SwiftVets.com

[jbelman]

Watched the debate last night, and was struck by this Kerry response to the Lehrer question about sending troops into harm’s way:

[Shane's PopPop]

I am sure that Kerry served with somebody that did'nt make it back. So in a sense he is only stretching the truth.
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[Nigel Brooks]

He actually said " I understand what the president is talking about, because I know what it means to lose people in combat."

Given the fact that he never says anything you can actually pin him down
on - it is difficult to really figure out what he meant. But you take it in
the context of his other statements in the debate where he spoke of serving in Vietnam and the lessons he learned - it is perfectly reasonable to assume that "I know what it means to lose people in combat" meant he actually had people either under his command who were killed or he served in the same unit at the same time others were killed. I think it is reasonable to assume he was not speaking of the Gridley but of the second of his "two tours"

Using the timeline which is on his website
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/service_timeline.html

and the casualty data base for the period he was in country
http://www.no-quarter.org/gui/advresults.php

I came up with the following:

His first month was in training at Cam Ranh Bay, and he was assigned to
- Khanh Hoa and Ninh Thuan Provinces - there were no US Navy KIA's during the November 17, 1968 through January 31, 1969 period in those two provinces.

There were casualties in April in An Xuyen Province when three Navy
personnel were killed in the same incident (Droz, Holloway, and
Worthington) - the incident occurred on April 12, 1969 and involved
personnel whom Kerry had served with in Coastal Division 11. Droz commanded PDF-43 during the action which gave rise to Kerry's Silver Star.

If Kerry is referring to the deaths of Droz, Holloway and Worthington as
being the "I know what it means to lose people in combat" - he wasn't even in Vietnam then. He reported for duty at the Brooklyn Navy Yard the day before on April 11, 1969.

It seems to me - that if indeed he had lost people under his command - or if there were people killed during the actions which he has posted on his website - he would have mentioned it. I've looked but cannot find any
reference to Kerry being involved in actions where US personnel were killed.

The only conclusion that can be made - given his other exaggerations - is
that once again he has lied.

[odonovanj]

I have researched this to the best of my ability and can not find a reference to Kerry having a KIA on his boat.
With 29 years in the Corps I have met and worked with and for a lot of Combat leaders who have had men die in their units. It is very personal and never leaves one's conciousness. The feelings of responsibilty that leader has for putting a soldier, sailor, airman or Marine at risk and then having them become a casualty is an terrible one.
I have never been in combat, I have served in combat service support and had casualties in my units of an accidental nature and suicides, those are bad enough.
If he mislead about this, it is again a claim of a wannabe, a claim of "me too" by a wannabee who is trying to measure up to a standard that no leader in his right mind ever wants to be measure against.
It gets to his character, as a leader and as a person who will say whatever it takes.
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John A O'Donovan, Col USMC ret

[mtboone]

The only one that possible during Kerry's time was Gerald Horrell but he was on the 71 boat. I believe he is mainly refering to Ltjg. Donald Droz who he was close to. Droz's daughter made the documentary "Be Good, Smile Pretty" and on her website under the photo site you can see a picture of them together. http://www.orphansofwar.org/index.html
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Terry Boone PCF 90
Qui Nhon 68-69