SwiftVets.com

katiesda · Seaman Recruit Joined: 02 Jul 2006 Posts: 1

This was posted on another forum I frequent and I am looking for information I can use to respond.

Attacks on John Kerry Discredited

QUOTE
The cold and undisputed truth is that Vice Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, Commander Naval Forces Vietnam, personally selected the Silver Star award for Kerry and personally pinned the Silver Star on Kerry's chest at a ceremony at our Coastal Division 11 base in An Thoi, South Vietnam just days after the action. A decoration, like every other award for heroism, that was recommended by his Division Officer and endorsed by then Captain Roy L. Hoffmann. According to Zumwalt, he actually wanted to give Kerry an even higher award, the Navy Cross, but decided upon a Silver Star because he wished to make the award as expeditiously as possible. These points were publicly reiterated by Admiral Zumwalt in 1996, in defense of Kerry's military record.

Undaunted by the word of one of the most revered naval commanders of any era, the Swift Boat Veterans for truth, and others without principle, continue to attack Kerry's medal with talk of “a Silver Star with a V for valor listed [in Kerry's records] that the Navy stated it had never awarded” and supposedly suspicious multiple copies of medal citations reissued to Kerry in the Reagan era and bearing the signature of then-Navy Secretary John Lehman who some quote as having said he “denied ever signing them.” What Lehman actually said, was that he did not remember signing them. Big difference, if one is interested in accuracy and the truth.

While getting my wife's car serviced, I just read this in a July issue of US News and World Report, but I can't seem to find that issue on line so I'll post this from which the report may well have emanated.

Skimming the Skimmer.

[quote]Oh, by the way, regarding Kerry's Silver Star, Virginia Senator John Warner recently publicly acknowledged the legitimacy of that medal. Warner was the Secretary of the Navy at the time Kerry was awarded the Silver Star). As Warner stated: "I went to the Pentagon in February 1969 and was there for five years in the Navy secretariat," Warner recalls. "I remember when his Silver Star came through," he adds. "I went back and checked for accuracy, and it was accurate." I will not be surprised if those dedicated themselves to the destruction of John Kerry, allege that Senator Warner, a respected American patriot, is part of the vast conspiracy to cover-up for John Kerry.[/url]

Thanks for any info.

Bob

Navy_Navy_Navy · Admin Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 5777

Well, you've come to the right place. We've had some extremely interesting discussions about nearly every conceivable facet of John Kerry's infamous career right here on this forum.

Your best bet is to start with the Research forum - one particular thread summarizes the infomation from many previous threads regarding Kerry's Navy time: http://www.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=19110

Other threads cover the particulars of the various awards.

The two articles that you've cited are full of inaccuracies - beginning with the title of the first one - exactly what claims made by the Swifts do they think have been "discredited?" Would be rather easy (and much more credible) to simply list those "discredited" charges right there in the body of the article, no?

Instead, they tear down straw men. Rolling Eyes

Not one claim in Unfit For Command has been discredited to this day.

It will be easy for you to shoot down these half-baked essays with a minimum of effort.

Welcome to the boards,
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

Me#1You#10 · Site Admin Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 6503

Navy wife · Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:20 am Post subject:

katiesda,

I understand your frustration, for I would love to post something in response to the goading going on over there. However, I agree with me#1you#10, and I note that no one has posted a reply on that site since June 27th so maybe people are fed up with the Kerry supporters and their taunting with vicious little enuendos--especially the mysterious entity calling itself "matchpoint." Do a Google search on "Matchpoint Kerry" and you can see how this entity is spreading the same garbage on other blogs!

I see that now they have taken up a campaign to discredit Tom Lipscomb. This is probably part of a plan to set up a scenario where they can "prove" that the Swiftboat Vets were discredited by discrediting Tom.

I personally think he is an extraordinary journalist and is very brave to go up against the Kerry machine.

Well, sorry folks! I've vented enough for one night!

fortdixlover

Me#1You#10 · Site Admin Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 6503

Gary Hellrung · Seaman Recruit Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 2

I am not a member of swift vets.

I went to message board and saw above thread.

As I could not log in, I am e-mailing to note, and give a heads up, regarding an item in NewsMax.

August 2006, page 48, by Susan Estrich

"Kerry is 'Un-Gore ' and 'Un-Hillary'"

Fourth paragraph starts " He is finally addressing the Swift Boat lies....."

and the piece goes on (and on) including "...he and his team have been fighting back, lie by lie."

I believe someone, more knowledgeable than myself, should write and inform the editors Senator Kerry has not disproved any of the Swift Boat Veteran's claims nor ever signed a release of his Navy records.

addendum: I tried unsucessufully all three e-mail addresses listed on the home page, then registered for Swift Vets to send this heads up. As I noted I am not a Swift Vet but did serve in the Army in Viet Nam 70-71.
I share your organization's disdain of Senator Kerry.

Me#1You#10 · Site Admin Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 6503

Gary Hellrung · Seaman Recruit Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 2

Bat Mann:
I am not an expert on this , however, the article you link to disputes but does not refute the claims.

In my opinion, there is a circular recurring argument presented. In summary, it appears to me that the swift boat vets claim Kerry's awards and citations were not warrented, possibly trumphed up, possibly by Kerry himself. Kerry refuses to sign a release of all his records. The Kerry camp then state the offical records refute the swift boat vets. Or as you stated, Therlow (sp?)lied. However, since Kerry will not sign a release, the only offical records aparently available are the texts of the disputed awards and citations. The article does not seem to be able to assign authorship for the texts of the awards etc. I can not see how the text of the very awards being disputed can be used to "prove" that the testimony of the swift boat vets false. And as Therlow (sp?) would not have written, and may have not have even read his own citatation text submitted at that time, he would not be likly to be aware of, much less correct any inaccuracies, which would have seemed minor at that time.

rbshirley · Founder Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 394

Me#1You#10 · Site Admin Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 6503

Deuce · Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 10:26 pm Post subject:

Me#1,
I like your fix...
In the Estrich article, her attempt to make sKerry appear to be moving to the center by relating him to our great statesman Nixon:

Stevie · Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:21 am Post subject:

is someone claiming Warner is NOT part of the cover up for Kerry?

I'm not...

why would I doubt that he is part of it? He was in there in a meeting (w/ Frist) a few yrs ago - when many of us were calling there....

he knows the truth but isn't telling it.

I don't trust people like that. I don't even like them.

I think he was more concerned that Kerry might win the election and he might get offered a cabinet seat ...
_________________
Stevie
Congressmen who willfully take actions during wartime that damage
morale and undermine the military are saboteurs and should
be arrested, exiled or hanged.

fortdixlover