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rekcutt
Ensign
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 68
Location: Texas
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 Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2004 5:04 pm Post subject: A turning point in the War on Terror. . . . |
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Reports from Russia indicate that a sizable number of the terrorist that invaded the school in Russia were arab terrorist in addition to the Chechnian terrorist.
I believe with this latest attack we will see a change in Putin's position concerning terrorists and the Middle east. The citizens of Russia are sure to re-act in a normal manner, demanding that their gov't protect them and their children. Putin has been aggressive on taking the fight to the Chechian terrorist, but has straddle the fence when it comes to Arab terrorist.
It has been obvious to me that the Chechian terrorist have been financed and trained by the muslim fanatics for years, yet Putin has been dancing with Chirac hoping to have it both ways.
I predict that Putin can no longer substain the Kabuki dance he has been doing with Schreoder and Putin, finally realizing that the only way to protect his citizens is to join with the US to pressure all middle east (arab) governments to stop the aid, sanctury and assistance to these arab terrorists.
In short, the death of all these kids will be Russia's "Pearl Harbor", forcing Russia to join the US-British alliance - belatedly - but similiar to th US's belated entry into WW2.
rekcutt
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cjg
PO3
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 254
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2004 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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I certainly hope you are correct, because watching the story of the
children is so heartbreaking, to put children through such fear and abuse,
to the point of shooting at the children as they try to run away is so
wrong I can not find words.
Putin needs to wake up and realize he can no longer hide the truth from
the people.
Let's hope he does so quickly.
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buffman
LCDR
Joined: 21 Aug 2004
Posts: 437
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 4:34 am Post subject: |
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We killed MANY a Chechen terrorist in Afghanistan, they are bad news. I pray to God that we don't have this same thing happen in the US soon.
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Beatrice1000
Resource Specialist
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 1179
Location: Minneapolis, MN
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 7:27 am Post subject: Re: A turning point in the War on Terror. . . . |
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| rekcutt wrote: | | It has been obvious to me that the Chechian terrorist have been financed and trained by the muslim fanatics for years, yet Putin has been dancing with Chirac hoping to have it both ways. |
I have a vague recall on this issue -- one would have to do some searching thru the news over the last couple years -- but I seem to remember over the last couple years that Putin has alleged that he was dealing with terrorists and Al Qaeda in the Chechen fighting, but was then accused by either our gov't directly & quoted by the media, or put forth by the media -- by SOMEONE anyway, that he was only claiming "fighting terrorists" in order to support his continued use of force and military control over the region which was "only in a civil war that had gone on for a long, long time." We were sort of wanting him to "back off" from his aggression in that area, in so many words to the effect that we were not pleased with his military actions....
After I had seen Al Qaeda linkages to the Chechen conflict on their websites, it appeared to me that the"civil war" had morphed into an Islamic Jihadi front and I then wondered why Putin was being portrayed as lying in this regard. I don't trust Putin and there are many, many things about him I definitely don't like -- but I could almost swear that he has been claiming Al Qaeda in Chechyna for some time.... without the world's support and without our support. |
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msindependent
Vice Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 891
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 8:33 am Post subject: |
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| Beatrice, I think you are correct. I am remembering something about us not recognizing the Chechian terrorists for what they were because Chechia was not free from Russia. Big mistake on our part and think it was corrected a few years ago. Stupid politics. |
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bach04
Lieutenant
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 212
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 11:43 am Post subject: |
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| The Chechen rebels are notorious for their brutality. (Deleted by Admin) During the Afgan war, Chechens were part of the mujahideen that were notorious for maiming and executing captured Russian soldiers in the most barbaric manners. During the two conflicts in Chechyna, they videotaped all the massacres they were involved in and sent those tapes to Arab nations so that they can still be bankrolled by Arab sympathizers. No surprise of Arab/Al Qaida connections; and many of the rebels are in fact foreigners from sudan, yemen, syria, and saudi. To these madmen, it's another jihad. I heard how one escaping terrorist was captured by villagers and was beaten to death. that terrorist obviously had a blessing considering what the russian military would have done to him. |
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Beatrice1000
Resource Specialist
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 1179
Location: Minneapolis, MN
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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| msindependent wrote: | | ..I am remembering something about us not recognizing the Chechian terrorists for what they were ..... Big mistake on our part and think it was corrected a few years ago. |
Whew - okay, I'm glad to see that we are perhaps with Russia on this. Did a quick search & could not find our official position, but here's an article from 2002 that has a statement from our charge d'affairs in Georgia -- I don't know if the conclusion here is true, but I hope it is:
Christian Science Monitor -- 26 February 2002
A new terror-war front: the Caucasus
Russia and Georgia may attack Al Qaeda in a mountain hideaway.
By Fred Weir | Special to The Christian Science Monitor
MOSCOW - The next flash point in the global war on terrorism could be the Pankisi Gorge, a lawless area in Georgia that abuts rebel Chechnya. In this remote pass, US and Russian officials say Al Qaeda fighters from Afghanistan - possibly even Osama bin Laden - have taken refuge. Early this month, the US chargé d'affaires in Georgia, Philip Remler, told a local newspaper that dozens of Arab terrorists "connected with bin Laden" are holed up among some 7,000 Chechen refugees in the gorge. In the past week, there has been talk of a joint Georgian-Russian military action in the gorge.
