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[PhantomSgt]

[Knighthawk]

I am kinda partial to mine fields and guard towers
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Regards,
Brian

Beware of the lollipop of mediocrity! Lick it once and you'll suck forever.

If guns kill people, then I can blame misspelled words on my pencil.

Knighthawk's Pictures!

[PhantomSgt]

[PhantomSgt]

Here is one I proposed a while ago for securing the borders.

Each year thousands of troops train in the high desert of California at the National Desert Warfare Training Center. The rotation of these groups is a monumental task and costs a great deal of money for airlift and trains to move equipment and troops to and from the site. The training they receive is first class and has prepared our troops well for the desert campaign. My idea was to extend this training for the troops.

Each group that graduates would deploy along the southern border of the US with their support equipment and practice interdiction techniques on illegal aliens and drug runners. I believe this training would be useful when you consider the situation with the borders in Iraq. The sidebar to all this activity is deterrence through a show of force and the chance to assist our overwhelmed border patrol with stemming the tide of illegal aliens or worse (terrorists) crossing our southern border. Deployed units would stay on station until relieved by the next graduating class and rotate back for unit movement to their home station. The airplanes and trains are already bought and we might as well get our moneys worth before sending them home..

This continuous interdiction training exercise would be the least intrusive (publicly) and yet provide a force to be reckoned with by having thousands of troops training along the border.

NOTE: 4,000 to 5,000 troops rotate thru the NTC at Fort Irwin each month.
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Retired AF E-8

Independent that leans right of center.

[lrb111]

That's one of teh best ideas i've heard in awhile. Functional real life training.
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said Democratic Chairman Terry McAuliffe. "It is inexcusable to mock service and sacrifice."
well, when even the DNC can see it,,,,, then kerry is toast.

[SBD]

These are all great ideas, but everyone seems to be focused on the effect rather than the cause. The problem is with the Mexican Government and their corrupt government officials which keep the people from prospering. We can not fault the illegals who are searching for a better life, especially since most of us are here in America because our ancestors sought the very same thing.

Someone mentioned taking over Mexico and Canada and make them part of the United States. This is the idea, but not through military force. The United States needs to follow the current European Union model and begin the creation of the American Continental Union. To join the Union, each member would have to meet certain qualifications including a single currency which would be the US Dollar. Members would have to adopt the Human Rights and Freedoms established in our Constitution. Mexico would be forced to change from "Guilty until Proven Innocent" to "Innocent until Proven Guilty". A regional volunteer Military Force would be established along the lines of the current United States volunteer force which would create the largest and most technically advanced force in the world.

Another reason this approach needs to be put into action is to avoid the problems that are going to destroy the European Union in the not so distant future. Mexico and Canada are for the most part Christian societies. Mexico also has a 2.85 children born/woman fertility rate. This is important because America needs to keep a Birth Rate that offsets the aging population. When the birth rate falls between 1-1.5, then a country must import replacements to keep up with the aging population. This is why the Muslim population in Europe is growing, The Europeans have to import people from countries with large populations which are poor Islamic countries. In 30 years there will be 30,000,000 less Europeans and the continent will turn more Islamic then Christian. As Europe's aging population grows, we will see the collaspe of their Economy. The failed Socialist policies of over taxation and handouts including Social Security will not be able to sustain their aging population. This is the main reason the United States does not control our border because our fertility rate is around 2 thanks to the Red States which teach family values.

The next time a Liberal tells you that the Blue States support the Red States, remind then that the Blue States will cease to exist if the Red States did not produce children.

I hope all this rambling makes some sense. The border issue is a very complicated issue but nothing will get solved until there is reform in Mexico and in the meantime, America still benefits from a steady supply of workers to offset our own aging baby boomer population.

SBD

[PhantomSgt]

[ScottyDog]

Having lived in So Calif all my life, I can offer a solution which used to be done but because of the border lobby has been discontinued.

Put the employers in jail or fine them or both.

I used to be a supervisor in a factory. My Boss was adamant that we not employ illegal Aliens.

Most of the factories around us did however look the other way when employing Illegal Aliens.

In the 1970's, the border patrol used to run sweeps and actually fined the employers. In addition, they used to deport the Illegals.

When was the last time you read about an employer being fined?

So California has turned into a third world country. Our Hospitals have been bankrupted and turned into Mexican birthing centers and whey US citizens need emergency care they have to endure 8-24 hour waits to get emergency care.

This is but one of my solutions. Closing the borders and increased law enforcement along our borders is not enough. I too am in favor of the military on the borders but we must hold the employers responsible for giving an incentive for them to come here in the first place.

[PhantomSgt]

Most illegal aliens stop by and obtain fraudulent residency documents such as, SS Cards, DL, Green Cards and other forgeries that an employer would normally check. The 6th District Court ruled several years ago that an employer is not a document expert and when presented with such documents for employment not prosecuted. Most employers make photocopies of these documents and place them in the personnel file to isolate them from the law.

If you are from SOCAL you know that most public parks in East and South LA have a cottage industry in forged documents that are very good, nearly as good as the original.

Raiding businesses and rounding up illegal aliens is not the politically correct thing to do and has also been challenged in court. Most illegal aliens are picked up in street sweeps or stings or law enforcement checks for traffic stops or incidents and yes they are quietly bussed back to the border. The INS does not want to reveal the method of their operations and there may be a generic press release, but that is all. Since this is not very newsworthy unless they were Muslims, you may not hear about it at all.
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Retired AF E-8

Independent that leans right of center.

