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IpsoFacto
Seaman
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 163
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 Posted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| Well, at least one Hispanic Media outlet is echoing this news http://antesdelfin.com/ |
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jrsdad
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 118
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| Posted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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I just caught the Kerry campaign's response to the inquiry into Kerry's awards:
| Quote: | | "The facts are clear," Kerry adviser Michael Meehan told the Telegraph. "The Navy awarded John Kerry the Silver Star, a Bronze Star with Combat V and three Purple Hearts. This is a waste of taxpayers' dollars and the Pentagon's time, especially during wartime." |
Funny, I don't recall worries about expenses during wartime from the Kerry campaign when it was calling for an investigation as to the presumed destruction of Bush's records a few months past... |
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minnie presley
Commander
Joined: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 307
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2004 12:22 am Post subject: hackworth |
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| Am I reading this site right, is hackworth a supporter of kerry's I am shocked,he of all I thought would be upset, since he beleives you must earn medals |
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jrsdad
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 118
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2004 2:14 am Post subject: Re: hackworth |
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| minnie presley wrote: | | Am I reading this site right, is hackworth a supporter of kerry's I am shocked,he of all I thought would be upset, since he beleives you must earn medals |
Apparently. I don't know the reason, although I believe he is critical of Bush and Iraq.
Your post pushed me to write him. I know, fat lot of good it will do...
| Quote: | Sir,
I understand that you are quite critical of the efforts of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. I don't know you well enough to know where you are coming from - whether it's a dislike of Bush, a friendship with Kerry, or simply a failure to understand the chrages made by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.
I am a Democrat, was too young to serve in Vietnam (18 on the day Nixon announced complete withdrawal), and followed a career that started with the ministry and has gone in many directions since.
No one honors veterans more than I do. My uncle took a slug from a Japanese machine gun assaulting Iwo Jima. My father, with only one eye and too young to fight, stood long hours watching the skies with the Civil Air patrol. My father-in-law fought the Japanese on the Philippines. My brothers fought Muslim relbels and Communist guerillas in the Philippines.
When I first heard of Kerry's service, I assumed he had served honorably and earned every medal. When the allegations first arose from the Swift Vets, I started researching their claims. I pored over every record Kerry has released on his site. I read the various Kerry biographies. I read his quotes over the years, and the statements of his supporters and detractors. I am a researcher by trade these days, and had to educate myself on many matters military.
I assume you believe that a soldier should earn the medals he wears. I have seen you state that the Navy's system is under attack. In part that it true, because Kerry's Silver Star was not vetted through the channels. It was an impact award, awarded 2 days after the action for which Kerry wrote the spot report (he was OinC of the op). It has gone through 2 rewrites over 20 years, getting more valorous each time. The original conditions have been dropped. If Kerry had just lost it, the citation would not have been redrafted. Kerry takes credit for actions performed by Bill Rood (who has come to Kerry's defense lately). He ignores the fact that he carried a boatload of infantry. Rood has confirmed that they discussed the beaching maneuver the night before, something Kerry has denied. Two other participants in that conversation report that it was a tactic deigned to earn medals.
The Kerry campaign has all but admitted he did not deserve his first Purple Heart. In that action, all the facts (aside from Kerry's testimony) indicate that there was no enemy fire and he wounded himself by firing a M-79 grenade too close to the Boston whaler. No after action report was filed because no enemy fire was taken. LTCMDR Grant Hibbard, Kerry's operations commander, refused Kerry's request at the time for a PH. When Hibbard and all who had witnessed the incident rotated stateside, Kerry apparently applied for the PH again, and it was granted. When Dr. Letson, the only medical officer at Kerry's base, made a statement concerning his treatment of Kerry, the Kerry campaign denied that he had treated Kerry (calling the retired physician a "so-called 'doctor'") and pointed out that the medical treatment form (which they will not release) was signed by HFC J. C. Carreon. Unfortunately, Hospitalman First Class Carreon was not a medical officer, and thus if the wound was so slight it only required his treatment as the Kerry campaign insists, it did not qualify for a Purple Heart.
Kerry conflates two incidents to garner his third PH. He has admitted, and James Rassmann (the Green Beret Kerry pulled from the river) has agreed, that Kerry's wound in his butt came from an incident earlier in the day when Kerry had thrown grenades (presumably percussion, which the Swifts carried) into a bin of rice. In the after action report it is deemed to have come from hitting a mine (or RPG or missile, depending on the version), when Kerry's own journal disproves this. The only injury Kerry sustained when the PCF-3 hit a mine was a "contusion (minor)" on his arm. A bruise under combat is not sufficient for a PH, from my reading of the regulations.
The facts and Kerry's statements demonstrate that he did not qualify for two of his three Purple Hearts. I consider this an award only lower than the CMH, and believe it should be treated with honor for those who receive wounds requiring treatment by a medical officer. I have to agree with the submitting officer, William Elliott, when he states that had he known the true occurances on 28 February 1969 he would not have recommended Kerry for the Silver Star.
