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[Rdtf]

[Son Of The Godfather]

bump

SOTG
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"Which candidate would enemies of the United States prefer to see in the White House?"

[WallaceNails]

How does a news organization actually "verify" documents like these? It seems like it would be hard to authenticate them.
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FOUR MORE YEARS!!!!!!!!!

[The bandit]

[azpatriot]

One way of authenticating documents like these would be to compare them with known office documents. You can then compare handwriting samples, signatures, names that where used to “sign off” on the documents. And then beyond that you can compare the type of paper used, the type of ink used, the “official seals” and stamps on the documents can be verified. Heck you can even do DNA testing on the ink and paper if you want. There are so many ways to verify these documents, too many to list here.
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Proud to be an American! and member of the PAJAMAHADEEN
FedEx Kinko's: When it absolutely, positively has to be forged overnight

[Devil_dog_for_truth]

I think the easiest way to verify these documents is to have Middle East experts such as Walid Phares and Mansour Ijaz to look at them. I think that Walid has already called them "authentic". So, perhaps, someone could e-mail Ijaz at foxnews and see what he thinks.
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Retired Marine

Chain-fed, beer-cooled, big green amphibious monster that thrives on blogs

[twicearound]

Inspector's Report Bolsters Credibility of Iraqi Intelligence Documents

http://www.cnsnews.com//ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=\SpecialReports\archive\200410\SPE20041013a.html
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twicearound

[CTW]

[jataylor11]

Thank you for justifying my dirty home --- I keep putting it off while I do election activities.

[FreeFall]

Someone should send this to those idiots at the Guardian in the UK who are trying to sway Ohio voters!

[Rdtf]

Just got this email from the Author Laurie Mylroie - she wonders why the Bush Admin is quiet on this too...

From her email:

Quote:
Richard Spertzel, a former member of UNSCOM and a member of the Iraq Survey
Group, writes in today's WSJ, "It is asserted that Iraq was not supporting
terrorists. Really? Documentation indicates that Iraq was training
non-Iraqis at Salman Pak in terrorist techniques, including assassination
and suicide bombing. In addition to Iraqis, trainees included Palestinians,
Yemenis, Saudis, Lebanese, Egyptians and Sudanese."

Where are the President and the National Security Council on this? Iraq
and the legitimacy of this war is, arguably, the key issue of the
presidential race.

Why don't they say the ISG found documents that show Iraq was training
terrorists? The same thing happened with Iraqi documents recently detailed
by Scott Wheeler for Cybercast News Service. Without the backing of the
administration, the information falls into a black hole and disappears.

That is so, even as this issue is relevant to understanding the ongoing war
in Iraq. Who is the enemy? Do the foreign terrorists operate independently
of the Baathists; in conjunction with them; or somewhere in between? We
can't fight this war properly, unless we have the best possible answers to
those questions, while the result of not having those answers is unnecessary
casualties, both American and Iraqi.

The Wall Street Journal
Have War Critics Even Read the Duelfer Report?
By RICHARD SPERTZEL
October 14, 2004

After the release of the Iraq Survey Group's Duelfer report, the headlines
blazed "No WMD Found." Most stories continued by saying that Iraq did not
constitute an imminent threat to the U.S. and thus the U.S. was wrong to
eliminate that threat. This reflects the notion that Iraq was only a threat
if it had military munitions filled with WMD. The claim "Iraq was not an
imminent threat" was also expounded by pundits that seemingly crawled out of
the woodwork as well as those opposed to President Bush. But have these
individuals read carefully the report before engaging in such anti-Bush
rhetoric?

While no facilities were found producing chemical or biological agents on a
large scale, many clandestine laboratories operating under the Iraqi
Intelligence Services were found to be engaged in small-scale production of
chemical nerve agents, sulfur mustard, nitrogen mustard, ricin, aflatoxin,
and other unspecified biological agents. These laboratories were also
evaluating whether various poisons would change the texture, smell or
appearance of foodstuffs. These aspects of the ISG report have been ignored
by the pundits and press. Did these constitute an imminent threat? Perhaps
it depends how you define "threat."

The chemical section reports that the M16 Directorate "had a plan to produce
and weaponize nitrogen mustard in rifle grenades and a plan to bottle sarin
and sulfur mustard in perfume sprayers and medicine bottles which they would
ship to the United States and Europe." Are we to believe this plan existed
because they liked us? Or did they wish to do us harm? The major threat
posed by Iraq, in my opinion, was the support it gave to terrorists in
general, and its own terrorist activity.

