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noc PO1
Joined: 24 Aug 2004 Posts: 492 Location: Dublin, CA
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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It is too bad Tim Russert didn't have this from Kerry's journal:
Quote: | "The banks of the [Rach Giang Thanh River] whistled by as we churned out mile after mile at full speed. On my left were occasional open fields that allowed us a clear view into Cambodia. At some points, the border was only fifty yards away and it then would meander out to several hundred or even as much as a thousand yards away, always making one wonder what lay on the other side." |
This entry taken from Brinkley's "Tour of Duty" was from Kerry's final mission in Vietnam. |
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rbshirley Founder
Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 394
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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shawa wrote: | Yes, they were the bad guys who overthrew the
Government in Cambodia and slaughtered millions!!!
Open your mouth and put your foot in it, Johnboy!! |
Captain's Quarters comments on Kerry's latest iteration of Christmas in Cambodia
Captain Ed wrote: |
January 31, 2005
So Many Names, So Little Capacity For Thought
I have received e-mail today asking why I'm not making a bigger deal of
this portion of the Meet the Press transcript from yesterday, in which John
Kerry appears to accuse American intelligence service of running weapons
to the Communists during Viet Nam:
---
MR. RUSSERT: And you have a hat that the CIA agent gave you?
SEN. KERRY: I still have the hat that he gave me, and I hope the guy would
come out of the woodwork and say, "I'm the guy who went up with John
Kerry. We delivered weapons to the Khmer Rouge on the coastline
of Cambodia [emphasis mine]." We went out of Ha Tien, which is right in
Vietnam. We went north up into the border. And I have some photographs
of that, and that's what we did. So, you know, the two were jumbled
together, but we were on the Cambodian border on Christmas Eve, absolutely.
---
The Khmer Rouge, of course, were the Cambodian Communist rebels that
wound up sacking the country after we bailed out of Southeast Asia. Why
Kerry would think that we ran weapons to the Communists in Cambodia
while battling them in Viet Nam is beyond me. It's apparent that he's
making this story up as he goes along. Every time he's asked about
Christmas in Cambodia, he changes the story. This time, he came up with
a name that fits with the subject matter, but he's so clueless that he either
didn't know or couldn't remember exactly what the Khmer Rouge were.
It's yet another marker of the dishonesty we've come to expect from the
junior senator from Massachusetts. He won't sign the Form 180, either,
even with his promise to do so in the same interview. His prevarication
has become pathological.
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Last edited by rbshirley on Tue Feb 01, 2005 12:21 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Schadow Vice Admiral
Joined: 30 Sep 2004 Posts: 936 Location: Huntsville, Alabama
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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Part of the transcript of the MTP interview reads:
Quote: | MR. RUSSERT: You cast yourself as a potential commander in chief during the campaign, particularly at the convention, "I am John Kerry reporting for duty." What affect do you believe this book, "Unfit for Command," and the Swift Boat Veterans had on your candidacy?
SEN. KERRY: Well, that's for others to judge, Tim. I don't know. I mean, obviously I could have and should have responded faster and more forcefully, I think, to that. But lies and smears were proven in the front pages of The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal. My crew, others, all spoke to those lies and will continue to. But, you know, there's a new communication structure in America. And I think we could have done a better job of addressing it obviously. But that wasn't--you know, what decided this race in the end was really 9/11. And, you know, I am not going to worry about the past. I am going to go forward to the future. |
As I remember, the press ginned up a huge red herring out of the fact that Hospitalman Carreon was the individual who signed Dr. Letson's report on Kerry's first bandaid "wound". The press trumpeted that Carreon WASN'T EVEN A DOCTOR!!! and therefore the whole UFC book MUST be a pack of lies. From then on, the book (along with the Swifties) was dismissed by the press as 'discredited'.
Does anyone recall any claim by the Swifties that was actually found to be erroneous, false, or a lie? I honestly cannot.