In one early column of yours on the controversy you state that the affidavits of the 60+ Swift veterans would not be admissable as evidence. I'm afraid that is not true. Even Dr. Letson's hearsay evidence (that enlisted men with Kerry stated that he had wounded himself with splash from his own round) would probably be admissable under the medical treatment hearsay exception or the excited utterance exception. Eye witness statements are always admissable. Many of these officers served right next to Kerry - not 300 yards away as you suggest. They generally patrolled within 100 feet of each other. In the case of the Bronze Star (Rassmann) incident, the boats skippered by Swift vets against Kerry were actually idled in the ambush zone for longer than Kerry - but while Kerry's report stated they were taking heavy fire from both banks for 5000 meters, there was not a single bullet injury or bullet damage to any of the boats, in a river that was 75 yards wide. The first aid and stabalization of the PCF-3 to under-tow took 1 1/2 hours... and no bullet damage or wounds. You know how the VC pulled am ambust - trigger the mine, fire a few shots, and fade away before the boats could react with their .50s and .30s and mortars. The events as Kerry describes them simply do not work in this case. All of the physical evidence is against him.
Perhaps you just don't like Bush and want to believe in Kerry. perhaps you are defensive because you think a soldier's honor is being attacked unfairly. I ask you this - if Kerry did steal his valor, if he gamed the system and procured medals he did not merit - doesn't that do more to cheapen the honors and attack the traditions?
You once learned that you had listed awards you had not earned. As a man of honor you immediately correct that.
You wrote, ""It is simply unthinkable an experienced officer would wear decorations he is not entitled to, awards that others bled for. There is no greater disgrace." Does that standard hold true for John F. Kerry as well as Admiral Boorda and Colonel Hackworth?
Randy *****
El Cerrito, CA |
Here was Hack's reply:
| Quote: | Sadly, you have not done your homework.
I am not a Kerry fan but he did serve heroically in Vietnam when millions of others hid. Hack |
To which I responded:
| Quote: | Colonel,
Actually, I have spent three weeks full time researching the issue. I have read and analyzed every piece of documentation posted on the Kerry web site, as well as his biographies and the released portions of his journals in the Boston Globe. I have read every statement of Kerry and his supporters I could locate. In addition, I have read the materials from the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. I have researched the statutes and regulations governing the awarding of medals and the revision of citations. I have studied maps and pictures from a variety of sources. I have read unit histories for the Swifts and other riverine patrol units. I have asked questions of sailors who served on PBRs and SWIFTs. I respectfully submit that I have a greater knowledge of the case than you do, who obviously cannot devote that much time to the issue.
Perhaps we make a distinction between serving honorably and meriting all of his medals. I believe that Kerry served honorably. From his own words, he did not volunteer for combat, but many who join "safe" units end up on the sharp end. I simply think that since he is running for CinC based upon his medals, he needs to defend those. If he were running on his Senate record, or his business experience, he would have to defend those, too.
For example, his Bronze Star was awarded for picking up LT Rassmann from the water, yet Jack Chenowith received no medals for pulling others from the same river back at the ambush site who had been blown off the PCF-3. It was what they routinely did, in a maneuver called "retrieving Oscar" in training. Simply rely on your experience - could 5 boats (one disabled and sinking) have withstood 1 1/2 hours of hostile SA and AW fire from both banks of a 75-foot-wide river and not have any bullet damage or injuries? How many VC would it have taken to mount a 5000 meter ambush as Kerry reported? Was there a battalion of VC in the area?
The Kerry campaign has admitted that the 2 December 1968 wound was self-inflicted. This does not in and of itself disqualify him from a Purple Heart, but a self-inflicted wound in the absence of enemy fire due to negligence does not meet the qualifications. You are a champion of only wearing awards you have earned, and have openly questioned dubious awards of others. I have to wonder whether your judgment here is influenced by feelings for Kerry and Bush.
I would love to see Kerry provide the spot report documenting enemy fire on 2 December 1968 to justify his Purple Heart, or the application months later for the award after it was turned down by LTCMDR Grant Hibbard. The fact that this is missing and no explanation is given by the campaign should make even the strongest Kerry partisan with military experience uncertain.
Don't confuse my concern over Kerry's awards with an attempt to discredit his serving honorably and under fire. I merely question his awards, which so many others have bled and died for, and many more gave all without earning.
And thank you for your service, sir. Without the warriors there would be no freedom. |
And he surprised me with a follow-up:
| Quote: | Amen on your last sentence.
Having spent just two days on Swiftboats when they were under my OPCON, all I can say it that every swinging Richard who thus served are heroes.. Including Kerry..
I am a reg Indy. Hack |
I found myself in disagreement with the positions of Col. Hackworth about a year ago when he was prominently featured as a talking head. I admire and honor him for his service. I think he is wrong about Kerry -- I think he sees it as people who never got over the war and people attacking the honor of someone who served. I think f he truly understood, if he had a chance to sit down with O'Neill or Hoffmann for an hour, he would change his mind. When two honors he was claiming turned out to be undeserved due to a military snafu he immediately disclaimed them. |
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