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WilliamShipley
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Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Posts: 37
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 Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:08 pm Post subject: Kerry Plans to reinstitute Draft? |
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Reading various topics, it occured to me that a message that Kerry was planning to reinstitute the draft could give people something to chew on while they drank their cool-aid. A reasonable case could be made:
1. Kerry is on record saying he will continue the war and to pursue Bin Laden.
2. Kerry is on record saying that he intends to expand the military.
3. Kerry is on record as saying that the current forces have been kept too long (back-door draft)
4. Kerry is aware that the active military favors Bush and that re-ups will decline if he is elected.
5. Kerry is NOT on record saying there will be no draft (George Bush is).
So the logical conclusion is that John Kerry plans to expand the theater that we are operating in, knows that France and Germany will only provide token support and that he will have a serious military shortage even without taking into account his intention to expand the military (Not enough troups). He and his supporters have been spreading the draft rumors now so that after the election he can claim that his proposal to reinstitute the draft was something that Bush was preparing for.
Neat, huh? I'm sure the pros on this forum could fill in some of the details. |
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gerson
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 05 Sep 2004
Posts: 34
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:13 pm Post subject: Another point |
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Another point:
6. Kerry is also on record as saying Bush will reinstitute the draft. These people always accuse others of what they themselves are doing or planning to do. |
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Fantasy Dream Dancer
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Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 18
Location: VA
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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Well, when re-enlistments drop off and recruitments plummet if Kerry is elected, he won't have a choice other than to implement a draft... if he actually conducts the military actions he is claiming that he intends.
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Artifical Intelligence is no match for natural stupidity |
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Tom Poole
Vice Admiral
Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 914
Location: America
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Fantasy Dream Dancer wrote: | | ...if he actually conducts the military actions... |
From what I've learned in the past few months, the only action Humpty Dumpty will take is whatever the UN dictates. Right now, their only military objective is Israel. The entire Arab world would form a coalition for that aim and the troop strength might not be overly demanding. Too bad the Jewish community is solidly behind Humpty but you reap what you sow.
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JackMcC
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 30 Oct 2004
Posts: 27
Location: Massachusetts
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:43 pm Post subject: Kerry and Draft |
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| In point of fact, as recently as July Kerry supported a MANDATORY two year service obligation for graduating high school seniors. It was on his website as part of his "100 days to renew America" plan. He took the page down about two/three weeks prior to his convention. You can still find it in one of several archive storing sights. |
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Weaponeer
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 20 Sep 2004
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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I think now is the time to be interviewing troops here in the US to see how many will stay and how many will ETS if Kerry gets in office.
If a high percentage show they will leave it would prove that Kerry would have to have a draft in order to not only maintain our current militarty strength, but also because Kerry wants to quickly add additional troops.
I may be wrong but I also think that Kerry plans on dumping additional troops into Iraq (guard duty), which means more troops would be sent overseas, rather than less under Bush. How many people would be happier that families have a great chance of getting called up. |
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WilliamShipley
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Posts: 37
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| My point is that a reasonable case can be made for this. With the combined knowledge this forum contains, we can polish it up and make a relatively compelling case. Post it a few places, and perhaps it will wonder around on it's own. |
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armyairbournebrat
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 19 Sep 2004
Posts: 27
Location: ohio
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 7:01 pm Post subject: draft and kerry |
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Actually Kerry re-election site had his plan to reistitute the draft. It was quickly pulled and they decided to accuse the Bush administration of bringing back the draft. Bush and the military have never said they wanted a draft. They feel a volunteer Army are fine men and women who have chosen to be there. I do believe if Kerry is elected they will have to introduce a draft to cover the mass exodus that will occur based on polls of the military.
excerpt:
Creating a New Army of Patriots
On September 11th, 2001, America experienced the most terrible and deadly attack in its history. Yet, President Bush's response was to call on Americans to wait in long lines at airports, go shopping, or wrap their windows in plastic.
