kerry it was a bad idea to base his campaign on 4 months in Vietnam. Someone should have reminded him of his actions Post Vietnam, to include the Winter Soldier meeting, the Senate Testimony, and of course his Trip to Paris.
Well since noone had the common sense to tell him not to, the SBVFT are doing the right thing and educating the people on exactly who Kerry really is.
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U.S. Army 1983-1995, 11C1P/11H2P NBTDT