The ISG was also told that "ricin was being developed into stable liquid to
deliver as an aerosol" in various munitions. Such development was not just
for assassination. If Iraq was successful in developing an aerosolizable
ricin, it made a significant step forward. The development had to be for
terrorist delivery. Even on a small scale this must be considered as a WMD.
Biological agents, delivered on a small scale (terrorist delivery) can maim
or kill a large number of people. The Iraqi Intelligence organizations had a
history of conducting tests on humans with chemical and biological
substances that went beyond assassination studies. While many of these were
in the 1970s and 1980s, multiple documents and testimony indicate that such
testing continued through the 1990s and into the next millennium, perhaps as
late as 2002. Do we wait until such weapons are used against our domestic
population before we act? Is that the way that some people wish to have the
U.S. protected from terrorist activity?

It is asserted that Iraq was not supporting terrorists. Really?
Documentation indicates that Iraq was training non-Iraqis at Salman Pak in
terrorist techniques, including assassination and suicide bombing. In
addition to Iraqis, trainees included Palestinians, Yemenis, Saudis,
Lebanese, Egyptians and Sudanese.

As for the U.N. inspection system preventing such R&D, why did Iraq not
declare these clandestine laboratories to Unscom and Unmovic and why did
these inspection agencies not discover these laboratories? Might it have
been that there were multiple informants working inside Unscom and Unmovic
that kept the Iraqi Intelligence Service informed as to what sites were to
be inspected? Information collected by ISG indicates that this was the case.
In late 2002 and early 2003, equipment and materials were removed from
several sites 24 hours before U.N. inspections. Such informants were said to
be active since 1993. Ergo, no surprise inspections.

Furthermore, sanctions were rapidly eroding. Unscom was aware of this
erosion but not to the degree that apparently developed post 1998. The
accounts of bribery of officials from several countries that were pushing
for lifting or weakening sanctions are legend and have been extensively
reported this past week. Inspections can not be effective without the full
support of the U.N. Security Council. Such full support did not exist from
late 1996 onward. Perhaps, now we know why. Iraq exploited the power of
wealth in the form of oil to buy influence in the Security Council and
within governments throughout the World. This has now been well documented.

Was Iraq an imminent threat? With the regime's intention and the activity of
its intelligence organizations, and with the proven futility of uncovering
its clandestine laboratory operations by the U.N. inspectors, it is hard to
draw any other conclusion. Regretfully, terrorism is the wave of the future.
The report by Charles Duelfer is unclassified and makes very interesting
reading for those who really want to know. For those with a closed mind, it
will be a waste of time.

Mr. Spertzel, head of the biological-weapons section of Unscom from 1994-99,
just returned from Iraq, where he has been a member of the Iraq Survey Group
(ISG).

[joyceb]

me too!!!! my poor husband hasn't had a peaceful day since Kerry won the primary.

[dcornutt]

I read the entire ISG report. Took an entire day. While there was a lot of "assessment" given many places had been looted and or cleaned before he got there, it was an interesting insight into the history of the regimes WMD and covert development efforts.

I think the most disturbing thing to me..were the kinds of WMD research that do not get reported much. Diseases, wheat blights to destroy crops, the fact that in the mid 90s..those secret IIs labs near Salman Pak, tested such poisons and diseases on "humans" and animals.

It just gave me chills. The type of ongoing research they were doing..was interesting. They knew they couldn't make industrial sized agent or weapons without being caught. So, they organized a complex of smaller labs..using illegal and cobbled together dual use epuipment...some of which was obtained via the oil for food programs..some of it, things they had never disclosed nor declared. Since they couldn't work directly with precursors etc...without being detected, and without producing actuall waponized agent...they employed the regimes chem/bio scientists into segmented reseach areas in various areas that related to weapons production elemnets of reseach for process.

