 |
SwiftVets.com
Service to Country
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
|
 Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:51 am Post subject: |
 |
|
| Nomorelies wrote: | | "Swiftboating" means getting caught with your pants down in a big fat lie. |
Or what Swiftboat means as it began last May: Swiftboat Veterans for TRUTH.
TRUTH my friends goes a long way.
_________________
The HILL Chronicles
Soldiers' Angels
"Wednesday Hero - Google It!" |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
BuffaloJack
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 1637
Location: Buffalo, New York
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
Swiftboating means to reveal the truth about something someone else has chosen to tell a whopper of a lie about, and in doing so to bust their bubble of deceit.
_________________
Swift Boats - Qui Nhon (12/69-4/70), Cat Lo (4/70-5/70), Vung Tau (5/70-12/71) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lonevoice
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 16 Sep 2004
Posts: 105
Location: OKC and God help me, stuck in Wichita now...
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| dusty wrote: | You can sure string some words together there markasass.
I especially like the line describing Kerry.
| Quote: | | the opportunistic, prevaricating, slanderous, and treasonous poseur John Kerry |
|
I agree.
On the other hand, he could have some mercy on older eyes and hit the enter button twice everyso often; kinda space it out a bit.
Not being critical, trying to be helpful 
_________________
It is a poverty to decide that a child must die so that you may live as you wish.
-Mother Teresa
If it's not a baby, you're not pregnant.
-me |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
markasass
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 131
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
lonevoice:
You are absolutely right!
Mea culpa.
I apologize and am sorry.
I promise to do better from now on.
Thank you for your feedback.
I genuinely appreciate your input.
BTW, I would like to offer the following definitions:
Swiftboating - “Honest, honorable, courageous, and noble folks telling the truth about opportunistic, prevaricating, slanderous, and/or treasonous poseurs, liberals, Leftists, moral relativists, and/or secular humanists"
Memogating - "Dishonest, dishonorable, cowardly, and ignoble folks telling lies about moral, ethical, wise, practical, good, and/or Godly patriots, conservatives, and/or Christians"
_________________
"Do all the good you can. By all the means you can. In all the ways you can. In all the places you can. To all the people you can. As long as you ever can." - Wesley |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| markasass wrote: | lonevoice:
You are absolutely right!
Mea culpa.
I apologize and am sorry.
I promise to do better from now on.
Thank you for your feedback.
I genuinely appreciate your input.
BTW, I would like to offer the following definitions:
Swiftboating - “Honest, honorable, courageous, and noble folks telling the truth about opportunistic, prevaricating, slanderous, and/or treasonous poseurs, liberals, Leftists, moral relativists, and/or secular humanists"
Memogating - "Dishonest, dishonorable, cowardly, and ignoble folks telling lies about moral, ethical, wise, practical, good, and/or Godly patriots, conservatives, and/or Christians" |
I believe you have covered it all, need I say more! 
_________________
The HILL Chronicles
Soldiers' Angels
"Wednesday Hero - Google It!" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DLI78
PO3
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 273
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
markasass:
I have to agree that your definition of "swiftboating" is a good one. I also liked the earlier post:
| Quote: | | Swiftboating- To tell the truth or to point out factual details about one who lies or misleads the public |
I think we'll have to prepare to raise money and fight a lawsuit when the inevitable dictionary comes out and defines swiftboating in negative terms.
This will be one worth fighting because it will establish the truth of what you guys did in the last election.
_________________
DLI 78
Army Linguist
1978-1986 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
markasass
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 131
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
DL178:
Perhaps we can use my rather lengthy definition as the "bloviating" one and the earlier, more concise definition that you've mentioned as the "pithy" one? LOL.
In any event, I am prepared to raise money and file a lawsuit with you if Funk & Wagnalls, Merriam-Webster, OED, Wikipedia, etc., tries to define "swiftboating" in negative terms and "memogating" in positive ones!
"Thems would be fightin' words!"
