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azpatriot
Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 593
Location: Arizona
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 Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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| You GottaBeKidding wrote: | My guess is that the "original" was printed on plain copy paper.
More musings on the centering thing. If the typewriter had a memory, in theory you could type the text to be centered into memory and then the typewriter would position the text properly.
However, the alignment would not exactly match the Word document. |
It probably was printed on plain copy paper, thats what I use at home, but guess what I've found from time to time when scanning something in that I had printed, a watermark. Agreed not all paper companies watermark their stock, some only watermark their more expensive stock, but others watermark everything. I've even found watermarks on some of the generic recycled paper stock. If I had Acrobat I would extract them myself but I don't and I have evaled the product once already and it is expired so reinstalling the program will be of no use. I do feel that this is something that sould be checked though becuase we know they were STUPID enough to try it in the first place 
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TEWSPilot
Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 1235
Location: Kansas (Transplanted Texan)
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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CBS'S BIG BLUNDER?
Like Kerry in Cambodia and Tom Harkin in Vietnam, Ben Barnes is another liar recalling something that didn't happen.
Note this statement -- | Quote: | ... I thought on Wednesday that it was scandalous for "60 Minutes" to turn over a good deal of its time on Wednesday night to one Ben Barnes, a one-time Texas political powerhouse who now claims he got George W. Bush into the National Guard.
The problem is not, as some would have it, that Barnes has raised half a million dollars for Kerry. The problem is that Barnes has already lied about this on videotape, and I use the word "lied" without difficulty, where he says he pulled strings for Bush when "I was lieutenant governor of Texas."
The thing is that George W. Bush was sworn into the National Guard in May 1968. Ben Barnes didn't become lieutenant governor until 1969.
From the lies of Ben Barnes to the apparent forgeries of who-knows-who-did-it ? why has "60 Minutes" exposed itself in this way?
We all know why. Its producers and others in the media think George Bush deserves to be beaten up now because of the beating administered to John Kerry in August. In some weird way, the editors and producers believe this is fairness at work.
Instead, they have unmasked themselves. Or rather, they have been unmasked by ordinary people who can see what they and their hired experts evidently could not. |
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For those who don't know why GW Bush would be flying a T-33 and making multiple landings, the T-33 was much cheaper to fly and was universally used for training, especially for approaches and landings. Most Air (later changed to Aerospace) Defense Command (ADC) bases had one or more T-Birds for just that purpose and for cross countries, etc. The F-102 and its difficulties have already been addressed earlier, so 'nuf sed about that. There are articles and posts all over the blogosphere explaining that GW Bush was taken off flying status because ADC and the Air Guard units that supported it were getting rid of the F-102 and it was NOT cost effective to send him through a new aircraft Field Training Detachment with so little time left on his committment -- I KNOW because I was supporting them as a Pilot in the 4650th Combat Support Squadron, Richards Gebaur AFB, KC MO, at the time. Funny, I was there at the same time John Kerry and the VVAW were plotting to kill MY Senator, John Tower, and six others. Back on subject....
HEY, the "th" in 4650th didn't superscript, just like it isn't superscripted in the letterhead on my old orders and memos from the 4650th! I guess you have to do that yourself...he he he.
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Interested
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 37
Location: PA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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| azpatriot wrote: |
Also here's another one that we can check on ( I just thought of this morning ). Someone that has Acrobat that can open the pdf file and extract the scaned image needs to so that a negative of the image can be made so we can see if there is a "watermark" on the paper that was used.
If the paper that was used had a watermark on it that "image" would have been caught when the document was scanned.
If we find a watermark then we can learn quit a bit by just that alone as to dating the document and very possibly to where it may have come from! |
no luck...I downloaded all 4 PDFs from the CBS site...extracted a 'tiff' file from them (better image quality than a jpg) and looked...
1st I made them a negative image...then I boosted the contrast +80-85 points. then played with the brightness to get as much info up as possible - somewhere about +8-15 points.
no watermark or other identifying mark on any of the four memos is visible.
what I will say though is that wrinkling of the paper shows up across the full width of the image, this is especially visible in the May 4 memo.