[ScottyDog]

PhantomSgt

You are correct about the phony documents but the INS no longer do sweeps in California.

I am retired from Law Enforcement. The dirty little secret is that the INS does not deport unless the Illegal has committed a Felony. Even then they are given endless appeal hearings.

10 years ago. I had 25 Illegal Aliens in my booking lobby for misdemeanor complaints and called the INS.

I was immediately called into my Sargent's office and told not to call INS ever again. I was threatened with termination for doing my job.

Before the election, the INS conducted a 3 day sweep in Pomona and rounded up 190 Illegals. Ada Hutchinson stopped the sweeps under pressure from the Borders Lobby.

The employers are responsible for immigration mess because they are addicted to paying sub standard wages and forcing the taxpayers to subsidize cheap labor.

In California, the taxpayers are on the hook for approx 5 billion dollars a year in Health care and other benefits for illegal aliens.

You may be correct about the legal nuances of our corrupt legal system but if we are ever to stop the invasion of our country we are going to have to use common sense and realize these people will not come here if they are not going to be employed and given free health care.

[scotty61]

Boy, are you right. It's like throwing a steak on the ground and being shocked that the dog ate it.
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John Kerry. A Neville Chamberlain for our times.

[ScottyDog]

Good Article describing what I was trying to convay

http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=2570&c=13

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The Costs of Illegal Immigration to Californians: Executive Summary

Analysis of the latest Census data indicates that California's illegal immigrant population is costing the state's taxpayers more than $10.5 billion per year for education, medical care and incarceration. Even if the estimated tax contributions of illegal immigrant workers are subtracted, net outlays still amount to nearly $9 billion per year. The annual fiscal burden from those three areas of state expenditures amounts to about $1,183 per household headed by a native-born resident.
This analysis looks specifically at the costs to the state for education, health care and incarceration resulting from illegal immigration. These three are the largest cost areas, and they are the same three areas analyzed in a 1994 study conducted by the Urban Institute, which provides a useful baseline for comparison ten years later. Other studies have been conducted in the interim, showing trends that support the conclusions of this report.
As this report will note, other significant costs associated with illegal immigration exist and should be taken into account by federal and state officials. But, even without accounting for all of the numerous areas in which costs associated with illegal immigration are being incurred by California taxpayers, the programs analyzed in this study indicate that the burden is substantial and that the costs are rapidly increasing.
The more than $10.1 billion in costs incurred by California taxpayers is composed of outlays in the following areas:
• Education. Based on estimates of the illegal immigrant population in California and documented costs of K-12 schooling, Californians spend approximately $7.7 billion annually on education for illegal immigrant children and for their U.S.-born siblings. Nearly 15 percent of the K-12 public school students in California are children of illegal aliens.
• Health care. Uncompensated medical outlays for health care provided to the state's illegal alien population amount to about $1.4 billion a year.
• Incarceration. The cost of incarcerating illegal aliens in California's prisons and jails amounts to about $1.4 billion a year (not including related law enforcement and judicial expenditures or the monetary costs of the crimes that led to their incarceration).
State and local taxes paid by the unauthorized immigrant population go toward offsetting these costs, but they do not come near to matching the expenses. The total of such payments can generously be estimated at about $1.6 billion per year.
The fiscal costs of illegal immigration do not end with these three major cost areas. The total costs of illegal immigration to the state's taxpayers would be considerably higher if other cost areas such as special English instruction, school feeding programs, or welfare benefits for American workers displaced by illegal alien workers were added into the equation.
While the primary responsibility for combating illegal immigration rests with the federal government, there are many measures that state and local governments can take to combat the problem. Californians should not be expected to assume this already large and growing burden from illegal immigration simply because businesses or other special interests benefit from being able to employ lower cost workers. The state must adopt measures to systematically collect information on illegal alien use of taxpayer-funded services and on where they are employed. Policies could then be pursued to hold employers financially accountable.
The state could also enter into a cooperative agreement with the federal government for training local law enforcement personnel in immigration law so that illegal immigrants apprehended for criminal activities may be turned over to immigration authorities for removal from the country. Similarly, local officials who have adopted "sanctuary" measures that shield illegal aliens from being reported to the immigration authorities should be urged to repeal them.
November 2004

[PhantomSgt]

[SBD]

I also live in So Cal, in beautiful San Diego and I would not trade it for anything even though the average home sells for $450,000. Everything runs in cycles and what goes up must come down. The problem in California is in Sacramento more then it is in San Ysidro. If it wasn't for Los Angeles and San Francisco, Bush would have won the state.
Click here for map

Also, how can we expect anyone to respect our immigration laws when those caught smuggling illegals across the border are not even charged. Some of you might have seen the news story recently that showed a little girl hiding inside a pinata at the San Ysidro border crossing. What the National Media neglected to tell you was that the American driver of that vehicle was never charged and was free to go on his way. That is an outrage which gives everyone the green light to smuggle illegals across with no fear of punishment. If the Dems in Sacramento had their way, the illegals would start driving themselves across with their new California Drivers License.

SBD

[PhantomSgt]