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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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 Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 3:14 am Post subject: THE MCCAIN GRAHAM AMENDMENT |
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THE MCCAIN GRAHAM AMENDMENT!!!
I am seeing red!!!
Only nine Republican Senators voted against this trash.
This is an insult to our great military They do not need this amendment.
They already investigate any supposed "abuse" and prosecute if it is proven. This is just side-show on the part of Senators to show how 'high-minded' they are. Grrrr! POMPOUS IDIOTS!! SPINELESS WIMPS!!
| Quote: | Senate Adds Anti-torture Language To Spending Bill
BY JOSEPH L. GALLOWAY AND JAMES KUHNHENN
Knight Ridder Newspapers
WASHINGTON - (KRT) - The Senate delivered a stern rebuke to the Bush administration Wednesday night, adding language banning U.S. torture of military prisoners to a $440 billion military spending bill in defiance of a White House threat to veto the whole bill if the anti-torture language was attached.
The Republican-majority Senate followed the lead of maverick Sens. John McCain, R-Ariz., and Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., voting 90-9 to add the anti-torture language to the legislation.
Former Secretary of State Colin Powell, a retired Army general, joined 28 other retired senior military officers in endorsing the McCain-Graham amendment.
Their measure would ban the use of "cruel, inhuman or degrading" treatment of any prisoner in the hands of the United States. It's a response to the revelations of torture by U.S. personnel of Iraqi detainees at Abu Ghraib prison in Baghdad, which roused worldwide disgust.
McCain, who was a prisoner of war tortured by his North Vietnamese captors during the Vietnam War, cited a letter written to him recently by Army Capt. Ian Fishback asking Congress to do justice to men and women in uniform.
"Give them clear standards of conduct that reflect the ideals they risk their lives for," Fishback wrote the senator.
"We owe it to them," McCain said on the Senate floor. "We threw out the rules that our soldiers had trained on and replaced them with a confusing and constantly changing array of standards. ... We demanded intelligence without ever clearly telling our troops what was permitted and what was forbidden."
Graham, a former judge advocate in the Air National Guard, said: "We take this moral high ground to make sure that if our people fall into enemy hands, we'll have the moral force to say, `You have got to treat them right.' If you don't practice what you preach, nobody listens."
However, even if the Senate passes the spending bill with the anti-torture language included, both face an uncertain future. The House of Representatives already has passed a similar bill without any anti-torture language.
Before any legislation could go to President Bush to be vetoed or signed into law, negotiators from the House and Senate must iron out a single version in a conference committee. The Bush administration's preferences often prevail in such conference committees, often insisted upon by House Republicans.
Last week the White House sent the Senate a "statement of administration policy" that declared strong opposition to the anti-torture language on the grounds that it would tie the president's hands in the war on terrorism. The statement said that if the anti-torture terms remained in the bill's final version, "the president's senior advisers would recommend that he veto the bill."
Bush has never vetoed any legislation. Vetoing a big military spending bill during wartime would be highly unusual if not unprecedented.
McCain said his amendment merely codifies current policy and reaffirms what was assumed to be the law for years. It would require that all U.S. troops - and other federal agencies, such as the CIA - adhere to the standards for interrogation of prisoners outlined in the Army Field Manual on detention and interrogation.
Opposition to McCain and Graham was led by Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., as well as members of the Senate Intelligence Committee, the National Security Council staff and White House lobbyists. Frist ultimately voted for the amendment.
Sen. Ted Stevens, R-Alaska, a World War II fighter pilot, argued that the amendment would force U.S. troops to relinquish control of prisoners and turn custody over to foreign troops. He said that would prevent "our people from taking the leadership."
The battle on Capitol Hill came in the wake of a federal court order to the Pentagon requiring the release of more photographs of American soldiers mistreating Iraqi detainees in Abu Ghraib prison. The latest photos reportedly are even more disturbing than those released last year, which led to the courts-martial and the convictions of nine low-ranking enlisted Army Reserve soldiers.
Powell - who served two tours in combat in Vietnam and later was chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff during the 1991 war against Iraq - said in a letter to McCain: "Our troops need to hear from the Congress, which has an obligation to speak to such matters. ... I also believe the world will note that America is making a clear statement with respect to the expected future behavior of our soldiers."
Powell added that the Senate action "will help deal with the terrible public diplomacy crisis created by Abu Ghraib."
McCain said he doesn't mourn the loss of any terrorist's life. But the former Navy pilot said he does regret and mourn "what we lose ... when by official policy or by official negligence we allow, confuse or encourage our soldiers to forget that best sense of ourselves ... that we are different and better than our enemies, that we fight for an idea, not a tribe, not a land, not a king, not a twisted interpretation of an ancient religion ..."
He added that American troops must know that they can never forget that they are Americans and "we are obliged to make clear to them that they need not risk their or their country's honor to prevail; that they are always, always ... always Americans, and different, better and stronger than those who would destroy us."