I'll explain...they carefully chose the inert mediums they did research on, for various production methods. This would allow them to continue to develop processes for higher grade weaponized agent or diseases..wtihout actually using the illegal growth mediums or precursors..etc. All they had to do, was substitute the growth media or precursor..and use the same process they were working on..and they had high grade weapons. The type of subject matter they used for research was chosen for it's "properties" into the spefic area of process they might be working on. For instance..he found a "pesticide" research lab..that was producing aresol spray pesticides that were at weaponized level size particles. Completely ineffective as a pesticide as it dispursed too finely to even do any good. This was particularly for antrax related research..but was all setup under the guise of "dual use". The problem was, the process they were using..wasn't remotely even useful for pesticides. The Aresol drones they found were related to this research project. They sprayed crops. The farmers they talked to..spoke of the inneffectivness of the project at spraying crops. Of course, camo painted drones were a little out of place for such use as well.

The scientific process for binding and reducing particle size of agent like anthrax..is what makes it deadly and potent and last for a while. That's the very area of research they were doing...binding/particle reduction...under the guise of a pesticide/industrial chemical research and testing operation.

There were other such examples in other areas ..such as small pox, or other disease...where the growth media or subject matter they were using for the research wasn't conducive to the purpose they claim..or in some cases..only related to WMD type research. This also included ricin. They had a castor bean farm, as well as a press. They claimed it was for production of both pharmacueticals and brake fluid..etc. When he found the process they were researching and using...what he found was..the chemicals they were using in the process to make ricin mash and extract it..would have been unfit for either use. When he talked to the brake fluid/industrial plant..he found they had in fact been importing their own castor...because the castor from this farm/plant research was unsuitable for their use. They had shut down the industrial plant becuase the price of importated castor had gone up so much 200%.

They produced their own medium substitutes internally. Some of this was quite ingenious. They had this plant ..that was supposed to be a milk/baby formula plant..that was making this "cake" like substance...from curd, etc..that was of seemingly no use. As it turns out, it was perfect for small pox and other disease research.

The combination..of their WMD programs moving to a more covert level..and specifically in these nasty disease/bio/chem area...and moving them under IIs...in a more clandestine fashion...coupled with the growing understanding of them training foreign nationals, terroists type tactics..etc...just made my skin crawl. Because NOBODY is worried about AlQueda carrying a missle silo from N Korea on the back into NYC. But it's this combination...of covert, clandestine, terroists type ..level of stuff..that is probably the biggest threat we face.

They found things..in those IIs (Iraqi Intelligence) labs..like perfume spray bottles..for filling with weaponized agent or other nasty things they could dream up...which was also realted to their "areosol", particule reduction reseach. Assassination pens..writing pens..with injector needles...that were all realted to those areas of IIs that were training foreign nationals. Some of that information is actually "old". From mid 90s. But, it's clear..the Iraqi's knew they could no longer have large scale industrial complexs without being caught. And had moved things more under IIs..clandestine ..smaller labs (even in houses). Also, they segmented the research...enough so, that it would not be apparent from one location..that they were doing weapons related research. One lab..in a school..or etc..might be working on just binding process..using inert material carefully chosen for it's properties realted to that process.

The areas of terroists training....were also interesting. They claimed it was an "anti-terror" training camp...ie..hostage rescue, etc. Of course, the bomb vests and suicide training might have been a clue? You don't save hostages or arrest hijackers by blowing yourself up. In fact..I can't think of one enforcement or hostage rescue operation..that would consist of special ops units using bomb vests to blowthemselves up. This is how they explained the boeing plane hull at that training facility (hostage rescue training..anti-terror operation training). There was also obvious assasination training. This is the area..where there was a small lab..that included human/animal testing for substances. According to the regime elements that talked of this...as far as they knew..this was stopped in the mid/late 90s. (ie..human testing and autopsy).

It's an interesting read...but very long. And there is lots of speculation in it as well..based on statements and his own piecing together. But, there is also one thing clear...many of the sites he had found..some of which were never declared..nor known..small labs, etc...were carefully "cleaned"...everythign removed. He found burned documents that referred to IIs..and research..etc..but either just before..or just after..many of these sites were cleaned. From there..looting took it's toll.
So, when he says...no WMD or evidence of weapons production was found there...you have to keep that in mind. It's obvious though, whatever they did have going on, was at a much smaller, clandestine level..and not large scale military complex level. To me...considering the issue post 9/11..and the terroists ties and operations training...thats even MORE dangerous in regards to an imminent threat to us..in regard to proliferation and obvious use for such terroists operatons.

Some of this stuff..diseases, blights..etc..could have impact for years. And it was never lost to me..that every scene of Saddam's military council included 3...scientists/biologists...in those areas..wearing their official military uniforms.

