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grandforker
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 09 Sep 2004
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BC
PO3
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 288
Location: Oklahoma City
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 Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:08 am Post subject: |
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| TEWSPilot wrote: | Did you go back one page and click on the links and look at the CBS "experts" and the "close associates" of Col Killian (hint: very large type).
...gotta have some humor every once in a while or you'll crack a head.  |
experts
HEY!!! An’t that kerry’s campaign staff?   
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Mona
Seaman Apprentice
Joined: 14 Aug 2004
Posts: 77
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:14 am Post subject: |
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| You GottaBeKidding wrote: | Mona,
I repeat. Kerning IS NOT automatic in Word. You have to turn it on, and the place to do so is not easy to find. The person who created these documents would almost certainly not know how to turn it on.
I know what kerning is. I teach this stuff. I typed all four documents WITHOUT KERNING and they match. |
Ok, I certainly lack all expertise in this area, and will defer to you. But do you then think that analysis at Power Line re: kerning is wholly mistaken on that point?
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You GottaBeKidding
Rear Admiral
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 692
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:18 am Post subject: |
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Mona,
I have been working on this all day with hardly a break, except to deal with some budget stuff for my homeowners' association. I'm tired.
My documents, DONE WITHOUT KERNING, match the original PDFs.
I don't see any of the inconsistent spacing/kerning/whatever that the pundit reported. Besides, that "inconsistent spacing" that the person attributes to kerning and proportional spacing (s/he is saying that some words are scrunched while others are spread out) does not exist because it only happens when you full-justify. This text is not, therefore the spacing is even.
Given that kerning is NOT AUTOMATIC and my documents (all four) match WITHOUT KERNING and that turning kerning on requires a knowledge of Word that the person who typed the fake documents would be unlikely to have, I'd say no to the kerning.
Last edited by You GottaBeKidding on Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:22 am; edited 1 time in total |
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azpatriot
Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 593
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:21 am Post subject: |
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| cipher wrote: | I'm *STILL* looking for a legimate reference to AFM 35-13 in a military document relating to flight physicals.
Actually, ANY reference that has the TITLE of that manual would be appreciated. |
I did a pretty exuastive search on the net and all i'm coming up with is democratic hack sites bashing Bush, not one so far actualy has a valid link to anything, they just all just quote it.
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FedEx Kinko's: When it absolutely, positively has to be forged overnight |
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kmmpatriot
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 146
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:22 am Post subject: |
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From the WaPo story
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9967-2004Sep9.html
| Quote: | A senior CBS official, who asked not to be named because CBS managers did not want to go beyond their official statement, named one of the network's sources as retired Maj. Gen. Bobby W. Hodges, the immediate superior of the documents' alleged author, Lt. Col. Jerry B. Killian. He said that a CBS reporter read the documents to Hodges over the phone, and that Hodges replied that "these are the things that Killian had expressed to me at the time."
"These documents represent what Killian not only was putting in memoranda, but was telling other people," the CBS News official said. "Journalistically, we've gone several extra miles."
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OK...does this prove ANYTHING about the authenticity of the documents? NOT! These people really think "the folks" are stupid!
~Kylie[/i]
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Last edited by kmmpatriot on Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:24 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Skywatch
Ensign
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 74
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:23 am Post subject: |
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This is truly a landmark event in the history of journalism... The news giant CBS has aggressively pushed this story replete with documents which according to CBS, have been thoroughly vetted and verified, yet now appear to be forgeries. Further, CBS is still standing by the authenticity of those documents! This is extrordinary. Something has to give soon or CBS news will fall like a house of cards.
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kmmpatriot
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 146
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:29 am Post subject: |
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www.drudgereport.com
CBS launches internal investigation.....LMAO!!!!!
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The Wise man draws more Advantage from his Enemies, than the Fool from his Friends. - from Poor Richard's Almanac...and a perfect commentary on the current state of this campaign! |
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W.P. Wily
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 101
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | CBS verified the authenticity of the documents by talking to individuals who had seen the documents at the time they were written. These individuals were close associates of Colonel Jerry Killian and confirm that the documents reflect his opinions at the time the documents were written. |
Which seems rather hard to do since Colonel Killian was dead when the documents were authored.
The saddest thing about this whole mess is that Kerry supporters have defiled the memory of yet another veteran for their own purposes.  |
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Scrooge
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 28
Location: Richmond, VA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:30 am Post subject: CBS |
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Compromised Broadcasting System
Can Be Schutped
Can Be Stupid
Conspirators Building Subversion
Cowards Benefitting ScaryKerry
Collaborators Behind Slander
Craven Blather Source ( as in Dan Blather )
Scrooge |
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Beldar
Seaman Apprentice
Joined: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 77
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:30 am Post subject: |
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| This genuinely started brewing simultaneously and spontaneously at multiple different places. I had emails about it before 7:30 am this morning (which unfortunately I didn't read until around noon). But this isn't about who gets credit for exposing the fraud, it's about exposing the fraud. |
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JimRobson
Lieutenant
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 242
Location: Jacksonville FL
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FMBass
Ensign
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 51
Location: NJ
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:32 am Post subject: |
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From http://www.drudgereport.com/cbsd.htm:
XXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX THU SEPT 09, 2004 22:45:32 ET XXXXX
CBSNEWS LAUNCHES INTERNAL INVESTIGATION AFTER SUSPICIOUS BUSH DOCS AIRED
**Exclusive**
CBS NEWS executives have launched an internal investigation into whether its premiere news program 60 MINUTES aired fabricated documents relating to Bush National Guard service, the DRUDGE REPORT has learned.
"The reputation and integrity of the entire news division is at stake, if we are in error, it will be corrected," a top CBS source explained late Thursday.
The source, who asked not to be named, described CBSNEWS anchor and 60 MINUTES correspondent Dan Rather as being "shell-shocked" by the increasingly likelihood that the documents in question were fraudulent.
Rather, who anchored the segment presenting new information on the president's military service, will personally correct the record on-air, if need be, the source explained from New York.
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cipher
Vice Admiral
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 902
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:32 am Post subject: |
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That AFM 35-13 reference is going to be the undoing of the *content*. And since ALL references to this "mythical" Air Force Manual are from DU Talking Point sites, those documents are highly suspect, and the *origins* are now starting to solidify.
I was able to find *one* Air Force document referencing AFM 35-13, but I am convinced that is a typo, and the actual reference was supposed to be AFM 35-15, which is a leadership manual.
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You GottaBeKidding
Rear Admiral
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 692
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 3:35 am Post subject: |
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It has been amazing watching this unfold all day and being a small part of it. It wasn't that long ago that these documents wouldn't have been available to us all and that CBS probably would have gotten away with this fraud. Instead, hundreds or thousands of internet users with a variety of skills and knowledge were able to play off each other and bring this to a head in a hurry.
The fact that radio and TV were carrying it shortly after noon and there were longer reports and discussions in the early evening is nothing short of incredible.
Folks, we are making history. |
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