_________________
"Do all the good you can. By all the means you can. In all the ways you can. In all the places you can. To all the people you can. As long as you ever can." - Wesley |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
olympian2004
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 25 Oct 2004
Posts: 121
Location: Boulder, Colorado
|
| Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 11:41 am Post subject: Re: Swiftboating Cindi Sheehan? |
|
|
| VApatriot wrote: | The msm has reached a new low folks. They are accusing the as they call us "far right wingers" of Swiftboating Cindi Sheehan. As I see it she has done this to herself with 79% of Americans against what she is doing according to a Fox News Poll.
It is clear that the left has used Cindi Sheehan to promote their cause against the Iraqi War and President Bush. Have they succeeded in convincing Americans? NO. All they continue to do is alienate and divide our country further from our goals.
I respect all peoples right to their own opinions and observations. I support voicing those opinions and observations also. However, when the liberty of freedom of speech becomes a pivital agenda to undermine our President publicly, our troops publicly, and those that have died so we could embrace the liberty of free speech I say it is no longer free.
Our deeds, actions, words all carry consequences and if it is perceived that Cindi Sheehan is being Swiftboated oh well. Ms. Sheehan brought this on herself and when you speak out in the manner she has publically using the foul language she has knowing that perhaps young children will or would be listening she deserves all the Swiftboating she gets, right down to the end.
 |
When I saw the title of your posting I was expecting to see this column that appeared in last Sunday's edition of the New York Times by Frank Rich:
NY Times
note: URL converted to hyperlink/me#1
The Swift Boating of Cindy Sheehan
By FRANK RICH
Published: August 21, 2005
CINDY SHEEHAN couldn't have picked a more apt date to begin the vigil that ambushed a president: Aug. 6 was the fourth anniversary of that fateful 2001 Crawford vacation day when George W. Bush responded to an intelligence briefing titled "Bin Laden Determined to Attack Inside the United States" by going fishing. On this Aug. 6 the president was no less determined to shrug off bad news. Though 14 marine reservists had been killed days earlier by a roadside bomb in Haditha, his national radio address that morning made no mention of Iraq. Once again Mr. Bush was in his bubble, ensuring that he wouldn't see Ms. Sheehan coming. So it goes with a president who hasn't foreseen any of the setbacks in the war he fabricated against an enemy who did not attack inside the United States in 2001.
When these setbacks happen in Iraq itself, the administration punts. But when they happen at home, there's a game plan. Once Ms. Sheehan could no longer be ignored, the Swift Boating began. Character assassination is the Karl Rove tactic of choice, eagerly mimicked by his media surrogates, whenever the White House is confronted by a critic who challenges it on matters of war. The Swift Boating is especially vicious if the critic has more battle scars than a president who connived to serve stateside and a vice president who had "other priorities" during Vietnam.
The most prominent smear victims have been Bush political opponents with heroic Vietnam résumés: John McCain, Max Cleland, John Kerry. But the list of past targets stretches from the former counterterrorism czar Richard Clarke to Specialist Thomas Wilson, the grunt who publicly challenged Donald Rumsfeld about inadequately armored vehicles last December. The assault on the whistle-blower Joseph Wilson - the diplomat described by the first President Bush as "courageous" and "a true American hero" for confronting Saddam to save American hostages in 1991 - was so toxic it may yet send its perpetrators to jail.
True to form, the attack on Cindy Sheehan surfaced early on Fox News, where she was immediately labeled a "crackpot" by Fred Barnes. The right-wing blogosphere quickly spread tales of her divorce, her angry Republican in-laws, her supposed political flip-flops, her incendiary sloganeering and her association with known ticket-stub-carrying attendees of "Fahrenheit 9/11." Rush Limbaugh went so far as to declare that Ms. Sheehan's "story is nothing more than forged documents - there's nothing about it that's real."
But this time the Swift Boating failed, utterly, and that failure is yet another revealing historical marker in this summer's collapse of political support for the Iraq war.