As President, John Kerry will have the courage to lead and call on all Americans to make our nation stronger. Whether it is protecting America from the threats of terrorism or addressing the problems we have at home, America's new challenges will not be met by the same old answers of big government or big tax cuts for the wealthy. John Kerry will call on all Americans - tapping into the idealism and ingenuity of Americans and putting it to work on building a safer, stronger, and more secure nation. Americans already make an enormous difference in their communities, volunteering, in Boys and Girls Clubs or homeless shelters. Many Americans do full time service. John Kerry believes that in these times, we need to bolster these efforts with a nationwide commitment to national service. Whether it is a Summer of Service for our teenagers, helping young people serve their country in return for college, or the Older Americans in Service program, John Kerry's plan will call on every American of every age and every background to serve. John Kerry will set a goal of one million Americans a year in national service within the next decade.
Here is the link:http://www.kerry-sucks.com/
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ord33
Rear Admiral
Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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Funny thing is, when Terry McAuliffe was asked about it in a debate on C-SPAN, he said the following which indicates John Kerry likely would begin a draft with his plan:
| Quote: | Question asked by Mariah:
I think the possibility of a draft is an important issue to our generation. So Chairman McAuliffe, if Senator Kerry wants to add two new active divisions to our military, if this plan is supposed to fulfill the pressing needs for our American Troops in Iraq and around the globe, how can we possibly fill the Ranks without a Draft.
Chairman McAuliffe:
"Well the reason we may have to have a draft in..it's..it's a discussion we need to have cause nine out of ten active troops are committed over in Iraq.
I spent last week traveling thoughout the country with Tony McPeak, a four star General in the Airforce. He ran George Bushes war...the Gulf War one over..uh..when we first went to the Gulf War.
He supported George Bush in 2000. He now supports John Kerry because he says this nation can't afford 4 more years of George Bushes go it alone arrogent foreign policy.
And if we let the President continue on that way, we may have to have a draft. We don't know today but if I'm a younger person today, it's worth something we ought to discuss.
This is what a Democracy is all about. We've got to have a discussion on these issues.
What John Kerry has said, he wants to do, is to bring 40,000 new troops in. Right now as you know, all of our troops are committed to Iraq. We do have a back door draft. People who have joined the National Gaurd are being called up 3 or 4 times longer then they originally signed up for. They're not allowed to come home. |
http://www2.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=13532 |
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CTW
Rear Admiral
Joined: 10 Sep 2004
Posts: 691
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:18 pm Post subject: Re: Kerry and Draft |
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| JackMcC wrote: | | In point of fact, as recently as July Kerry supported a MANDATORY two year service obligation for graduating high school seniors. It was on his website as part of his "100 days to renew America" plan. He took the page down about two/three weeks prior to his convention. You can still find it in one of several archive storing sights. |
Yes The DNC Platform calls for a MANDATORY SERVICE for all young people 18-26 years of age including women. It was also introduced in Jan 2003 as Bills to Congress by Rangel et al. The Republicans had them vote to set the record. but it is the platform of the DNC and they will do it. Get the word out in your emails. CTW
Never Ever Kerry |
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Ret. SMCS
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Joined: 30 Oct 2004
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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Try as you might, you will never convince younger voters of this. The MSM only wants to say that GWB will institute a draft!
I am a die hard Republican, but IMO it is not looking good for GWB! I fear that the MSM may have turned this election for Kerry in a way that can't easily be turned to GWB, without a few of the channels standing up and really asking Kerry the tough questions. Such as "Why won't you sign the SF-180 authorizing the full release of your records?"
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Mooncusser
Lieutenant
Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 245
Location: Missouri
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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The left would never reinstate the draft.
That would take to much money out of their vote-buying social programs.
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Thu Thua, Long An
I actually won the election before I lost it.
"It is a good day to fight! It is a good day to die! Strong hearts, brave hearts to the front! Weak hearts and cowards to the rear!" (Crazy Horse) |
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Geano
Lieutenant
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Posts: 237
Location: Kentucky
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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Maybe this'll help:Quote from the Selective Service Website
| Quote: | "On October 5, 2004, the House of Representatives voted 402 - 2 to defeat H.R. 163, the bill cited as proof that the Selective Service was preparing to reinstate a military draft. The vote made official what has been a reality since January 7, 2003, when H.R. 163 was introduced despite nearly total opposition in Congress to restoring the draft. Without Congressional support, the draft cannot be reinstated. A similar bill languishes in the Senate."