Schadow _________________ Capt, 8th U.S. Army, Korea '53 - '54 |
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DougReese Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004 Posts: 396
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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noc wrote: | It is too bad Tim Russert didn't have this from Kerry's journal:
Quote: | "The banks of the [Rach Giang Thanh River] whistled by as we churned out mile after mile at full speed. On my left were occasional open fields that allowed us a clear view into Cambodia. At some points, the border was only fifty yards away and it then would meander out to several hundred or even as much as a thousand yards away, always making one wonder what lay on the other side." |
This entry taken from Brinkley's "Tour of Duty" was from Kerry's final mission in Vietnam. |
I'll have to go look it up (in the book) to be sure, but I thought his final mission was far away from Cambodia -- on March 13, 1969.
Doug |
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NavyChief Rear Admiral
Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Posts: 627 Location: Boise, Idaho
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 12:23 am Post subject: |
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DougReese wrote: | noc wrote: | It is too bad Tim Russert didn't have this from Kerry's journal:
Quote: | "The banks of the [Rach Giang Thanh River] whistled by as we churned out mile after mile at full speed. On my left were occasional open fields that allowed us a clear view into Cambodia. At some points, the border was only fifty yards away and it then would meander out to several hundred or even as much as a thousand yards away, always making one wonder what lay on the other side." |
This entry taken from Brinkley's "Tour of Duty" was from Kerry's final mission in Vietnam. |
I'll have to go look it up (in the book) to be sure, but I thought his final mission was far away from Cambodia -- on March 13, 1969.
Doug |
Yes, Doug. His final mission was on Mar 13, 1969. Kerry was in Cam Ranh Bay two days later on the COMFLOT ONE staff. I have the personnel records for the squadron.
- Chief _________________ Working with Senator Kerry four years in the POW/MIA Office left me thinking -- when did the man ever do any work? |
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rbshirley Founder
Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 394
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:25 am Post subject: |
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More comment concening Kerry's laugable performance on Meet The Press.
This is an extract from an article by Bob Weir on The American Thinker
Bob Weir wrote: |
Senator Kerry takes a stand, or two, or three
January 31st, 2005
Weir Thinking About It
As I watched Senator John Kerry on Meet the Press on Sunday I imagined
an appropriate scenario for one of Johnny Carson’s skits. As “Carnac the
Magnificent,” Johnny puts the envelope to his head and says: “The answer
is, yes and no, pro and con, for and against.” Then he opens the envelope
and reads: “Describe John Kerry’s position on any major issue.”
Tim Russert, moderator for the weekly interview show, asked Kerry if he
agreed with what Senator Ted Kennedy said about immediate withdrawal
of some troops after the Iraq election. “No,” was Kerry’s terse reply.
Then, there was the inevitable, “But,” as the former presidential candidate
began his usual two-step into verbal ambiguity. In the next few sentences
he agreed with his Massachusetts colleague as many times as he disagreed
with him. It was déjà vu all over again as Russert played a video of Kerry
during the campaign. “I actually voted for the military spending bill before
I voted against it,” Kerry said.
When Russert brought up the claims by Kerry that he was in Cambodia on
Christmas Eve of 1968, even though members of his unit said it was untrue,
Kerry said, “I was on the border.” Then he quickly added, “Did I go into
Cambodia, yes I went into Cambodia. It was not on that night, but I did
go there.” The reason this is important is because it goes to the very
heart of the man’s propensity to exaggerate, as Russert emphasized by
showing an editorial from the New York Daily News in which Kerry’s
veracity was questioned.
Once again, the junior Senator from Massachusetts did a quick shuffle by
appearing indignant and attempting to distort what others heard him say.
More ....
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Schadow Vice Admiral
Joined: 30 Sep 2004 Posts: 936 Location: Huntsville, Alabama
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:37 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | ....the man’s propensity to exaggerate.... |
"Lie" is a much more economical word. One syllable instead of four. Much less ink. More accurate.
A great piece by Weir.
Schadow _________________ Capt, 8th U.S. Army, Korea '53 - '54 |
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kate Admin
Joined: 14 May 2004 Posts: 1891 Location: Upstate, New York
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:02 am Post subject: |
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More feedback on Kerry's MTP interview
http://davidlimbaugh.com/020105.htm
Quote: | Kerry Reminds Voters Why They Rejected Him
February 1, 2005
David Limbaugh on Kerry’s MTP interview
~snip
The only thing useful about Kerry's analysis is that it can serve as a sobering reminder of how fortunate the United States, the Iraqi people and all freedom-loving peoples of the world are that Kerry lost Ohio.