When the Bush mob attacks critics like Ms. Sheehan, its highest priority is to change the subject. If we talk about Richard Clarke's character, then we stop talking about the administration's pre-9/11 inattentiveness to terrorism. If Thomas Wilson is trashed as an insubordinate plant of the "liberal media," we forget the Pentagon's abysmal failure to give our troops adequate armor (a failure that persists today, eight months after he spoke up). If we focus on Joseph Wilson's wife, we lose the big picture of how the administration twisted intelligence to gin up the threat of Saddam's nonexistent W.M.D.'s.
The hope this time was that we'd change the subject to Cindy Sheehan's "wacko" rhetoric and the opportunistic left-wing groups that have attached themselves to her like barnacles. That way we would forget about her dead son. But if much of the 24/7 media has taken the bait, much of the public has not.
The backdrops against which Ms. Sheehan stands - both that of Mr. Bush's what-me-worry vacation and that of Iraq itself - are perfectly synergistic with her message of unequal sacrifice and fruitless carnage. Her point would endure even if the messenger were shot by a gun-waving Crawford hothead or she never returned to Texas from her ailing mother's bedside or the president folded the media circus by actually meeting with her.
The public knows that what matters this time is Casey Sheehan's story, not the mother who symbolizes it. Cindy Sheehan's bashers, you'll notice, almost never tell her son's story. They are afraid to go there because this young man's life and death encapsulate not just the noble intentions of those who went to fight this war but also the hubris, incompetence and recklessness of those who gave the marching orders.
Specialist Sheehan was both literally and figuratively an Eagle Scout: a church group leader and honor student whose desire to serve his country drove him to enlist before 9/11, in 2000. He died with six other soldiers on a rescue mission in Sadr City on April 4, 2004, at the age of 24, the week after four American security workers had been mutilated in Falluja and two weeks after he arrived in Iraq. This was almost a year after the president had declared the end of "major combat operations" from the aircraft carrier Abraham Lincoln.
According to the account of the battle by John F. Burns in The Times, the insurgents who slaughtered Specialist Sheehan and his cohort were militiamen loyal to Moktada al-Sadr, the anti-American Shiite cleric. The Americans probably didn't stand a chance. As Mr. Burns reported, members of "the new Iraqi-trained police and civil defense force" abandoned their posts at checkpoints and police stations "almost as soon as the militiamen appeared with their weapons, leaving the militiamen in unchallenged control."
Yet in the month before Casey Sheehan's death, Mr. Rumsfeld typically went out of his way to inflate the size and prowess of these Iraqi security forces, claiming in successive interviews that there were "over 200,000 Iraqis that have been trained and equipped" and that they were "out on the front line taking the brunt of the violence." We'll have to wait for historians to tell us whether this and all the other Rumsfeld propaganda came about because he was lied to by subordinates or lying to himself or lying to us or some combination thereof.
As The Times reported last month, even now, more than a year later, a declassified Pentagon assessment puts the total count of Iraqi troops and police officers at 171,500, with only "a small number" able to fight insurgents without American assistance. As for Moktada al-Sadr, he remains as much a player as ever in the new "democratic" Iraq. He controls one of the larger blocs in the National Assembly. His loyalists may have been responsible for last month's apparently vengeful murder of Steven Vincent, the American freelance journalist who wrote in The Times that Mr. Sadr's followers had infiltrated Basra's politics and police force.
Casey Sheehan's death in Iraq could not be more representative of the war's mismanagement and failure, but it is hardly singular. Another mother who has journeyed to Crawford, Celeste Zappala, wrote last Sunday in New York's Daily News of how her son, Sgt. Sherwood Baker, was also killed in April 2004 - in Baghdad, where he was providing security for the Iraq Survey Group, which was charged with looking for W.M.D.'s "well beyond the admission by David Kay that they didn't exist."
As Ms. Zappala noted with rage, her son's death came only a few weeks after Mr. Bush regaled the Radio and Television Correspondents' Association banquet in Washington with a scripted comedy routine featuring photos of him pretending to look for W.M.D.'s in the Oval Office. "We'd like to know if he still finds humor in the fabrications that justified the war that killed my son," Ms. Zappala wrote. (Perhaps so: surely it was a joke that one of the emissaries Mr. Bush sent to Cindy Sheehan in Crawford was Stephen Hadley, the national security adviser who took responsibility for allowing the 16 errant words about doomsday uranium into the president's prewar State of the Union speech.)