"Both President George W. Bush and Senator John F. Kerry have stated for the record that they oppose a draft. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld also has opposed the draft on numerous occasions."
"Since 1980, the Selective Service System has discharged its mission of preparing to manage a draft if and when Congress and the President so direct. The House action proves that the Selective Service has gotten no such direction. That being the case, the Agency will maintain its readiness as required by law, and to register young men between the ages of 18 and 25. That mission has been reaffirmed frequently by successive Administrations and by Congress under the leadership of both parties." |
NOTE: That the sponsors of HR 163 and it's corresponding Senate Bill S89 are all DEMOCRATS
Senator Ernest F. Hollings SC-D, sponsor of S.89
Rep. Charles B. Rangel NY15 - Democrat - sponsor of H.R.163
Rep. Neil Abercrombie, Neil HI1- , cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/7/2003
Rep Brown, Corrine [FL-3] cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Christensen, Donna M. [VI] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 5/19/2004
Rep Clay, Wm. Lacy [MO-1] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Conyers, John, Jr. [MI-14] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/7/2003
Rep Cummings, Elijah E. [MD-7] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Hastings, Alcee L. [FL-23] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Jackson-Lee, Sheila [TX-18] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Lewis, John [GA-5] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/7/2003
Rep McDermott, Jim [WA-7] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/7/2003
Rep Moran, James P. [VA-8] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Norton, Eleanor Holmes [DC] - cosponsor of H.R.163 as of 1/28/2003
Rep Stark, Fortney Pete CA13 - Democrat
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Candidate had declared mice "only a nuisance".
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WilliamShipley
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Posts: 37
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| Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2004 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Ret. SMCS wrote: | Try as you might, you will never convince younger voters of this. The MSM only wants to say that GWB will institute a draft!
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Judo teaches us that it is easier to redirect a force than to stop one. What I am suggesting is that we pass around on the various groups that we frequent something like the following:
John Kerry to reinstate the draft?
In recent months there have been persistent rumors about a reinstatement of the draft. This is puzzling in view of the insistence of the President and the Secretary of defense that we have sufficient forces and that the all-volunteer military is a success and that there will be no draft. So why does this rumor continue?
The answer can be found in Senator Kerry’s continued insistence that there are not enough troops in Iraq, his stated plan to add two more active duty divisions to the military, his statement that the current forces are being kept too long. Senator Kerry has repeatedly assured the nation that he is going to continue the pursuit of Osama bin Laden as well as maintaining our forces in Iraq and Afganistan. The Senator is aware that there are very few nations with forces that could add to ours, even if he can convince them. Certainly introducing Russian forces to the region is out of the question.
So with the need to replace the current forces, add new forces, and maintain our commitments, where do the troops come from? A draft. This is why Senator Kerry, unlike the President, has persistently refused to rule out a draft. Would the Democrats actually re-institute a draft? Well, they recently tried, and were soundly defeated. But that’s the first step. Trial balloons are being floated, Terry McAuliffe said, “Well the reason we may have to have a draft in..it's..it's a discussion we need to have cause nine out of ten active troops are committed over in Iraq.”
Should the Senator win the election, he will point to the rumors that he’s encouraged that the President is planning to reintroduce the draft as evidence that it is something started by the previous administration. And he’s off the hook. |
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reasonable
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 18
Location: Massachusetts
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| Posted: Mon Nov 01, 2004 12:07 am Post subject: Re: Kerry and Draft |
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| JackMcC wrote: | | In point of fact, as recently as July Kerry supported a MANDATORY two year service obligation for graduating high school seniors. It was on his website as part of his "100 days to renew America" plan. He took the page down about two/three weeks prior to his convention. You can still find it in one of several archive storing sights. |
It's here:
http://web.archive.org/web/20040210043828/www.johnkerry.com/issues/natservice/
Quote:
"As part of his 100 day plan to change America, John Kerry will propose a comprehensive service plan that includes requiring mandatory service for high school students and four years of college tuition in exchange for two years of national service." |
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