It's good read if you have the time. Do the whole report. It's 3 parts..about 40 megs each..complete with images, diagrams and documents that show the oil for food scandal contributors.!! That's entire story within itself. Since this is getting long, I'm going to make a follow up post here...with a transcript of a taped meeting he found...that was just before the invasion of Gulf1 (desert storm) started. I think you'll get the idea.

[dcornutt]

Saddam: I want to make sure that—close the door please [door slams)]—the germ and chemical warheads, as well as the chemical and germ bombs, are available to the “concerned people,” so that in case we ordered an attack, they can do it without missing any of their targets?

Husayn Kamil: Sir, if you’ll allow me. Some of the chemicals now are distributed, this is according to the last report from the Minister of Defense, which was submitted to you sir. Chemical warheads are stored and are ready at Air Bases, and they know how and when to deal with, as well as arm these heads. Also, some other artillery machines and rockets (missiles) are available from the army. While some of the empty “stuff” is available for us, our position is very good, and we don’t have any operational problems. Moreover, in the past, many substantial items and materials were imported; now, we were able to establish a local project, which was established to comply with daily production. Also, another bigger project will be fi nalized within a month, as well as a third project in the coming two to three months that will keep us on the safe side, in terms of supply. We, Sir, only deal in common materials like phosphorus, ethyl alcohol and methyl [interrupted].

Saddam: Etc. . . . this is not important to me.

Husayn Kamil: So, Sir, regarding the germs and [he pauses].

Saddam: And the Chemicals.

Husayn Kamil: No, we have some of the chemicals available [interrupted].

Saddam: So, we qualify that the missiles, by tomorrow, will be ready on the 15th.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, we don’t have the germs.

Saddam: Then, where are they?

Husayn Kamil: It’s with us.

Saddam: what is it doing with you, I need these germs to be fi xed on the missiles, and tell him to hit, because starting the 15th, everyone should be ready for the action to happen at anytime, and I consider Riyadh as a target.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, let me explain to you. What we produced now are the rocket heads and the containers, and we distributed them underground in three different locations. We considered these locations the best places we have, and that if we had a chance to scatter and to fi nd more locations, then we would have done it. These locations are far away from Baghdad, this is problematic because of transportation which will take seven days to commute, but we minimized all the transportation procedures in a way. However, when we want to commute it, we cannot do it within one day Sir, and if we want to do it by plane, then, Sir, we have to go for the method [paused].

Saddam: Let’s talk about it later [waiters entered the room, sound of plates banging and side talks to the waiters].

Husayn Kamil: (door slams) Sir, we have three types of germ weapons, but we have to decide which one we should use, some types stay capable for many years [interrupted].

Saddam: we want the long term, the many years kind.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, this option is available and all other options are available as well.

Saddam: You mean at which time should we use it and at which moment!

Husayn Kamil: Yes sir. That is why there has to be a decision about which method of attack we use: a missile, a fi ghter bomb or a fi ghter plane.

Saddam: With them all, all the methods.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, we have to calculate now [interrupted].

Saddam: Husayn knows about those.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, there are some calculations we have to do, since we have modifi ed fi ghters. The bombs or the warheads are all available, but the moment for using them at zero hour is something we should indicate sir; we will say that this will be launched (interrupted).

Saddam: At the moment of use (zero hour), you should launch them all against their targets.

Husayn Kamil: All of the methods are available, sir.

Saddam: We don’t want to depend on one option. The missiles will be intercepted and the planes, at least one will crash, but whenever the missiles or planes fall down over the enemy land, then I consider the goal is achieved and the mission fulfi lled.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, it is available and stored “somewhere,” but if you, Sir, order us to transfer it, we are a bit worried it will cause contamination. It has been stored for 45 to 47 years, and yet has not been certifi ed as being safe (uncontaminated). Sir, it had been experimented on only once and some of the employees, Sir, were contaminated. -Time 07:36-08:20,

Saddam: I want as soon as possible, if we are not transferring the weapons, to issue a clear order to the “concerned people” that the weapon should be in their hands ASAP. I might even give them a “non-return access. “ [Translator Comment: to have access to the weapons; to take them with them and not to return them]. I will give them an order stating that at “one moment,” if I ‘m not there and you don’t hear my voice, you will hear somebody else’s voice, so you can receive the order from him, and then you can go attack your targets. I want the weapons to be distributed to targets; I want Riyadh and Jeddah, which are the biggest Saudi cities with all the decision makers, and the Saudi rulers live there. This is for the germ and chemical weapons.

