SwiftVets.com

[Scott]

[waltjones]

I didn't see one reader response that favored Kerry. Here's mine:

Mr. Rassman - Your sincerity would be much more believable if your prose did not sound like a collection of DNC talking points. Specifically, you say "some Republican-funded Swift Boat vets". Some? 254 signed the open letter stating that Kerry is unfit; more than 60 give eyewitness testimony in Unfit For Command. Indeed, your version of events is at odds with at least 5 other eyewitnesses. How do you explain that? Was it the "fog of war"? Hey, I've been there (19 months, USMC) - when there's a lot of noise and confusion, it's easy to think you're taking a lot more fire than you really are. There are many other instances in the book where multiple eyewitnness accounts differ from Kerry's fiction. It's nice to see you defend someone who pulled you out of the water, but I'm afraid your version of the event just doesn't add up. Thanks for your service and Semper Fi! Walt Jones
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Walt Jones (USMC, '65 - '69) It says much about the person who defends a man with no honor.

[rds]

I believe during the primary campaign Mr. Rassmann said he was on a boat which hit a mine causing him to be thrown into the water. In the WSJ article there are 2 mines and he is thrown into the water from Kerry's boat. Please forgive me if this has been posted before.

[d19thdoc]

Truthseeker:
This is all fascinating stuff, but I don't think you will ever find absolute answers. I have a lot of experience researching my own Vietnam experience, including National Archives and National Personnel Records Center access, lots of official documents, lots of photos, and innumerable interviews on the phone and in person with everyone from the battalion commanders to the busted down E-1's.
I also have a lot of experience at the intersection of traumatic events and memory.
My best answer is that quantity matters (numbers of pieces of evidence/witnesses on a single incident), contemporaneous evidence matters, and research persistence matters. At the level of a Presidential campaign, you essentially have thousands of researchers working these claims - so the truth is more likely to emerge here than in any other scenario. Nakedly dishonest partisanship is the greatest enemy of the truth in matters such as these.
You can also work "internal evidence" in statements or what I call "forensic linguistics." So many of the people on the Kerry side (that is, professional spokesman) and media types have no idea whatever about this material. No clue. Their use of terms and even concepts betrays their ignorance, or their duplicity. They call a swift boat a "ship" and actually fall for the idea that these men did not serve "with" Kerry, because they did not ride with him on his "ship." When Lanny Davis says things like this, you can chuckle. When Del Sandusky took it one step further, you have to believe he is lying - he said the SBVTs in the ad "served with Kerry" like he served with Gen. Westmoreland. Sandusky had to know who some of these guys were personally - he served under them.
Apparently there were several dozen Army troopers on board the SBs when Kerry beached his boat and did the Silver Star event. None of them have come forward. Want to bet more than a few will now be found? Was there a lot of hostile fire? Is the citation correct in that? Or are the SBVTs telling the more accurate story?
I also think we will find a lot of what I call "mix and match" in eye witness accounts - guys will mix up aspects of one incident with another, all more or less true, only it did not all happen together in time.
You also have peer reinforcement, which I suspect will be more the case on the Kerry side of this than on the SBVT side. The best storyteller tends to color the memory of the more malleable comrade; and if you add in professional media advosors, I don't doubt they've had some group sessions to sift down the story to a consistent version.
There is a book called The Killing Zone by Frederick Downs, about Vietnam, written in 1978 from memory or personal records of the author, before the official documents were declassified. I was in some of the incidents in that book, and there are glaring errors - many I attribute to the "mix-and-match" phenomenon. He describes a nightime medevac helicopter event, after a fatal land mine incident, and even says how afraid he was as the chopper came in, waiting for the enemy to engage it with fire. But there was no medevac that night. I know that. And all the official documents show he is wrong. But I have no doubt he remembers it clearly and honestly. I do not in the least consider the author to be dishonest in any way. But he is wrong, and what he reports did not happen.
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For The Honor of the Fifty-Eight Thousand.
"He Can Lose, But He Can Not Hide"

[waltjones]

Wanta bet the 1st one will be Doug Reese?

[truthseeker]

d19thdoc

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. Food for thought.......

[Scott]

Semper Fi Walt, but no possible way!


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Bye bye, Boston Straggler!

[Cowboy]

Anybody see this http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1188764/posts on Free Republic? Rassman's article contradicts Kerry's account. From a Kerry's campaign press release (emphasis added):

On March 13, 1969, Rassmann, a Green Beret, was traveling down the Bay Hap river in a boat behind Kerry’s when both were ambushed by exploding land mines and enemy fire coming from the shore. Kerry was hit in the arm, while a mine blew Rassmann’s boat out of the water. With enemy fire coming from both sides of the river and swift boats evacuating from the area, Kerry’s crew chose to turn their boat toward the ambush to save Rassmann.

“We were still under fire, and he was wounded at the time…,” recalled Rassmann. And with his boat’s gunners providing suppressing fire, Kerry extended his wounded arm into the water and the two lieutenants locked arms.

From the WSJ article written by Rassman (emphasis added):

While returning from a SEA LORDS operation along the Bay Hap River, a mine detonated under another swift boat. Machine-gun fire erupted from both banks of the river, and a second explosion followed moments later. The second blast blew me off John's swift boat, PCF-94, throwing me into the river. Fearing that the other boats would run me over, I swam to the bottom of the river and stayed there as long as I could hold my breath.

[RemodelingGuy]

Rassman has every right to post his opinion!

When he was bobbing up and down in the water, afraid of dying, Kerry was the one to pick him up!

Kudos to Kerry!

Whether or not hostile fire was happening above him in the water is secondary! He's just glad that someone saved his life. He deserves the benefit of the doubt in that kind of circumstance!

We know that the swiftys around him know there was NO Hostile fire, but you know when Kerry picked him up and saw the opportunity in it, he gave the near drowning man his opinion and it stuck!

Kerry Knows Politics coming from the Rich and Elite !

My Thoughts!
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RemodelingGuy

[Son Of The Godfather]

I'm guessing they got flooded with SwiftVet supporters responding to the (AHEM) "article" (as I did... hasn't posted to the site yet and don't know if they will do so).

Wouldn't it be fantastic if this overwhelming chorus of voices were reflected in November at the ballot boxes?

I don't foresee a Mondale-esque landslide, but I'd like to see a severe political drubbing of Kerry nonetheless. What a message it would send.

One can dream.

SOTG
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"Which candidate would enemies of the United States prefer to see in the White House?"

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

[kate]

Here's a link to that same reference..right on Kerry's own website
http://www.johnkerry.com/pressroom/releases/pr_2004_0117d.html
January 17, 2004 Kerry Reunites with Fellow Veteran in Iowa
On March 13, 1969, Rassmann, a Green Beret, was traveling down the Bay Hap river in a boat behind Kerry’s

This link to Rassmann's editorial should work without sign in
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110005460
Wall Street Journal Editorial Page
Shame on the Swift Boat Veterans for Bush /John Kerry saved my life. Now his heroism is being questioned.
BY JIM RASSMANN
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 12:01 a.m. EDT
The second blast blew me off John's swift boat, PCF-94,
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.
one of..... We The People

[igor]

[Beldar]

I've posted a fisking of Rassman's WSJ article on my own blog.