SwiftVets.com

Michael B. Smith · Seaman Recruit Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 24

We had NOBODY to talk to - the VVAW and others in the "anti-war" movement had poisoned American minds for years - with the willing support of the MSM.

I certainly believe you (I have no reason to not) but it seems so strange that America could have gotten like that. But - I guess concerning this issue - much hasn't changed.
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Michael B. Smith

air_vet · PO2 Joined: 08 Aug 2004 Posts: 374

rb325th · Admiral Joined: 21 Aug 2004 Posts: 1334

Michael, just asking about the MOS because it sounded funny to me. O5B sounded more like an Officer Designation for an MOS not anything related to Commo.That and I spent a couple years working in a Recruting Company and had a pretty good graps on MOS Designations, must have changed before I enlisted. No big deal, you learn something new everyday.
As to the subject you have posted here, listen to the Vietnam Vets here, they are not lying to you. They are not running for office and have no need to impress you or lie to you.
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U.S. Army 1983-1995, 11C1P/11H2P NBTDT

Michael B. Smith · Seaman Recruit Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 24

Michael B. Smith · Seaman Recruit Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 24

DADESID · Seaman Joined: 07 Jul 2004 Posts: 157

>>>MCCLOSKEY: Well, I‘ll tell you, we ran across General Patton‘s son, a colonel, who was flying around in a helicopter man collecting ears of Viet Cong, cutting off ears, shooting at them with his pistol out of a helicopter. But that was the exception.
Most of the men served honorably.<<<

Major General G. S. Patton III passed away just a few weeks ago. He held the Distinguished Service Cross with an Oak Leaf Cluster.

Why is McCloskey making these charges now, after General Patton can't respond in his own defense?

Go figure.....

sixdogteam · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 11:20 pm Post subject:

Yes, atrocities occured, they occur in all wars, on all sides. But they are rare, and when they do occur, in many cases they are reported. I know. And if some Viet Nam vets got drunk and told you some war stories, what of it? Did you expect them to tell you about boring days when nothing happened but rain and 150% humidity, and they were constipated? Or maybe they were just trying to give you the benefit of their experiences. Odds are the majority of them didn't tell you anything at all about what happened to them...
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HHC 212th CAB MMAF RVN '70-'71

four-niner delta · Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 11:29 pm Post subject:

Remember the old saying- "Combat in Vietnam was usually days of extreme boredom and seconds of the most horrendous terror and confusion." That is what combat truly is-why do you think they call it the Fog of War. I know it was for me!
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Gary Armitstead
Burbank, CA
U.S. Army Vietnam 1966-67 Mekong Delta
Mobile Riverine Force
A Co. 3/60 9th INF DIV

PO2 · Ensign Joined: 14 Aug 2004 Posts: 67 Location: TX USA

bagpiper · Seaman Recruit Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Posts: 44

Michael,
How many people go around bragging and talking about Hellish stuff?
They are the ones I term The UnVets. There are also the sickos. Michael, haven't you seen, people, who love the violence?, thrive on it?, escpecially if you're winning the battle? There were some of those, who loved the killing. I'm afraid, as with any war, the first casualty is TRUTH. That applies when you come home too. The 'stories' just get better in 'The Tellin'...kinda like fishin.... Smile

I agree with a previous poster, anytime you hear this stuff, think, what did your mama tell you?
Mine told me: "Don't beleive anything you hear, and half of what you see."

A lesson I have taken to heart.

I was in Vietnam, but not a grunt, thank GOD! But, I took the same abuse as them when I got home, I got spit on in San Fransisco Airport by a bunch of dirty hippies. I decked the SOB. HE got arrested, the cops saw everything. They just told me to 'catch my plane'. They enjoyed arresting his a**.
Now, there's a WAR STORY for ya!

DM Lambert
ex-SP4 '72-'75

PO2 · Ensign Joined: 14 Aug 2004 Posts: 67 Location: TX USA

[quote="Michael B. Smith"]

PO2 · Ensign Joined: 14 Aug 2004 Posts: 67 Location: TX USA

Colorado Coasty · Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:53 am Post subject: Were they all lying?