If Kerry is entertaining fantasies of running again in 2008, his handlers ought to at least suggest a new mantra -- one with a fighting chance of signaling that he has a clue about what is important. Until then, he'll be nothing more than a washed-up wind-up doll spouting "unilateralism," no matter the question, no matter the reality, and history will march on without him.
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_________________ .
one of..... We The People |
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noc PO1
Joined: 24 Aug 2004 Posts: 492 Location: Dublin, CA
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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NavyChief wrote: | DougReese wrote: | noc wrote: | It is too bad Tim Russert didn't have this from Kerry's journal:
Quote: | "The banks of the [Rach Giang Thanh River] whistled by as we churned out mile after mile at full speed. On my left were occasional open fields that allowed us a clear view into Cambodia. At some points, the border was only fifty yards away and it then would meander out to several hundred or even as much as a thousand yards away, always making one wonder what lay on the other side." |
This entry taken from Brinkley's "Tour of Duty" was from Kerry's final mission in Vietnam. |
I'll have to go look it up (in the book) to be sure, but I thought his final mission was far away from Cambodia -- on March 13, 1969.
Doug |
Yes, Doug. His final mission was on Mar 13, 1969. Kerry was in Cam Ranh Bay two days later on the COMFLOT ONE staff. I have the personnel records for the squadron.
- Chief |
This information was posted on August 24, 2004 on this thread:
http://www.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4254
I don't have the Brinkley book. Could someone look up the context of this journal entry and post it back here just for clarity. |
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Beatrice1000 Resource Specialist
Joined: 10 Aug 2004 Posts: 1179 Location: Minneapolis, MN
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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There is nothing in kerry’s views or plans about what “should be done in Iraq” that the Bush admin. has not done and is not currently doing. I just can’t let this “kerry 4-pointer” go time after time – oh wait, I forgot, one of the “points” has been accomplished (my goodness)– so we’re actually dealing with a “3-pointer.” His arguments are empty and his continual reference to “getting it right” by following the “kerry plan” is too disgusting -- we are already doing every single thing he is complaining about – however, it is being done within the context of the actual situation on the ground and the actual situation in the world which contains “players” other than the USA --- BIG PICTURE REALITIES that kerry, lost in his narrow worldview and vaporous, self-serving, ideological arrogance is unable to comprehend. Below are just a few items that directly contradict kerry’s arguments and show the emptiness of his attack:
EXCERPT FROM "NBC NEWS MEET THE PRESS" TRANSCRIPT:
kerry speaking:
“The four steps were,
-- 1, massive rapid training.
-- 2, you've got to do reconstruction, and you've got to get the services to the Iraqis.
-- 3, you've got to bring the international community in the effort.
-- 4, you've got to have the elections.
Well, today we did number four, we had the elections. But the other three are almost--I mean, they're lagging so significantly that the task has been made that much harder. And I will say unequivocally today that what the administration does in these next few days will decide the outcome of Iraq, and this is--not maybe--this is the last chance for the president to get it right.”
------------------------------------------
Kerry believes that 1-2-3 can be done “in the next few days” and so has set that as his yardstick for further attacks on the Bush admin. This “challenge” of his is beyond juvenile. Also, with regards to all the “foreign leaders he met with” – the Mideast states regarding their offers for Iraqi training – I don’t know if the Iraqis even want some of these states – was he Allawi’s envoy on his trip? I searched and searched for an article indicating that Allawi wanted the Egyptians to train his police – but all I could find was his request for NATO to help… So Kerry is determining for the Iraqis what countries they must go to for assistance because of HIS meetings with them and because of what THEY say. This is beyond “arrogant” and is simply meddling in Iraq's affairs. It has been our policy to step back from Iraq's gov't. and let them make their own decisions. Everyone knows that...
