SwiftVets.com

Willie Koczynski · Seaman Recruit Joined: 15 Sep 2004 Posts: 3

How Kerry beat the system for PH #1 has yet to be established. UFC doesn't address how. In support of Hubbard and Schachte is Kerry's own website. No spot or after action report for PH #1, but spot or after action reports for PH #2 and PH #3. Looking at awards presentations from NSA Saigon #1, #2, and #3 are already in proper sequence. What's interesting is the rubber stamp "chop" date in the upper right corner of each. #1 wound date 2 Dec. 68 is chopped 28 Feb 69 almost 3 months later. #2 wound date 20 Feb 69 is chopped 5 Mar 69 @ 2 weeks later. #3 wound date `13 Mar 69 is chopped 17 Apr 69 @ 1 month later. I would start looking in An Thoi. PH #1 from NSA Saigon shows no copy to ONE THREE (Cat Lo), to me ruling them out as a source. The copy to ONE FOUR might be because medical assistance was provided there.
A couple of simple scenarios. Simple scenario number one is Kerry probably knowing most players with real knowledge of PH #1 incident had left country, especially Tedd Peck, breezed into Adim and asked what happened to his Purple Heart. Check of medical records appears to confirm Purple Heart earned and trouble to confirm by-passed. Simple scenario number two is when PH #2 took place Kerry might have said this is actually PH #2 I still haven't received PH #1. To advoid a paperwork nightmare #1 and #2 might have gone off together. Presently the media and DNC can rely on a he said she said posture for PH #1. If someone with knowledge of how Kerry worked the system comes forward, even without documentation, Kerry's hand might be forced. Yes, the media and DNC can again cry he said she said, but if signing Form 180 can be thought to clear-up the accusation and enough SIGN FORM 180 signs show up at Kerry appearances the public will have to think what is he hiding. Kerry can simply sign Form 180 which the swifties asked for in the first place. Doesn't help if he signs Form 180 the second week of November.

Willie Koczynski

RiflemanDD730 · Seaman Apprentice Joined: 21 Aug 2004 Posts: 96

To Willie Koczynski

You may be on to something. Zumwalt was trying to build morale by giving medals. His troops were in frequent actions. He was pressed for time. He reportedly called in Kerry while Kerry was in Saigon on a 2 day R&R. They apparently flew back to Kerry's base together for the awards ceremony.

I posted this scenario previously in a discussion involving actions on 20 Feb and 28 Feb and the basis for the decorations for Kerry and his crew awarded on Mar 6. The edit refers to a news article discussed in that thread.

Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:35 pm Post subject: Going After Kerry's 2nd Purple Heart
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Possible scenario.

The medals in the picture represent those from 28 Feb plus one purple heart from 2 Dec for Kerry. The medals from 20 Feb are not yet processed. The media story starts out with the 20 Feb and 28 Feb actions but the 20 Feb part is edited out for brevity.

Zumwalt wants to pump up morale. The 28 Feb action looks like an opportunity to hand out medals more so than the 20th. He calls in Kerry while he's in Saigon and lets him know he caught the brass ring(Silver Star). Kerry, still steaming over having no purple heart from 2 Dec casually lets Zumwalt know that A PH is "in the works" from 2 Dec and wouldn't it be nice alongside a SS? Zumwalt tells his staff to make it happen fast and don't worry about the PH paperwork(the missing after action report) Kerry says its "in the works".

Summary: Kerry and crew get 28 Feb medals(with 20 Feb in process), and Kerry gets a PH only on the basis of a casualty report. The "in the works" action report of course doesn't exist.

Willie Koczynski · Seaman Recruit Joined: 15 Sep 2004 Posts: 3

To RiflemanDD730

I was unaware of the awards ceremony on 6 Mar for Silver Star. I couldn't find the picture on the boat but believe Kerry had both a Silver Star and a Purple Heart. I didn't know about Kerry going to Saigon and coming back with Adm Zumwalt. If Adm Zumwalt flew to An Thoi to present medals you can be sure a good group of Swifties were present whether they wanted to be or not. When the citations were read much would have been revealed. Was the Purple Heart for 2 Dec or 20 Feb or actually both at the same time. If it was for 2 Dec that would have been attention getting. If it was for 20 Feb and called Gold Star for second award again an attention getter. The Swifties should have be able to nail down if Purple Heart #1 originated in An Thoi by now.
Back to chop dates for Purple Heart #1 and #2. Kerry's word as an Officer and a Gentlemen would not be questioned in Saigon, especially if he was about to receive a Silver Star. The following scenario hinges on What was said at the awards ceremony and the swifties eliminating An Thoi as the source of paperwork for Purple Heart #1.
Scenario: Kerry brings up Purple Hearts in Saigon. They are going to chop Purple Heart for 20 Feb on 5 Mar in time for awards ceremony on 6 Mar. Kerry says it is actually his second so to keep paperwork correct both #1 and #2 are typed up. No time for message traffic so just get on HF transceiver and call An Thoi to confirm medical record for wound on 2Dec. If both chopped on 5 Mar would look weird so just spin rubber stamp to 28 Feb for Purple Heart #1. OK we trust Kerry, right? Sign form 180, sign form 180, SIGN FORM 180! The debates are coming soon the mass media is already calling the swifties old news.

Willie Koczynski

cipher · Vice Admiral Joined: 10 Aug 2004 Posts: 902

There was no SPOT report and no AAR because there WAS NO ACTION. If nothing happens, no report.

That was made pretty clear by the OIC of the boat in a statement he made about the events. Of course, he's a retired rear admiral and his word doesn't hold up against two enlisted guys who claim he wasn't there.

The whole incident reeks, and there isn't much in the way of supporting paper because NOTHING happened worth wasting ink on.
_________________
USMC 69-72, 7th Comm, 3rd MarDiv, FMFPAC
US Army 75-79, 97th Sig, SHAPE, NATO
Arkansas National Guard 79
Defense contractor for US Navy, SSPO, SP-20, SP-24, OP-12 84-92

ASPB · Posted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 9:43 pm Post subject:

The date of the award letter for PH1 was February 28, 1969. The date of the award letter for PH2 was March 6 1969.
_________________

On Sale! Order in lots of 100 now at velero@rcn.com Free for the cost of shipping All profits (if any, especially now) go to Swiftvets. The author of "Sink Kerry Swiftly" ---ASPB

Willie Koczynski · Seaman Recruit Joined: 15 Sep 2004 Posts: 3

Hello ASBP

I was going by the rubber stamp in upper right corner of citations from Kerry's website. Since there isn't any other date on them I assumed that was NSA Saigon's chop date not when they were given to him. 28 FEB he was on the river for Silver Star action and 5 Mar he might have been in Saigon. You mention 6 MAR for Purple Heart #2 award. Since they are not in message format I again assumed they probably went to An Thoi by guard mail or as sometimes happened, anybody going that way. From Rifleman DD730 above he received medals on 6 MAR. Is that what the rubber stamped dates really mean?

Willie Koczynski