For the Kremlin, Mr. Remler's comments are clear evidence that the United States has finally accepted Russia's long-standing claim that the Chechen rebellion, which spills over into neighboring Caucasus republics, is not just a local independence movement, but has become a full-blown subsidiary of the global Islamic terror network headed by Mr. bin Laden. |
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FredRum
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 14 Aug 2004
Posts: 118
Location: Reston, VA
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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I lived and worked in Russia and various satellites of the former Soviet Union for a time in the mid-90's, and found Russians to be good people with much more in common with Americans (in terms of their spirit and sensibilities) than most people realize. I agree that this incident might just turn them around on the whole issue of fighting terrorism.
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rekcutt
Ensign
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 68
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 2:23 pm Post subject: Beslan terror |
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Thanks Fred and Beatrice, yes during the 90's US position was wrong concerning the Chechnya issue. Bush after 9/11 started working with Georgia (the nation not the state) concerning the Pankisi Gorge. This of course caused problems with the Russian gov't cause of old cold war concerns.
The main issue of my post was that while discussions have been on-going since 9/11 with Russia, that neither side would "push" their client states in the middle east to crack down. Russia needs to get serious with Syria and Iran, US needs to get serious with Saudis and Pakistan, about their support for the terrorists.
Hopefully, this is the wake up call and Russia realizes that France (and to a lesser degree - Germany) are nothing more that abettors for the muslim terrorists.
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BC
PO3
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 288
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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This was in an article from the Washington Times Insider this morning
| Quote: | | Western governments offered sympathy to Mr. Putin at the end of the school siege. But the European Union, in a statement issued once the scale of death became apparent, also wanted an explanation from Russia "how this tragedy could have happened," Reuters news agency reported. |
Link here
The EU needs to get a clue about how this happened.
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Beatrice1000
Resource Specialist
Joined: 10 Aug 2004
Posts: 1179
Location: Minneapolis, MN
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: Beslan terror |
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| rekcutt wrote: | | ... France (and to a lesser degree - Germany) are nothing more that abettors for the muslim terrorists. |
Hmm-mm. I do recall "elements of France", the leaders shall we say, and Germany working together once before... til we came knocking on their door...or shall I say, til we came crashing thru that door...
But yes, France has gone astray and has dug her heels in -- I feel her interest in wielding power through the EU is her primary selfish concern and that terrorism is on the back-burner (amid dreams of even greater power/glory.... I sort of see her plotting the formation of the EU as a quiet & sneaky Napoleonic conquest of Europe...and she did it without a shot... and beyond? Who knows.. Just a theory that I see as a joke, but that might not be too funny down the road...keep your eyes on her). She is dealing with the Arab mafia, so to speak, in order to placate her large muslin population. As long as she is "anti-US," France must feel somehow protected from attack. But she's making a deal with the devil, and this will blow up in her face eventually; unfortunately, the games she is playing affect us.
Germany I see as going-along-with-France to gain some sort of power/prestige for themselves -- I don't see that they know who they are. They, like France, are looking for protection by being anti-US, paying off the thugs that come around for protection money so to speak.
[Note that the French military is working with us in Afghanistan and in Africa doing joint operations -- so under the radar, there is cooperation. The troops get along fine and like each other from what I read at the US Central Command website....]
I think we'll be moving on Syria & Iran in the near future -- depends on who is in the whitehouse, I think. Like the guy who just came to my house today to destroy a hornet's nest. He worked on spraying all the cracks from the inside basement before he went outside to spray the actual nest....
As to the other post about the Russians being like us, yes, I agree -- and there is that very, very special connection with the space station. I love watching the NASA coverage of the US/Russian astronauts and both our mission controls working together. No matter what goes on "down here," those guys up there are brothers! I think Putin would rather be with us than with "them" -- but is not clear how to go about it yet. We'll see, I guess. |
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rekcutt
Ensign
Joined: 20 Aug 2004
Posts: 68
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 8:48 pm Post subject: Beslan |
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From a Russian news report, cited in a Fox report:
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Dozens of people crowded around lists of survivors posted at the Beslan hospital, searching desperately for news of loved ones who were not yet accounted for. A man showed hospital nurses a photograph — a young boy dressed in a suit, like he was going to a birthday party or holiday celebration.
"We run here, we run there, like we're out of our minds, trying to find out anything we can about them," said Tsiada Biazrova, 47, whose neighbors' children had yet to be found.
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Sounds alot like NYC immediately after 9/11, let's hope that out of this tragedy comes a unity for a true alliance to fight the terrorists - everywhere in the world. One could even hope the majority of the EU members would rise up and override the Chirac veto.
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SwiftVets, keep up the GREAT work, truth will win out over spin. |
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NortonPete
PO2
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 385
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2004 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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This has upset everyone I know.
The Question is to the Liberal community:
When will Michael Moore make a movie about how it was
the Russian children's fault that they were slain? |
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