Mr. Bush's stand-up shtick for the Beltway press corps wasn't some aberration; it was part of the White House's political plan for keeping the home front cool. America was to yuk it up, party on and spend its tax cuts heedlessly while the sacrifice of an inadequately manned all-volunteer army in Iraq was kept out of most Americans' sight and minds. This is why the Pentagon issued a directive at the start of Operation Iraqi Freedom forbidding news coverage of "deceased military personnel returning to or departing from" air bases. It's why Mr. Bush, unlike Ronald Reagan and Jimmy Carter, has not attended funeral services for the military dead. It's why January's presidential inauguration, though nominally dedicated to the troops, was a gilded $40 million jamboree at which the word Iraq was banished from the Inaugural Address.
THIS summer in Crawford, the White House went to this playbook once too often. When Mr. Bush's motorcade left a grieving mother in the dust to speed on to a fund-raiser, that was one fat-cat party too far. The strategy of fighting a war without shared national sacrifice has at last backfired, just as the strategy of Swift Boating the war's critics has reached its Waterloo before Patrick Fitzgerald's grand jury in Washington. The 24/7 cable and Web attack dogs can keep on sliming Cindy Sheehan. The president can keep trying to ration the photos of flag-draped caskets. But this White House no longer has any more control over the insurgency at home than it does over the one in Iraq.
_________________
Tony in Boulder, Colorado |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
The reason you did not see this article is because I was not aware of it. I had only heard about this on BORs show on Fox News.
Thanks for putting it up here.
_________________
The HILL Chronicles
Soldiers' Angels
"Wednesday Hero - Google It!" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kate
Admin
Joined: 14 May 2004
Posts: 1891
Location: Upstate, New York
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
are you sitting down for this one...
Susan Estrich 'swift boats' Cindy Sheehan
AUGUST 24, 2005
SusanEstrich@CreatorsSyndicate
| Quote: | Did an ABC staffer insert the following lines in an email sent by celebrity antiwar mother Cindy Sheehan?
''Am I emotional? Yes, my firstborn was murdered. Am I angry? Yes, he was killed for lies and for a Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel. My son joined the Army to protect America, not Israel." That is what Sheehan is claiming.
If you don't believe that explanation -- if you don't believe an ABC staffer set about to put anti-Semitic words into Cindy Sheehan's mouth -- then your hero, my liberal friends, is a raging, ignorant anti-Semite. Sorry, but what are you doing hanging with that crowd?
I am as sympathetic to Cindy Sheehan's loss as the next mother. When I heard of her plight, while on vacation with my own children, my heart ached. Why not simply meet with her, I thought -- and wrote, like the other liberal columnists -- instead of going on a bike ride to nowhere?
I am the last person to "swift boat" a mother who lost her son in this war. I don't blame anyone, man or woman, for being "emotional." I have certainly seen the charge used to belittle women many too many times, myself included, with less justification than in this case.
But I will not stand silent and see anti-Semitism masked as opposition to Israel and Israel blamed for George Bush's mistakes, if that's what they are. She did say this, apparently:
"What they're saying, too, is like, it's OK for Israel to have nuclear weapons. But Iran or Syria better not get nuclear weapons. ... It's OK for Israel to occupy Palestine ... for the United States to occupy Iraq, but it's not OK for Syria to be in Lebanon. They're a bunch of (expletive) hypocrites."
Anyone who cannot tell the difference, in any terms, between Israel on the one hand and Syria and Iran on the other is not someone who, as my grandmother would put it, is "good for the Jews" -- or for the country, I'd like to add.
I have been speaking to Jewish groups around the nation for the last year, and this is what I have been warning them. It will come to this: Israel will be blamed, which means Jews will be blamed.
There are some who resist these equations. They pretend they can blame Israel, the only Jewish state in the world, a state created out of the dust of 6 million Jews murdered, and say it has nothing to do with Jews. I do not believe this. I am not from the powerless generation of the Holocaust, the ones who watched the newsreels of the children on the S.S. St. Louis being turned away, because American Jews couldn't get their cousins in -- but the next one.