KERRY’S #1 step: “MASSIVE, RAPID TRAINING”
My comment: “massive, rapid training” is not reasonable. It is unknown how many security personnel will apply for the positions considering the present conditions – there may not be a “massive” turnout; and rapid training does not produce the best forces (& is also something the dems have been complaining about!).
Some of THE REALITY:
“Coalition to increase training of Iraqi forces” (01/30/05)
The head of the US Central Command has said that one of the most important things that will happen following this weekend's national elections in Iraq is that coalition forces will increase the level of training and partnership with Iraqi security forces. …
“Defense Minister tours training mission for Iraqi engineers” (12/17/04)
German Defense Minister Peter Struck last weekend paid a visit to the German troops working to train Iraqi army engineers in the United Arab Emirates (UAE). … While in Germany, Allawi praised Germany's work to train Iraqi police and soldiers in the UAE and thanked Germany for its decision to forgive much of Iraq's debt. Last spring, Germany started a program to train Iraqi police, and more recently, the country added a training program for Iraqi military officers as well as a program to supply the Iraqi military with equipment such as military vehicles and trucks. In November, Germany joined the United States to successfully persuade the Paris Club of wealthy creditor nations to wipe out 80% of the debt its members are owed by Iraq.
“EU looks to train Iraqi police, judges” (1/27/05)
The European Union hopes to offer President George W. Bush help in training Iraqi police and judges when he visits Brussels for a Feb. 22 summit aimed at mending transatlantic ties, an EU official said on Thursday. The draft plan envisages training 700-800 senior Iraqi personnel in EU capitals and is intended to put into practice a pledge made by EU ministers last November to help Iraq develop its justice and security system.
“NATO to train Iraqi Armed Forces” (6/28/04)
Leaders of the 26-member Nato military alliance have agreed to offer training to the security forces of Iraq's new interim government. … And French President Jacques Chirac repeated his opposition to a Nato role inside the country. "We have decided today to offer Nato's assistance to the government of Iraq with the training of its security forces," the Nato statement said. "We therefore also encourage nations to contribute to the training of the Iraqi armed forces." … Correspondents say the vagueness of the statement reflects the fact that member countries such as France - a key opponent of the US-led invasion of Iraq last year - were said to be reluctant to get too heavily involved. … Sixteen member nations have sent troops individually to join coalition forces in Iraq. …
KERRY’S #2 step: RECONSTRUCTION/SERVICES
(a small glimpse at): THE REALITY:
“Water supply restored in Baghdad” (01/24/05)
Fresh drinking water flowed in thousands of Baghdad homes for the first time in a week yesterday after engineers repaired recently damaged supply pipes.
“US engineers express confidence in Iraqi projects” (01/30/05)
"It's all about services," said Army Captain Jessy Yeates, manager of essential services for the 256th Brigade Combat Team. "It's all about getting services to the people." The captain, assigned to the brigade's 1088th Engineer Battalion, is responsible for improving electrical, water, sewage and medical services to hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in the 256th's area of operations west of Baghdad, Iraq.
“Over $10 million invested in reconstructing village roads in Iraq” (01/23/05)
More than $10 million is being invested in reconstructing and paving almost 200 kilometres of rural village roads in four northern Iraq provinces. … In October of last year, construction work began on 103 kilometers with the remaining 97 scheduled to start in coming months. All work is being done by local contractors…..
“$20 million allocated to renovate Iraqi police stations” (01/20/05)
The US Army Corps of Engineers Gulf Region Division, Southern District plans to help the Iraqi Police Force perform its mission by renovating about 230 police stations in southern Iraq. … Renovations will include updating electrical systems, replacing old plumbing and some painting. “The big piece,” said Bennett, “will be to offer them force protection – things like security guards, walls, security lights and towers on the stations. They’ll have bullet-proof windows and new floors.”
“Iraqi Air Force to receive $5.8 million in aircrafts” (1/19/05)
The Iraqi Air Force’s 70th Squadron received the first two American-made SAMA CH2000 light air surveillance aircraft on this week in Basra.
