SwiftVets.com

[gocars]

I spent almost 3 tours in I Corp with Delta troop of the 2/17th. Cav, 101st. Airborne and received my share of wounds, cuts and scrapes directly related to hostile fire. If I had insisted that all my "injuries" be verified and documented I probably would have come home with over 25 PH's instead of my 4. Most of us would just have Doc take the superficial slivers of shrapnel or whatever out, and "press-on".

I don't presume to understand what Kerry's in-country motivation was back in the late 60's but what pisses me off is that, when back in the world, he painted all who served (and were serving) in 'Nam with a broad brush by calling us "baby killers" and "drug addicts".

He now claims that he is one of us; a brother in combat. What a hypocrite, a liar and a REMF.

[redhawk34]

gocars, I take your points re Kerry, but I must comment on lumping REMFs (Rear Echelon Melon Farmers) in with liars and hypocrites.
I use the term only to describe myself, as my duties placed me 25 feet behind the Infantry. (I commanded an Infantry Boat.)
The rear echelon soldier who showed up and did his assigned duty as best he could, for his full tour, holds my full honor, which Di Di Mao Kerry does not.
I liked getting paid, receiving water and ammo, getting my mail, medical attention, Intel, Commo, fuel, and all the other functions without which we could not have operated for a single day.
We have to remember how good these guys were. Just to take Supply, unlike civilian industry, it was unacceptable to say "Sorry, Ammo's on Back Order." They did what it took to get the job done.
In the 199th Light Infantry Association, I am proud to say that members of our 7th Support Bn. are held in as high esteem as are the Grunts, Track Heads, and Cannon Cockers, as they should be.
REMFs, walk tall and proud! You earned it!
Redhawk

[gocars]

I didn't mean to offend you or anyone who served diligently in any capacity in 'Nam. You are certainly correct that without support those of us in the field would've been in beaucoup deep s__t in a hurry. Up in I corp AO our definition of a REMF was someone in the rear who didn't give a damn about their responsibilities and spent all their time at the NCO or O club. The guys who did their job and gave us the log support we needed were always in our gratitude.

I had several "Redcatcher" friends down in Long Bin that were with the 71st LRRP in late '68 early '69.

[BuffaloJack]

Kerry wanted to be rear echelon. It's just that he wasn't given the opportunity and he didn't like having to trade pleasantries with the VC. There is no ambiguity that that bag of scum wasn't on the front lines. It's just that he couldn't be satisfied with just being a guy in combat, his ego required him to be a superhero even if it meant padding his reports and fabricating events. He further sank to the depths when he returned from Viet Nam and then attacked every veteran with false accusations of war crimes and atrocities. He will never be forgiven. Kerry is scum.

[redhawk34]

gocars; "Up in I corp AO our definition of a REMF was someone in the rear who didn't give a damn about their responsibilities and spent all their time at the NCO or O club."
Sadly, there were such. At a time when we were desperately short of experienced combat Senior NCOs, the support units seemed to be full of 7s and 8s wearing Korea CIBs.
I worked with 71st LRRP several times. They were a class act.
Redhawk

[SEABEE_JAG]

Let's go back to 1968.

1. There was no UPS.

2. There was no FedEx

3. There was no Airborne/DHL

4. There was no USPS Express Mail

5. The whole field of "Supply Chain Management Software" and "Perpetual Inventory Software" and "Bar Code Readers" were a bunch of research projects at the Navy Supply Depot in Mechanicsburg PA - actually at a garage run by IBM's Federal Systems Division (now Lockheed-Martin).

6. There was no Cleveland DOD Disbursing Office - we had guys with multiple "Q" allotments (that meant they were polygamists in the eyes of DOD and the UCMJ - one GI at Danang was actually prosecuted for "fraud" and "polygamy" )

7. The "systems" were labor intensive and unchanged since Napoleon's day.

8. In order to fight the material intensive war that America fights - and get the bullets and band-aids and beans (and pay) to the point of the spear - there has to be a long logistics tail.

9. As we are tragically seeing in Iraq - when we contract out the REMF functions to civilians - we end up paying much more - for much less-- and they can pack up and go home whenever they want -- and they are NOT subject to the UCMJ.

10. By way of history - the SeaBees were founded to rid the world of civilian contractors whom could just pack up and go home home when things got messy, and who were not not subject to the UCMJ, and who were legally "guerillas" and "irregulars" (and subject to execution upon capture). The SeaBees were founded when the Navy swore in the civilian contactor tradesmen as "Constructionmen Sailors" (SeaBees) - for military discipline and Geneva Convention protected status as military personnel rather then "irregulars" and "guerillas".
_________________
SeaBee JAG

[redhawk34]

I understand that there was one logisitcs computer in 'Nam, in the Newport area near Saigon. I never saw it, but talked to a guy involved in it.
It filled a building the size of a college gym, had a cooling system that would have air-conditioned El Paso, took 10 guys to run it (punch cards and paper tape), pulled the electric power of a small town,
And had less processor power than a "Furby."

Great book on logistics by the Three Star Log commander for Gulf War I;
"Moving Mountains" Lt. General Jeffrey (Gus) Pagonis.
ISBN: 0875845088

I met the General when he was a 1LT running the 1097th Med. Boat Co.

Redhawk

Amateurs study tactics, professionals study logistics.