Husayn Kamil: In terms of chemical weapons, we have an excellent situation and good grip on them Regime Stra Intent [Translator Comment: they are in good control of them].

Saddam: Only in case we are obliged and there is a great necessity to put them into action. Also, all the Israeli cities, all of them. Of course you should concentrate on Tel Aviv, since it is their center.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, the best way to transport this weapon and achieve the most harmful effects would come by using planes, like a crop plane; to scatter it. This is, Sir, a thousand times more harmful. This is according to the analyses of the technicians (interrupted).

Saddam: We should consider alternatives Husayn (He called Husayn Kamil, Husayn). Meaning that if the planes don’t arrive, then the missile will, and if the missile is intercepted, the plane will arrive.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, it is rare that the missiles are intercepted.

Saddam: Anyways, it is our duty to think of all the bad scenarios of this mission. Then Israel fi rst, and if the Americans attack us with unconventional, harmful types of weapons, or at the moment we see it feasible to attack, but as for now, put Riyadh and Jeddah as targets.

Saddam: Air Force Commander [Muzahim Sa’b Hasan Muhammad Al Nasiri, at the time], you should coordinate with the Minister of Industry to get access to the weapons in the shortest time possible, of course with a lot of consideration for the technical and safety factors. Also, I want to give a written authorization to the “concerned people” that is signed by me, in case something happens to me. You know this is a life and death issue, all the orders about targets are sealed in writing and authenticated. Furthermore, for the offi cials from the missile (rockets) authority, you should coordinate with them so that they take the missile to locations. They are to inform the chief of staff, or operations commander deputy, to go to Husayn, Minister of Industry and go with the same necessary procedures. Regarding the chemical weapon [interrupted].

Husayn Kamil: We are really in good control of it sir.

Saddam: No, I mean it should be with the “taking action” people. [Translator Comment: the people who will execute the command; implementers.]

Husayn Kamil: Sir, the chemical is available and our establishment is the one responsible for commuting the weapon and supervising how it is used.

Saddam: Excellent. Do you have anything stocked in the establishment stores?

Husayn Kamil: We have (empty) heads but we also have production all over. Not only in the factories; it is scattered.

Saddam: I want you to keep in mind that by the 15 th nothing should be stored in your factories that the “enemy” can have access to.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, the Ministry of defense should pull that “Stuff” out. The Ministry of defense already ordered 25% of that stuff. When and if they ask us for the rest, we will have no problem supplying it. Sir, we are in an excellent & prepared situation regarding the missile warheads and fi ghter’s bombs. They are all modifi ed and ready for launching any time, the chemical and the germ. No conversation (sound of plates banging).

Saddam: Where are the most American forces and troops gathered and concentrated?

Speaker 2: Sir, it is in Khalid Military city “Madinat Khalid,” located 60 kilometers past Hafr Al-Baten in Saudi, where the front General Command and Air Force Command are located. Most of the American army sectors, Sir, are by the coastal side in AlDammam, where most of the camp complexes exist.

Saddam: I want these big gatherings and complexes to be allocated properly and given to the Air Force commander to be added to the above targets of the germs weapons. This should be done by an order to Muzahim. This is by a direct order and it has the green light from me, since this mission doesn’t fall into daily regular operations. I will issue a letter, signed by me, listing the commands and the alternative plans and probabilities of this mission, which should be followed literally.

Speaker 2: Sir, Economically important targets such as refi neries, power plants & water reservoirs, should we include them in the mission?

Saddam: These locations should be put under the regular Air Force operations, and included in attacks not on this particular mission.

Husayn Kamil: Sir, these vital locations must be added to the mission and become priority targets to the biological & chemical weapons, because this will end all sorts of life. People are drinking water from these desalination plants and getting their fuel from refi neries, thus ending the mission.

Saddam: Muzahim has already written these locations down and will take care of it, Refi neries and [interrupted].

Muzahim: The Refi neries and desalination plants, Sir.

Saddam: May God help us do it. Then there was no conversation.

Saddam: We will never lower our heads as long as we are alive, even if we have to destroy everybody.

The recording continues after this for a further 48 minutes, in which the participants discuss other military matters, such as senior command appointments and low-level defensive preparations. There was no further discussion of WMD.

I think that speaks for itself.