“Army distributes wheat seeds to revitalise Iraqi agriculture” (06/01/05)
The US Army's 256th Brigade Combat Team 'Tigers' are helping distribute high quality wheat seed as part of Operation Amber Waves, a programme to revitalise agriculture in the predominately rural sector just west of Baghdad.
“Plans to boost electricity output in Iraq” (07/12/04)
The US hopes to boost the availability of electricity throughout Iraq to at least 18 hours a day by the end of next year from 11 to 15 hours now, the top US aid official said…. "Our work in Iraq is the largest reconstruction project since the Marshall Plan," he said, referring to the massive effort to rebuild European nations after the Second World War.
KERRY’S #3 step: “INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY”
Dare we look at this REALITY:
“EC proposes additional assistance for Iraq” (01/28/05)
The European Commission (EC) proposed a new EUR200 million ($260 million) aid package for Iraq on Friday, two days ahead of elections in the country, according to a statement by the commission. The aid package is meant to "support the political and economic transition in Iraq," the statement said. European Union Commissioner for External Relations Benita Ferrero-Waldner said that the proposal means that the EU will be significant partners for the new Iraqi administration.
“Oil ministry awards southern oil fields study” (01/28/05)
Iraq's Ministry of Oil has awarded a consortium of three international firms a contract to conduct a reservoir study of the Suba-Luhais oil fields in southern Iraq, officials have said. … Vitol, Anadarko Petroleum Corp. and Dome Oil of the United Arab Emirates have been awarded the study, which is separate to the Suba-Luhais development contract, which hasn't been awarded yet, … Ireland's Petrel Resources and Canada's Ivanhoe Energy Inc. have said they are already bidding for the development contract.
“BP chosen to conduct Iraq oilfield study” (1/16/05)
British oil major BP has been awarded a contract to conduct research on Iraq's Rumaila oilfield, one of the country's biggest fields, the company said.
“Bulgarian companies become direct contractors in Iraq” (01/29/05)
Bulgarian companies will be allowed to participate in the reconstruction of Iraq as direct contractors.
“Russian oil major ready to start working in Iraq after election” (1/25/05)
(Russia)…Fedun said that before the new year a LUKoil delegation met Iraqi leaders in Iraq. "As soon as a legitimate government is formed in Iraq, we will be able to resume the work of our joint committees and start working directly at the oilfields," he said.
“Iraq Procurement 2005 - Amman provides 'gateway to Iraq'” (12/17/04)
At the last event, held on 22-24 November 2004, corporate executives were able to meet with Iraqis to discuss the overarching needs of Iraq's key industry sectors, while the meetings between international and local companies saw much business conducted and many relationships formed, which should prove fruitful to all parties concerned. Building on that success, Iraq Procurement 2005 – Amman will take place on 28-30 June 2005 in Amman, Jordan, and will include a large international exhibition, expert seminars, industry-specific sector meetings and 'Meet the Buyers' sessions, where global corporate executives have the exclusive opportunity to meet with their Iraqi contemporaries. The event has the full support of the Iraqi-British Business Council (IBBC).
----------------------------------------------------------------
The above is just a quick grab of bits of info., and sure, we can talk about mistakes and what has not been done yet -- BUT, what we are accomplishing is ASTOUNDING on all fronts – the only way anyone can complain about our objectives and efforts in Iraq is to completely and totally ignore and deny what we are actually doing. The “kerry steps for success” that kerry discusses over and over and serves up as an indictment against America’s work in Iraq ignores, denies and belittles the loss of life and incredible work of our military and everyone associated with our efforts, and is so twisted a view, is such madness, that I can only compare it to me coming on this Board today and posting a message that the Swiftees should start up a website immediately and that I can provide 4-steps to show them how that must be done!!
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Beatrice1000 Resource Specialist
Joined: 10 Aug 2004 Posts: 1179 Location: Minneapolis, MN
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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Little article that makes a big point:
“Name Calling,” by Pat Sajak (1/31/05)
(excerpts/emphasis mine)
I am about to call someone a name. ….