Go to the Holocaust Museum in Washington, and on your second visit, spend time in my favorite room, the one with the newspapers that make clear what everyone knew. My generation does politics, but we are not so powerful as to control George Bush. Hardly. More power rests in the gas tank.
It is ludicrous to suggest that Casey died for Israel, but it is worse to lionize Cindy Sheehan without confronting the anti-Semitism that seems to be accepted not even beneath the surface. If her allies really believe ABC was out to frame her, where is the investigation? Where is the staffer who could include such language? And what of the equation of Israel with Syria and Iran, a statement too foolish to debate? Why isn't anyone concerned about that?
Or, rather, why is it only the right?
There are lots of people in the middle right now, watching bad news streaming out of Iraq, watching Marine National Guardsmen who weren't supposed to be serving, much less dying, coming home in boxes. There seems to be no end in sight. Two of the first Republicans to urge the president to meet with Cindy Sheehan were both likely 2008 presidential contenders, Chuck Hagel and George Allen.
Symbols matter. For better or for worse, they help to define movements.
If the "antiwar movement" in America is defined, even remotely, as an anti-Israel movement, it will fail. That is certain to me.
If I believed in conspiracy theories, I'd think that the right would like nothing better than to have Cindy Sheehan lead it for just that reason.
They might be laughing all the way to the bank about the embrace of her by the so-called liberal media.
To tell the truth, it's just what I'm afraid of. |
what's the world coming to....
I agree with something Estrich said
found the link to this on a freeper thread
one of the freepers definition:
"Swift boat," when used as a verb, means getting the truth to the public without the aid of old media.
_________________
.
one of..... We The People |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mtboone
Founder
Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 470
Location: Kansas City, MO.
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 2:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
Swiftboating" means getting caught with your pants down in a big fat lie.
Then Clinton with Monica was a Swiftie with the blue dress on.
_________________
Terry Boone PCF 90
Qui Nhon 68-69 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dusty
Admiral
Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1264
Location: East Texas
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
And there I was thinking Susan Estrich could only flap her gums. Looky here, she can string several words together on paper and form sentences too.
I'm almost impressed.
That she would be moved to speak against the darling of the left sorta freaks me out though.
What could have got into the gal? You know, I think I see.
Let me think now, how do you spell that word? Jelous... Jeelous... Jealose.
I know it couldn't be that she is actually concerned Cindy is hurting the 'cause'. Susan barely knows what the 'cause' is from day to day.
_________________
Left and Wrong are the opposite of Right! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LewWaters
Admin
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 4042
Location: Washington State
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 6:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
At least Susan Estrich sounded reasonably sober on Sean Hannity today. 
I just emailed her to inform her that "Swift Boating" is actually an honorable thing done to dishonorable people, for the betterment of society.
_________________
Clark County Conservative |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
markasass
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 131
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 7:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| LewWaters wrote: | At least Susan Estrich sounded reasonably sober on Sean Hannity today.
I just emailed her to inform her that "Swift Boating" is actually an honorable thing done to dishonorable people, for the betterment of society. |
I did the same thing. I also informed her that the opposite or antonym of "Swiftboating" is "Memogating"; that is, "a dishonorable thing done to honorable people, to the detriment of society" or "getting lies to the public with the aid of the old leftstream media" or "doing something which results in getting caught with your pants down in a big fat lie".
We need to continue to proactively fight the old leftstream media's attempt to attach a negative connotation to "Swiftboating" as part of their ignoble, unpatriotic, and duplicitous efforts to stigmatize the honest and honorable Swiftees.
_________________
"Do all the good you can. By all the means you can. In all the ways you can. In all the places you can. To all the people you can. As long as you ever can." - Wesley |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Navy_Navy_Navy
Admin
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
|
| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| markasass wrote: | | I also informed her that the opposite or antonym of "Swiftboating" is "Memogating"; that is, "a dishonorable thing done to honorable people, to the detriment of society" |
Right ON! Way to go, both of you!
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
