SwiftVets.com

[stupson]

Swift Boat Vets Should 'Shut Up,' Says Kerry Spokesman
Marc Morano, CNSNews.com
Friday, Oct. 1, 2004

Coral Gables, Florida -- A former Navy crewmate and supporter of Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry says it is time to "let the dead rest." He demanded that the Vietnam veterans who are questioning Kerry's military service and anti-war activism "shut up."

Del Sandusky, one of Kerry's naval crewmates in Vietnam who was present during the actions that led to the Kerry's Silver Star, Bronze Star and two of his three Purple Hearts, made his remarks about the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth immediately following Thursday night's debate between President George W. Bush and Sen. Kerry at the University of Miami. Sandusky served as one of Kerry's official spokesmen following the debate. "Let the dead rest, we have got to talk about the issues. Let those guys (Swift Boat veterans opposed to Kerry) go sit in a corner, you know, shut up," Sandusky told CNSNews.com.

Sandusky called the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth "a Republican smear tactic."

"All of the claims and all of the TV ads were proven false. America ain't listening to them anymore. They are just a crock of lies," Sandusky said.

CNSNews.com asked Sandusky if he could sympathize with the anger that many former Vietnam prisoners of war harbor against Kerry because of his behavior when he returned home from the war. Some communist North Vietnamese prison guards used Kerry's 1971 testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee to torment American POWs.

Sandusky responded, "Sure I can understand it -- right. But it doesn't matter if John Kerry made that [1971 speech] or not, they (the POWs) were still going to be tortured. They were prisoners of war."

John O'Neill, the co-author of Unfit for Command: Swift Boat Veterans Speak Out Against John Kerry, said Sandusky's comments were consistent with the treatment all Vietnam veterans have received from Kerry.

"Sandusky's comments reflect the arrogance of Kerry's campaign. Instead of an apology, the answer is simply an additional insult to POWs and Vietnam veterans - to say 'shut up' about it," O'Neill told CNSNews.com Thursday night shortly after Sandusky made his remarks.

"The truth is we are talking about a fellow (Kerry) who may become the commander in chief in the near future. The fact that he made these accusations of atrocities that were used to torture our servicemen in North Vietnam and that they were total lies about the people serving in North Vietnam should disqualify him from being commander in chief," O'Neill said.

Kerry told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee in 1971 about the testimony of more than 150 Vietnam veterans, who had "testified to war crimes committed in Southeast Asia..."

Those Vietnam veterans, Kerry said, admitted they "had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam..."

"It is important that there is no apology forthcoming from Kerry," O'Neill said. "He stands by his [atrocity] remarks that we were the army of Genghis Khan, and presumably he take no responsibly for the use of his own remarks to torture our troops."

Senator John McCain (R-Ariz.), who was also present in "spin alley" following the debate, blasted the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth for broaching the topic of Kerry's performance in combat.

"I do not and will never question anyone's conduct in combat. Now what [Kerry] did after the war or at any other time, that is fine. But in combat, it's dishonorable and disgraceful," McCain told CNSNews.com.

When asked if he has forgiven Kerry for making atrocity allegations against Vietnam soldiers, McCain, a former Vietnam POW, replied that it isn't a matter of forgiveness.

"I worked together with [Kerry], trying to heal the wounds of the Vietnam War. And the worst thing we have done to the American people in this campaign is to reopen them. And the people who suffer more for that than anybody are the Vietnam veterans, and I think it's disgraceful," McCain said.

But O'Neill countered that "Kerry is the one who opened up Vietnam wounds." "He opened the wounds initially by accusing us of being war criminals and reopened them with his 2004 book Tour of Duty (written by Douglass Brinkley)," O'Neill said.

"That book repeated the same [atrocity] allegations just six months ago. And he is the one who inserted Vietnam in the campaign just a month and half ago at the Democratic convention," O'Neill explained.

"Under the circumstances, to not allow the people he's falsely accused of criminal conduct to respond makes no sense at all," he added.