….Enter Mass. Senator and former Democratic Presidential candidate John Kerry. Here’s a man who should know something about heroics, as he reminded us a thousand or so times during the campaign. On the very day Iraqis were voting, most of them for the first time in their lives, here’s some of what Kerry had to say on NBC’s “Meet the Press”: "It is significant that there is a vote in Iraq, but ... no one in the United States should try to overhype this election. ….
.......
His dour demeanor on “Meet the Press” and in another interview Sunday contrasted sharply with images coming from Iraq, and his comments sounded small and petty. You would expect something more from a man who, less than three months ago, lost a race for the Presidency of the United States. It was a despicable performance. So now it’s time for me to get this off my chest.
Mr. Kerry, you are a jerk
There. I feel better.
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shawa CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004 Posts: 2004
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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WOW, Beatrice, THANK YOU for this list of the realities in Iraq.
This REBUTTAL TO KERRY should be posted all over the internet
and media outlets. It is exactly what our troops are so disheartened about
why the MSM doesn't report the accomplishments that are ongoing in
Iraq.
The Bush plan is working! But I'll bet when all is said and done,
Kerry will stand up and take credit, saying Bush stole HIS 4 point plan
and implemented it.
You should submit this REBUTTAL TO KERRY to FOX and elsewhere. |
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d19thdoc PO3
Joined: 17 May 2004 Posts: 280 Location: New Jersey Shore
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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Jerry Corsi's plan is to run against Kerry for the Senate is in keeping with the unfinished business of getting this dangerous, treasonous and mendacious fool out of public life before he does our country any more harm.
This MTP interview is a typical example of how Kerry can choose the time and place to re-write hsitory - especially his own history, in such a way that he can get away with it.
Notice how no one caught the fact that he is now admitting that he repeatedly lied about a material fact that was central to his campain? Or, if we do see it, how he is able to downplay its significance; and he gets away with it? The fact and the lie - that all of his militray records had been released long ago.
What makes me more sick to my stomach than Kerry himself is that so many people fall for his obvious and transparent fakery - or more exactly, that they are suckered by the methods of his dishonesty. He repeatedly insults the intelligence of the American people and they repeatedly accept it and ask for more. _________________ For The Honor of the Fifty-Eight Thousand.
"He Can Lose, But He Can Not Hide" |
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d19thdoc PO3
Joined: 17 May 2004 Posts: 280 Location: New Jersey Shore
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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I just read the transcript of the MTP carefully and get this:
Quote: | SEN. KERRY: I'd be happy to put the records out. We put all the records out that I had been sent by the military. Then at the last moment, they sent some more stuff, which had some things that weren't even relevant to the record. So when we get--I'm going to sit down with them and make sure that they are clear and I am clear as to what is in the record and what isn't in the record (emphasis mine) and we'll put it out. I have no problem with that. |
I have been told that the record of his "Other Than Honorable" discharge was not only "corrected" but that the records pertaining to that bad discharge and the paperwork used to change it were, in fact, probably destroyed.
I think this verbal ballet/bullcrap passage quoted is in reference to this. He seems to be saying that he will exercise some kind of oversight as to exactly what is released, a kind of editing for relevance. He wants to be sure that there is no trace of what is "not in the record" and no chance of that being released - otherwise, why this odd and very twisted circumlocution? What he is saying is that he - personally - wants to be sure that things "not in the record" are not accidentally released!!! He is, essentially, referring to two different kinds of documents - those that are in the record" and those that "aren't in the record."
What is implied here is that he wants to be sure that what is released is what is supposed to be in the record, as opposed to what is not supposed to be in the record.
Think about it. _________________ For The Honor of the Fifty-Eight Thousand.
"He Can Lose, But He Can Not Hide" |
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LimaCharlie PO2
Joined: 25 Aug 2004 Posts: 386 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Tue Feb 01, 2005 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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Signing an SF-180 doesn't mean all of the records will be made public. He will sign the SF-180, have Sandy Burglar retrieve them, and put out a few more pages including the afore mentioned medical records. He will then say, "See, I signed the SF-180 and I told you the SwiftVets were lying." Only making all of the records available to the public will tell the true story. I am taking bets. _________________ I was going to become an anarchist, but they had too many rules. |
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