I see this as significant as the memo as formatted matches a modern reproduction exactly, and is centered within the margins of the image - it does not appear to have any edge or line where a 8x10 or smaller than current letter standard piece of paper would have been. If the original thinner document had been stretched to fit an 8-1/2" page the text would have not matched in aspect with the new MSWord repro. If it was not stretched some line of the original edge of page should have shown? plus the document would not remain centered on the new page width.
on the may 4 memo the dots/marks do stop clear of the edge though...wonder why. |
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Hondo
LCDR
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 423
Location: USA
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MJB
LCDR
Joined: 14 Aug 2004
Posts: 425
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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Clicking on the first one - you're right! Wondered what happened to that guy  
I do think Ace's post caused a longer, more sustained period of laughter.
Wish I'd been clever enough to think of anything like these guys....
MJB
USAF '85-'92 |
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BC
PO3
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 288
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Interested wrote: | | no luck...I downloaded all 4 PDFs from the CBS site...extracted a 'tiff' file from them (better image quality than a jpg) and looked... |
If you have a program that can do it, look and see if there is an electronic watermark. Who knows as stupid as they have been so far it might be there.
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Interested
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 37
Location: PA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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there is no useful metadata or other info in the 1 augustt 1972 memo that I can see
don't have time to check any others right now. |
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Paul R.
PO3
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 273
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Even if you're not a Rush fan, he (Rush) is laying down some pretty good salvo's at CBS / MSM this morning. Mostly not about the forgery aspect. He's being careful to say "alleged forgeries". He's concentrating more at the moment on Barnes & Rather's connections with the Kerry campaign. I didn't know about the Rather connections -- anybody have more on this?
Maybe this should be a new thread, but I figured the most people would see it here...
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lrb111
Captain
Joined: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 508
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Interested"] | azpatriot wrote: |
on the may 4 memo the dots/marks do stop clear of the edge though...wonder why. |
Because the entire image was manipulated in a Photoshop-like program. It' s a picture of a doc. that was then distressed.
The reason the marks don't go to the bottom edge is they forgot to eliminate the bottom margin. So, it didn't print down there. They should have set the margins to go for the full "edge bleed".
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well, when even the DNC can see it,,,,, then kerry is toast. |
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Nomorelies
Vice Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 977
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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Question: Is there a law against forging military documents?
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Hammer2
PO2
Joined: 30 Aug 2004
Posts: 387
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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I opened the MFR of 1 August 1972 in Adobe Acrobat Professional. There are no comments, signatures, review history or identity of the author information in it. The only thing shown is the date & time of creation 9/8/2004 8:07:04pm, Date & Time modified 9/8/2004 8:07:39pm, and the application that created it Acrobat 5.0 Image Conversion Plug-in for Windows.
They don't want to leave any fingerprints.
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Rdtf
CNO
Joined: 13 May 2004
Posts: 2209
Location: BUSHville
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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hysterical how Druge has this - gotta see it - I couldn't copy and paste and duplicate it so click the link. - note the 'th' 
http://www.drudgereport.com/ |
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dcornutt
PO3
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 267
Location: Brooklyn, NY
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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| BC wrote: | | Interested wrote: | | no luck...I downloaded all 4 PDFs from the CBS site...extracted a 'tiff' file from them (better image quality than a jpg) and looked... |
If you have a program that can do it, look and see if there is an electronic watermark. Who knows as stupid as they have been so far it might be there. |
I opened the PDF in Photoshop, rastered it at high res (EPS).
I then inverted it (ie..reversed b/w). Then used levels to bring out the texture of the paper.
It shows all the finger marks, wrinkles, etc. It also brings the text out much clearer. But, no watermark |
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azpatriot
Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 593
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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Well at least we know theirs no watermark, to bad that could have lead to the source.
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Proud to be an American! and member of the PAJAMAHADEEN
FedEx Kinko's: When it absolutely, positively has to be forged overnight
Last edited by azpatriot on Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Nomorelies
Vice Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 977
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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Dan Rather has to be a complete idiot if he thinks he can stonewall this. The documents are fraudulent. The democratic party and Ben Barnes are behind the forged document and no amount of spinning can stop this thing from going ballistic. It is the Atomic Bomb for CBS and Dan Rather is up to his ears in the dirty tricks. He attended a democratic rally in Texas last year for his daughter in the very same county that Ben Barnes is a poilitical leader. Was thils little trick cooked up at the political rally with Dan Rather and Ben Barnes. The democrats have once again tripped over their egocentric pseudintellect. They actually think they are too smart for the common man to figure out. The parent company of CBS, Viacom, has launched story after story bashing Bush this year. The publishing arm has produced book after Bush-Bashing book this year. This has been a politicla hatchet job like the world has never seen and CBS is part of the heart and soul of the movement. Dan is dead meat. His career will forever be defined by FORGERYGATE
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