Former Democratic presidential candidate General Wesley Clark said Kerry's anti-war activism in the 1970s was designed to "help" U.S. soldiers serving in Vietnam and revealed the candidate's "moral courage."

"He was trying to help the men and women in the United States Army and help the United States by having the courage to go and testify in front of Congress," Clark said.

"So I can understand why people might have misunderstood John Kerry at the time. But that was 30 years ago," he added.

Former Georgia Democratic Senator and Vietnam veteran Max Cleland said that voters need to "forget about Vietnam."

"This is not about John Kerry's Vietnam 35 years ago, this is about the Vietnam that George Bush has created in Iraq where we are losing young men and women every day," Cleland told CNSNews.com.

"I agree with John Kerry 35 years ago. I agree with him now, and those of us band of brothers out there have been traveling around this country [supporting Kerry] for a long time," Cleland added.

[Dwight Callaway]

Mr. Sandusky needs to be exposed and taken down for his own corruption. Note to admin-- The Swiftees are making a huge mistake giving "Sanctuary" to the Kerry loyalists. This is not about "who they are supporting for President". It is rather about a conspiracy of lies and fraud that they entered into, seduced by John Kerry, in Vietnam in 68 and 69.

It is this simple: In the event and action that LT(jg) Kerry fraudulently got himself a Silver Star, he also fraudulently got Del Sandusky a TOTALLY UNDESESERVED BRONZE STAR. From that point on Sandusky was bought off.

If memory serves and you guys will know the details, one or two other current Kerry defenders got Bronze Stars and the rest got Navy Commendation Medals. ALL UNDESERVED because the action reports were fraudulent, exaggerated, etc.

And then in Vietnam and all the years since, Kerry has had many other opportunities to keep these guys corrupt, bought off, etc.

The only way that the Swift Vet story makes total sense and perfect logic is when you explain WHY the crewmembers that support Kerry would be lieing. What is their motive?

I repeat, it is a huge mistake to give them sanctuary. Knock it off. Do we want to win or do we want to continue to "play nice" with everybody but Kerry?

In the Vietnam War, we lost because we gave the enemy sanctuary. We are doing the same thing now with Sandusky and his kind.
_________________
We have the Government and the Institutions that we deserve. If you want better government then YOU want to be a better citizen.

[LewWaters]

[blue9t3]

Lew, thats a big "no s--tter. Im going there now-thanks Dwight.
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MOPAR-BUYER

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

Sandusky's story belongs here. There's a duplicate topic, much longer, in the main forum.

Here's one of Kerry's BOB, telling 270+ Swifts to just "shut up"... that only they three or four on the Kerry campaign have a right to speak up. Yet another attempt by the Kerry Kampf to stifle his opposition.

Sandusky has turned his back on all but three or four of his shipmates in able to support Kerry, publically.

It says a lot more negative about the Kerry Kampf than it could begin to say about Swifts. And it also brings up questions - questions that might be better off asked in public.

What's behind this support for someone that he served with for (at most) two months? It was more than a Bronze Star that held this dysfunctional twosome together through the years.

In telling us to "knock it off," you are, in effect, attempting to stifle us just as the Kerry Kampf is doing.

We are not "allowing the enemy sanctuary" when we discuss what's coming from the other side. We are encouraging conversation out in the open and allowing visitors to see all the debunking, all the arguments pro and con.

It's always good to know what the other side is up to.
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[Cam Ranh '71]

RE: Stup's post above.

The whole post upsets me.
Tell Sandusky to "shove it"!
I feel Sen McCain is in bed with Kerry. McCain is definitely anti Swift Boat Vets. Says they are disgraceful and dishonorable! Well Screw him".

MAYBE MCCAIN & KERRY HAVE RECONCILED [KISS ASS AND MADE UP], BUT 3 MILLION OTHER VIETNAM VETS HAVE NOT! McCain could not give a SH*T about us. He's just plain selfish and arrogant.