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To see the text of retired Gen. Colin Powell's letter, go to www.krwashington.com |
http://www.macon.com/mld/macon/news/politics/12826734.htm
These are the NINE with a SPINE who voted No:
Allard (R-CO)
Bond (R-MO)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Roberts (R-KS)
Sessions (R-AL)
Stevens (R-AK)
A couple of months ago I thought highly of George Allen for President in 08 but if he can support this insult to our military, he just lost me!!
I intend to support ONLY these nine for their reelection. The other 46 spineless Republicans can pound sand.
_________________
“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776)
Last edited by shawa on Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:42 am; edited 1 time in total |
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I B Squidly
Vice Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 879
Location: Cactus Patch
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:58 am Post subject: withdrawn |
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withdrawn
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"KILL ALL THE LAWYERS!"
-Wlm Shakespeare |
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rparrott21
Master Chief Petty Officer
Joined: 19 Aug 2004
Posts: 760
Location: Mckinney, Texas
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| Take steriods and your most likely to get life in prison...set off a nuke in the USA and you get milk and cookies.. |
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GM Strong
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 1579
Location: Penna
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| Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2005 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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The McCain caucus needs to be nuked. If Graham thinks his being Capt McQueeg's sidekick is going to get him anywhere, he better think again. His constituents are getting fed up and the base in Arizona is disgusted with McCain. These two are the Burt and Ernie of politics. SHeesshh!
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8th Army Korea 68-69 |
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Marine4life
Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined: 14 May 2004
Posts: 591
Location: California
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| Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 5:33 am Post subject: |
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GM, I was thinking Lilo and Stitch. This is sad. I hope it is Vetoed, Bush needs to put a spine back in the GOP.
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Helicopter Marine Attack Squadron 169 which is now HMLA-169. They added Huey's to compliment the Cobra effectiveness. When I served we just had Snakes. |
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homesteader
PO3
Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 294
Location: wisconsin
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| Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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This is a classic example of why we need Line-Item-Veto authority for the President. The chances that we will ever see it are slim because neither Congress or Presidents want to lose the ability to be against things while knowing they will pass.
In this case the Administration can huff and puff about how bad the amendment is but had to let it pass in order to get the larger defense spending bill. There is nothing as sanctimonious as a lawmaker opposing something he knows is quaranteed to pass.......Example: Senator Feingold and the Patriot Act. He trumpets his lonely vote against it as a badge of honor while knowing that something significant was done in the effort to combat domestic terrorism. When it works and prevents attacks, no one remembers his vote. If it fails he can pontificate about his wisdom in opposing it.
Last edited by homesteader on Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:00 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Me#1You#10
Site Admin
Joined: 06 May 2004
Posts: 6503
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| Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Yet another argument for congressional term limits...NOW. |
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GM Strong
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 1579
Location: Penna
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| Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| homesteader wrote: | | This is a classic example of why we need Line-Item-Veto authority for the President. The chances that we will ever see it are slim because neither Congress or Presidents want to lose the ability to be against things while knowing they will pass. |
As I recall we had a line-item-veto from the 'Contract with America'. It was promptly challenged in the courts and declared unconstutional by the SCOTUS in 1998. It apparently was determined we needed an Amendment. Stevens of all people actually stated he couldn't find it in the Constitution. Clinton used it 87 times.
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8th Army Korea 68-69 |
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dusty
Admiral
Joined: 27 Aug 2004
Posts: 1264
Location: East Texas
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| Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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This calls to mind the television show '24' from this last season where terrorists were planning to set off a nuke in the US.
On the tv show McCain's rules of decorum were not followed when the terrorist was finally captured and made to talk. Seems I remember gunshots to the knees.
So what would the nice senator McCain do in that situation, serve him tea and ask politely for the information about where the bomb was and allow some American city to be blown to bits?
I got news for everybody, the only fair fight is in a boxing ring. And if they are comparing getting some guys naked and taking their pictures with cutting off heads and dragging bodies through the streets then someone has their heads somewhere the sun doesn't shine.
Get real McCain.
dusty
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Left and Wrong are the opposite of Right! |
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GM Strong
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 18 Sep 2004
Posts: 1579
Location: Penna
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| Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:27 am Post subject: |
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It's time for McCain to talk straight. He hasn't and is full of bloviating BS. He is a media sycophant and a pet of the the Liberals. I'm sick of his backstabbing. '08 'No McCain - No Way'
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8th Army Korea 68-69 |
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blue9t3
Admiral
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 1246
Location: oregon
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| Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2005 3:20 am Post subject: |
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[quote="GM Strong"]It's time for McCain to talk straight. He hasn't and is full of bloviating BS. He is a media sycophant and a pet of the the Liberals. I'm sick of his backstabbing. '08 'No McCain - No Way'[/quote]
Wait, think about it? Yes way, Bills wife and McPain in 08, who would want more bill? he allowed 911 and she approved of it, her career was worth the sacrafice so bill could get his library albiet triple xxx rated! 
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