SwiftVets.com

[Keith]

Can you imagine Kerry, during the Revolutionary War: "We had no right to attack the British troops. This colony was the legal territory of the British Empire and this illegal war has become a quagmire." And of course his wife would need to chime in "No blood for tea. People who follow Washington instead of my husband are ********".

Then after the war, Kerry would say "I would have done everything differently then Washington, and that's why I should be president. It is not fair to say that we would still be a colony if I had my way. We absolutely might have been free if I had been in charge.

But I would have waited until all of the nations of the world joined us in our fight. First we should have waited for economic sanctions to work though. You have to give these things time.

I would have executed the war better, in that, I would have spent more time throwing tea into the harbor, I would not have violated the conventions of war but would have had our troops properly uniformed and lined up face to face with the British, and I would have conducted a more sensitive war.

I never said freedom wasn't a good thing, but there is the right way and the wrong way, and Washington always takes the wrong way. That's why I should be the first president of the United Colonies of the British Empire."


Keith
http://thinkinboutstuff.netfirms.com/

[buffman]

The difference between a true leader and a talker. I hope he gets beat Tuesday so he can rest on the trashpile of history and fade away into oblivion!
_________________
Never Ever Give Up
America First

[MJB]

[BuffaloJack]

If this had been the Revolutionary war or any war up to and including WWII they would have dealt with Mr. Kerry the way they dealt with all collaborators and this site would be unnecessary.
_________________
Swift Boats - Qui Nhon (12/69-4/70), Cat Lo (4/70-5/70), Vung Tau (5/70-12/71)

[Geano]

Kerry never had the Revolutionary War in any correct perspective...He's been twisting things to suit him since day one.

I'm reviving again one of my first posts- Here 'tis:

Kerry's Testimony link: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1097982/posts

“We call this investigation the "Winter Soldier Investigation." The term "Winter Soldier" is a play on words of Thomas Paine in 1776 when he spoke of the Sunshine Patriot and summertime soldiers who deserted at Valley Forge because the going was rough.” —John Forbes Kerry, April 22, 1971 (immediately after he lists the “war crimes” of United States military personnel)

First of all, Mr. Kerry, Washington and his guys weren’t at Valley Forge in December 1776….
THAT was the winter of 1777-1778… In December 1776, Washington’s troops wound up encamped about 10 miles north of Trenton NJ, on the Pennsylvania side of the Delaware River, about 25-35 miles northeast of what became Valley Forge.

Secondly, Mr. Kerry, there is no mention of desertion in the referenced thesis.
http://www.ushistory.org/paine/crisis/c-01.htm

Paine wrote the first of his “Crisis” series on December 23, 1776 following “our retreat to the Delaware”, (resulting in the above encampment) and in no way did Paine refer to any deserters. He was lambasting Tories and “their mean Principles” “Every Tory is a coward; for servile, slavish, self-interested fear is the foundation of Toryism; and a man under such influence, though he may be cruel, never can be brave.” He says of such individuals: “ Your conduct is an invitation to the enemy, yet not one in a thousand of you has heart enough to join him.”

Paine, in fact, has nothing but praise for the officers and men who were involved in the redeployment of the Fort Lee Garrison under threat of British General Howe’s far superior force, which appeared to be rolling in from the coast. “…suffice it for the present to say, that both officers and men, though greatly harassed and fatigued, frequently without rest, covering, or provision, the inevitable consequences of a long retreat, bore it with a manly and martial spirit. All their wishes centred (sic) in one, which was, that the country would turn out and help them to drive the enemy back.”

Paine was, however:
1. Very likely making a very strong “re-enlistment” argument, since large portions of Washington’s militia were near the end of their “enlistments” (December 31st, for many), and they were hired militia, not enlisted or conscripted troops.

2. Addressing “those who have nobly stood, and are yet determined to stand the matter out: I call not upon a few, but upon all: not on this state or that state, but on every state: up and help us; lay your shoulders to the wheel; better have too much force than too little, when so great an object is at stake. Let it be told to the future world, that in the depth of winter, when nothing but hope and virtue could survive, that the city and the country, alarmed at one common danger, came forth to meet and to repulse it.”

Thirdly, Mr. Kerry, those last mentioned above are likely the “Winter Soldiers” Paine was calling upon…to use your invented phrase…:

Not those persons who fail to recognize that "There are cases which cannot be overdone (conquered) by language, and this is one.” Not those persons “who see not the full extent of the evil which threatens them; they solace themselves with hopes that the enemy, if he succeed, will be merciful.” Not those who cry "Well! Give me peace in my day." Not to those who would “…give up their arms, they would fall an easy prey…”

Finally Mr. Kerry, Thomas Paine would write 3 more “Crisis” essays before the Valley Forge Winter… http://www.ushistory.org/paine/crisis/index.htm. Since YOU brought Paine into discussion in 1971, let us throw this at you, even though you never openly declared yourself a subject of any other country:

In “The Crisis: PHILADELPHIA, April 19, 1777” Thomas Paine writes:

"Here is the touchstone to try men by. He that is not a supporter of the "independent States of America in the same degree that his religious and political principles would suffer him to support the government of any other country, of which he called himself a subject, is, in the American sense of the word, A TORY; and the instant that he endeavors to bring his toryism into practice, he becomes A TRAITOR.” …

“It is unnatural and impolitic to admit men who would root up our independence to have any share in our legislation, either as electors or representatives; because the support of our independence rests, in a great measure, on the vigor and purity of our public bodies. Would Britain, even in time of peace, much less in war, suffer an election to be carried by men who professed themselves to be not her subjects, or allow such to sit in Parliament? Certainly not. “

“But there are a certain species of Tories with whom conscience or principle has nothing to do, and who are so from avarice only.” … “And shall disaffection only be rewarded with security?” … “And though the scheme be fraught with every character of folly, yet, so long as he supposes, that by doing nothing materially criminal against America on one part, and by expressing his private disapprobation against independence, as palliative with the enemy, on the other part, he stands in a safe line between both…”

“These men, ashamed to own the sordid cause from whence their disaffection springs, add thereby meanness to meanness, by endeavoring to shelter themselves under the mask of hypocrisy; that is, they had rather be thought to be Tories from some kind of principle, than Tories by having no principle at all.…”(Thomas Paine “The Crisis: Philadelphia April 19, 1777)

And is such a person to lead us through the current war on terrorism…does such a person actually have our economic and social instincts at the forefront?

"Yet it is folly to argue against determined hardness; eloquence may strike the ear, and the language of sorrow draw forth the tear of compassion, but nothing can reach the heart that is steeled with prejudice.” (Thomas Paine “The Crisis”- December 23, 1776)
_________________
MSM Lead Nov 3 2004 "Kerry Oval Office Hopes killed by 10,000 Mice..."
Candidate had declared mice "only a nuisance".
States they "moved too Swiftly"....

[GM Strong]

I had an ancestor that was in the encampment of 1776 after they crossed the Delaware in Christmas eve. If Mr. Kerry wishes to read it, there is an apt description of the event and their fortitude in the National Archives in his Pension claim file. To answer the previous, Messr Kerry probably would have joined the French Navy so he could have claimed to be present at Yorktown. His Pal Jimmuh would have been would have been negotiating peace with the King and seeking International peacekeeping forces to prepare for the establishement of Mr. Nobel's peace prize.
_________________
8th Army Korea 68-69

[Keith]