McCain's contacts:

Wash DC: 202-224-2235
Phoenix: 602-952-2410
Web site: mccain.senate.gov
Email: Web Form @
[http://congress.org]

Kerry's contacts:

Wash DC 202-224-2742
Boston: 617-565-8518
Website: kerry.senate.gov

Campaign: [http://www.johnkerry.com]
DD 214 http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/jkmilservice/dd214.pdf]

CS
_________________
Kerry
"Haughty French looking Massachusett's Democrat who by the way served in Vietnam"
[J Taranto WSJ

Remember: "Thinking is the best way to travel!"

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

Yeah, I can't imagine where McCain is coming from on this. Sandusky, I understand. McCain, though - he's a puzzle, to say the least.

Good Lord, is he going to disparage Stolen Honor, too? These were men who had experiences as bad as his and worse in those camps!
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[cgc]

Del has earned the right and privledge to tell us to shut up. Doesn't bother me a bit. His convictions and freedom to choose his candidate for President are something we all fought for. He believes strongly in his choice for President and is neither being 'bought off' nor is he anything other than a guy who is speaking his mind.

cgc Swift Boat Crew 6C, 68-69, An Toi , Danang.

[Redleg]

Del Sandusky does have the right to express his views, but we don't have to like them. As a supporter of John Kerry, Mr. Sandusky is probably extremely fustrated by the success of the Swifty ads. Many of these same supporters because of the effectiveness of the ads, would like to see the 'Nam and post 'Nam go away. (At least for the remainder of the presidential canpaign)

I don't see Senator McCain as any type of supporter of John Kerry. But McCain does have a posture of playing the middle ground and as not to publically disrespect the military service of John Kerry, as George Bush does not, is currently good politics for them.
Unlike some of us, John McCain has most probably put Vietnam far behind himself and has moved on in his life. I would think that most successful politicans would better view the world in the future than in the past.
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FIRE MISSION: Kerry campaign in line of sight.

[AMOS]

The fact that Sandusky and others feel the need to speak out so harshly has to tell us the Swift ads are working.

I'm not a Swift Vet, but behind them 100%, and if Dildo Del thinks he can help me "shutup", he's certainly welcome to give it a try.

[LewWaters]

I feel the best thing we can do is show Sandusky our support for his freedom of speech by exercising our own

Whether he is sincere or bought matters little. Just because he says shut up doesn't mean we have to. His words just bounce off my ears and I will continue speaking out and supporting the SBVT any way I can.
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Clark County Conservative

[DanVCC]

"All of the claims and all of the TV ads were proven false. America ain't listening to them anymore. They are just a crock of lies," Sandusky said.

All of Sandusky's contentions and demands are based on that statement. He needs to come forward with proof of the TV ads being false. Short of that, he has nothing to say.
Cleland is a lightweight with a lifetime of nothing positive.
McCain, as mentioned above, staddles the middle of everything.

[Hondo]

What I'd like to tell Del Sandusky would get me banned from this board.
_________________
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks nothing worth a war, is worse."
-- John Stuart Mill

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

Not banned, probably - but edited, maybe?

In deference to the man's service and history of problems, let's just say he's not coming across very well for the campaign he's representing, okay?

But what he's most recently said fits the pattern of the whole campaign... suppress the opposing vote, suppress the voice of the Swifts in their ads, suppress the publication of UFC.... what are they so afraid of?
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[Cam Ranh '71]

Hondo said,
The critical choice is not "war or peace".
The critical choice is "freedom or tyranny".
Preserving freedom sometimes requires war.
Peace at any price implies acceptance of tyranny

I like that, is it origional, or whose quote?
Nice bio Hondo, real cute.

Amos,
"Dildo Del", where did that come from?

Navy_Navy,
Suppression of vote? Isn't the PC word "Disenfranchise"? Something Floridians do every four years!? [Sorry Florida].

CS
_________________
Kerry
"Haughty French looking Massachusett's Democrat who by the way served in Vietnam"
[J Taranto WSJ

Remember: "Thinking is the best way to travel!"