SwiftVets.com

[GolfBravoUSMC]

Nightline will broadcast a program recordd in the village where Kerry earned his Silver Star. They interview locals regarding the battle.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Nightline/Vote2004/story?id=166434&page=1
_________________
USMC 58-69 Quang Tri, Dong Ha, & Khe Sanh II, 1stMAW Vietnam 1969

[wednesdaychild]

btt, any coments about this? When did nightline find time to do this?
_________________
"...for the good of believing in life after birth..."
Jim Steinman

[leeinwv]

It is so nice they can go and find someone

[knightowl77]

Well what do you know...The VC support Kerry's claim...hmmmmm

Yea they are credible!
_________________
I hope you don't mind an Army vet on your website. Former NCO in 82nd Airborne Div.
C 2nd/325th Inf

[kman]

[knightowl77]

If the VC say it - it must be true....we should just pack it in


F*** Kerry and the lying MSM!
_________________
I hope you don't mind an Army vet on your website. Former NCO in 82nd Airborne Div.
C 2nd/325th Inf

[Chuck Z Ombie AC2000]

How they can describe the incident when they cant even describe Kerry or how the man was shot and that the accounts are very different from eachother. but these guys are eyewitnesses!
_________________
John Kerry, R.I.P. (Rot In Paris)

[rhv5862]

Surprise surprise the Vietnamese support Kerry. Who would ever have guessed that.

RHV

[Frogg]

Sounds to me that the VC account is yet a third version.
In the heat of a battle....different views.

[cipher]

I don't see that the VC *are* supporting Kerry's claim. In fact, there are at least 6 contraditions to the events as described by Kerry.

I need to pull this story apart a bit, it'll take a few minutes, as I have to chase down some references.

Basically, the contradictions are:
1) "Numerically superior force" The VC says 20, and they are relatively precise about who and where the 20 came from. That is consistent also with after actions reports, however, there were in excess of 50 RVN marines on the US side, plus the crews and equipment of the Swift boats. That is NOT "numerical superiority"

2) "Intense fire" It seems the intense fire was from the friendlies. The VC were armed with ONE RPG-2 with a B-40 grenade and small arms. That is hardly "intense firepower". The reports of the VC is that they didn't hit anything (hard to hit when you're running).

3) Everyone seems to make a big deal about the wardrobe and apparent age and size of the VC. He was about 26 and dressed in black pajamas. That seems to be a major bone of contention, but shouldn't be.

4) How and where and when he was killed (and he was the ONLY one killed in the attack). The VC shed no new light on this.

5) "weapons cache and supplies captured and destroyed" Flatly denied by the VC. That is a lie on the citation, according to them, no one found the cache, and it still exists today.

6) "Intense automatic weapons fire". The VC state that the 12 man reinforcements and the 8 man home based troops were armed with small arms and ONE B-40. There is no mention of any sort of crew-fired automatic weapon, either an LMG or HMG. It is likely there were AK-47s, however.

I need to look more closely and compare with the four other accounts we have of the incident. One (several, actually!) silver star citations from Kerry, the SPOT reports (there are two), and the other eyewitness Navy officer's op-ed, and UFC.

Hopefully, I'll be able to get this assembled in a few hours, depending on how distracted I get by the locals here.
_________________
USMC 69-72, 7th Comm, 3rd MarDiv, FMFPAC
US Army 75-79, 97th Sig, SHAPE, NATO
Arkansas National Guard 79
Defense contractor for US Navy, SSPO, SP-20, SP-24, OP-12 84-92

[sleeplessinseattle]

"Nightline traveled to Vietnam and found a number of witnesses who have never been heard from before,"

60 Minutes Sept 8, 2004:
"But 60 Minutes has obtained a number of documents we are told were taken from Col. Killian's personal file. Among them, a never-before-seen memorandum from May 1972, where Killian writes that Lt. Bush called him to talk about "how he can get out of coming to drill from now through November."

Nightline in October:
"Nightline traveled to Vietnam and found a number of witnesses who have never been heard from before, and who have no particular ax to grind for or against Kerry."

60 M II: obtained a number of documents
NIGHTLINE: found a number of witnesses

60 M II: a never-before-seen memorandum
NIGHTLINE: who have never been heard from before

Get the picture?

Anyhow - Cipher goes a long way toward debunking this also...we're sure that there were 50 Marines there? - that must be from various official documentation/accounts? Anyhow, how does ABC back any of this up? My skepticism with ABC (other than the obvious) comes into play in that they sooooooooo wanted these villagers to support Kerry's contentions...whether they contradict other accounts (or the actual facts) or simply made them up, as I suspect might also have been the case here with the "proper" peruasion - either way - it just doesn't add up for Kerry...we know he has exaggerated/decieved/lied on so many other similar accounts...great work Cipher...

Let's email ABC and ask them to verify and validate their accounts...

[Stevie]

when was this on? I'm looking at my on screen tv guide and don't see it anywhere????


any back up proof on Colliers???? where can I find it???
thanks
_________________
Stevie
Congressmen who willfully take actions during wartime that damage
morale and undermine the military are saboteurs and should
be arrested, exiled or hanged.

[ccr]

One very interesting part of the Nightline story....

[sleeplessinseattle]

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Nightline/Vote2004/story?id=166434&page=1
"The canals lead to Tran Thoi village, the coordinates of which are publicly available in the U.S. military's after-action report on the 1969 battle. The Vietnamese government initially rejected Nightline's request to visit the village, saying they did not want to somehow influence the U.S. presidential election. Once Nightline explained that the intention was to simply find out what the Vietnamese people remember and think of what happened there, permission was granted."

Nightline however, and the whole friggin' MSM, have no such restriction...even the Communist friggin' government has more standards than the MSM? Unbe-Orwellian-lievable...

[shadowy]

Cipher,
Maybe you should e-mail what you have so far to Nightline, to give them a little example of what to expect on the blogs in a few hours? It might add a little flavor of nervousness to the broadcast that we'd all enjoy seeing.