I am a Viet Nam era veteran who served in the Coast Guard stateside. I have known men from every branch of the service. I have served under Coasties who served in Nam. Not one atrocity story ... ever! We know bad things happen in war. The press is all over the prison situation in Iraq, but never talks about the extraordinary lengths our military goes to prevent these types of things. John Kerry lied, and in doing so he slandered every Viet Nam veteran.

dmroyer · Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:59 am Post subject:

As Viet Nam soldiers we were the first to return home and have to defend ourselves from the very people, we were fighting for. No time in our history has the American soldier been spit on and generally degraded for doing their duty, by the American people. No we weren’t willing or wanting to talk about what we had seen or what had happened in Viet Nam. To many people had already made up their minds as to what the true story was, (1) it was the first war to be experienced on the TV every night in everyone’s living room, (and we know the news media always shows the true story, right), (2) Hanoi John and Jane for sure had the true story and they told everyone just what is was, (3) the politicians had received a lot of grief about the war and so they knew the true story of being reelected, take it out on the military, (4) many of us didn’t want to talk about what we saw, I was in a medical unit and believe me I don’t want to talk about what I saw, war is gruesome, bloody, full of fear and fright so why would we want to talk about it and many wouldn’t understand if you tried to explain, for they already knew the truth. War is an atrocity unto itself filled with unspeakable acts of terror and heroism all at the same time.

It wasn’t the war that the media, Hanoi John & Jane and the politicians put down and tried to destroy it was the American service men and woman who were there doing their duty and that is one of the reasons there is so much resentment by the Viet Nam veterans. We have been discriminated against for over 35 years so yes we may be a little touchy when once again our honor and integrity is again brought in to question, one more time.

John Kerry has made Viet Nam an issue and as was stated earlier the Viet Nam veterans will not back away again, he cannot have it both ways, in or out Mr. Kerry and I vote out.

FireDog53 · Ensign Joined: 18 Aug 2004 Posts: 55 Location: Detroit

Micheal,

What you must realize is that atrocities happen in every war. If there were a percentage assigned to it, it would be in the area of .5% to 1% probably committed atrocities. I personally didn't see any and the commanders I had would have had someone in the stockade quicker than crap goes through a goose. As other's have stated, there are many people that have exaggerated their experiences in Viet Nam. As one individual mentioned earlier that this was kind of common with what we reffered to as REMF's. Almost every combat vet I've met rarely if ever talked much about the war. It tends to be something that stays beneath the surface. When we did talk with each other about our experiences, you could tell while talking if an individual had been in combat.

Kerry chose to come home and turn his back on the veterans and active personnel at the time of his involvement with the VVAW. Most that testified in The Winter Soldier Investigation were proven later to be non-veterans and non-combat veterans. Kerry chose to be a leader in an organiztion that made blanket statements in relation to combat personnel committing war crimes. He was out of line and telling many fabrications at that time, just as he is doing now.

As for the 05B, it was an Army MOS. I was an RTO( Radio Operator-05B) during my tour with the 25th Infantry (5 months) and with MACV Advisory Team 64 in Chou Doc Province. When I served with MACV, I was assigned to an ARVN infantry Batt. and also worked with Regional Forces and Provincal Forces. We almost soley did night ambushes. I spent 11 months with MACV and never even heard of atrocities committed by U.S. Military personnel from the Vietnamese themselves. Had there been, I have no doubt that the Vietnamese I worked with would have stated it.

Kerry has brought this on himself and after 30+ years we are fighting back this time. We refuse to stay silent anymore on the accusations made by Hanoi John, Hanoi Jane and the rest of the misfits who chose to attack not only our HONOR but our INTEGRITY and BROTHERHOOD. Remember what others here have told you about people who talk a good story but rarely if ever lived the story. This whole thing has brought many of us back to a time I think most of us wish were sometimes forgotten. It won't be forgotten inside ourselves but Kerry has again brought it to the forefront as center piece of his campaign and WE are fighting back, the silence has ended.

Mark Wilson
RVN 10-70 to 2-72
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Viet Nam vet and PROUD!