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GenrXr
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 1720
Location: Houston
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 Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:08 am Post subject: STS Discovery Should be Landing Soon |
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A prayer for the Shuttle before bed tonight. God please hold the shuttle together while she makes re-entry. Do not punish the shuttle crew for the agencies hubris and allow for her safe landing.
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"An activist is the person who cleans up the water, not the one claiming its dirty."
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to stand by and do nothing." Edmund Burke (1729-1797), Founder of Conservative Philosophy |
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becca1223
PO3
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 293
Location: Colonial Heights, VA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Amen |
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blue9t3
Admiral
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 1246
Location: oregon
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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reminds me of a bumper sticker that read------ honk if anything falls off!
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Army_(Ret)
Lt.Jg.
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 108
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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| blue9t3 wrote: | | reminds me of a bumper sticker that read------ honk if anything falls off! |
NASA Cuts off Nose to Spite Face (or) For Political correctness
(My own Title)
"Very Interesting article"
http://www.investors.com/editorial/issues03.asp?v=8/2
Green For Launch
Political Correctness: After 2 1/2 years and $1.4 billion spent to make the space shuttle safer, the same problem that doomed Columbia now plagues Discovery. Has environmentalism doomed the shuttle program?
After the space shuttle Columbia disintegrated upon re-entry in 2003, a scathing report by the Columbia Accident Investigating Board noted the contributions NASA's "organization and culture" made to the shuttle disaster.
But the root cause for both the disintegration of the shuttle Columbia due to thermal tiles damaged by chunks of insulating foam falling off the large external fuel tank, the earlier loss of Challenger, and the repetition of the foam problem with Discovery, may be the decision imposed on NASA to use parts and materials that were more environmentally friendly.
In 1997, during the 87th space shuttle mission, similar tile damage occurred during launch. NASA's Greg Katnik stated in his December 1997 review of the problems of STS-87: "During the STS-87 mission, there was a change made on the external tank. Because of NASA's goal to use environmentally friendly products, a new method of 'foaming' the external tank had been used for this mission and the STS-86 mission."
NASA was just responding to pressure from the Environmental Protection Agency to stop using Freon, a fluorocarbon that greenies claim damages the ozone layer, in the manufacture of its thermal-insulating foam. But the politically correct foam was known to be less sticky and more brittle under extreme temperatures.
Hannes Hacker, an aerospace engineer and former flight controller at NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston, states: "The risk of a piece of debris falling off and causing significant damage to the shuttle's thermal protection system was 10 times greater with the new material than the old material."
Indeed, NASA found in 1997 after the first launch with the politically correct substitute that the Freon-free foam had destroyed nearly 11 times as many of the shuttle's ceramic tiles as had the foam containing Freon.
Similarly, the explosion of the Challenger after hot gasses burned through an O-ring joint on one of the shuttle's solid rocket boosters came after NASA was encouraged to use a new type of putty to protect the O-rings — one that didn't contain particles of environmentally unfriendly asbestos.
In 1977, the Consumer Product Safety Commission banned the use of asbestos in a wide range of paint products. NASA, through the mid-1980s, had used a commercially available, "off-the-shelf" putty manufactured by the Fuller O'Brien Paint Company in San Francisco to help seal the shuttle joints. But, fearful of legal action, the company stopped making the putty which contained asbestos.
NASA was forced to obtain a more environmentally friendly putty from a New Jersey company, but almost immediately problems were noted. A July 23, 1985, memo by budget analyst Richard Cook warned about new burn-through problems with the O-rings.
"Engineers have not yet determined the cause of the problem," Cook wrote. "Candidates include the use of a new type of putty." Six months later the Challenger blew up, killing its crew, as hot exhaust gases burned through the brittle asbestos-free O-ring putty.
Malcolm Ross, who studied asbestos as a research scientist for 41 years at the U.S. Geological Survey, noted that, about the same time, the Air Force had two launch failures with its Titan 34-D rockets after 50 straight launch successes before substituting for the asbestos-based putty.
Exploding and disintegrating space shuttles can damage the environment too.
And some frosting for the cake:
"While Collins and Noguchi chatted, NASA officials were deciding whether a torn insulation blanket protecting part of the shuttle surface could rip off and strike a damaging blow to Discovery when it re-enters the atmosphere."---- I figured as much, until I saw this, and then my blood really boiled.
Widespread environmental damage seen from shuttle
Thu Aug 4, 2005 3:01 PM BST
Printer Friendly | Email Article | RSS
By Jeff Franks
HOUSTON (Reuters) - Commander Eileen Collins said astronauts on shuttle Discovery had seen widespread environmental destruction on Earth and warned on Thursday that greater care was needed to protect natural resources.
Her comments came as NASA pondered whether to send astronauts out on an extra spacewalk to repair additional heat-protection damage on the first shuttle mission since the 2003 Columbia disaster.
Discovery is linked with the International Space Station and orbiting 220 miles above the Earth.
"Sometimes you can see how there is erosion, and you can see how there is deforestation. It's very widespread in some parts of the world," Collins said in a conversation from space with Japanese officials in Tokyo, including Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi.
"We would like to see, from the astronauts' point of view, people take good care of the Earth and replace the resources that have been used," said Collins, who was standing with Japanese astronaut Soichi Noguchi in front of a Japanese flag and holding a colorful fan.
Collins, flying her fourth shuttle mission, said the view from space made clear that Earth's atmosphere must be protected, too.
"The atmosphere almost looks like an eggshell on an egg, it's so very thin," she said. "We know that we don't have much air, we need to protect what we have."
While Collins and Noguchi chatted, NASA officials were deciding whether a torn insulation blanket protecting part of the shuttle surface could rip off and strike a damaging blow to Discovery when it re-enters the atmosphere.
They said it could require another spacewalk to fix, which would take place on Saturday if needed. A decision was expected on Thursday afternoon.
Noguchi and astronaut Steve Robinson already have done three spacewalks, including a landmark walk on Wednesday to remove loose cloth strips protruding from Discovery's belly. NASA feared the strips could cause dangerous heat damage when the shuttle lands on Monday.
COLUMBIA TRIBUTE
The combined crew of Discovery and the space station, nine in all, paid tribute on Thursday to the Columbia crew and other astronauts who have died in space accidents. They took turns speaking while television shots from the shuttle showed it passing over a sunlit Earth, then into night.
"Tragically, two years ago, we came to realize we had let our God down. We became lost in our hubris and learned once more the terrible price that must be paid for our failures," said mission specialist Charles Camarda. "In that accident, we not only lost seven colleagues, we lost seven friends."
Columbia broke apart before landing on Feb. 1, 2003, and the seven astronauts on board died.
Loose insulation foam from the fuel tank struck the wing heat shield at launch 16 days before, causing a hole that allowed superheated gases to penetrate and destroy the shuttle when it descended into the atmosphere.
NASA spent 2 1/2 years and $1 billion on safety upgrades after Columbia, but videos showed loose tank foam at Discovery's launch last week. The agency suspended shuttle flights until the foam problem is fixed.
A report in The New York Times suggested NASA was not as careful as it could have been about the foam issue.
The Times said an internal NASA memo, written in December by a retired NASA engineer brought back to monitor the quality of the foam operation, complained that deficiencies remained in the way foam was being applied to the fuel tank and warned "there will continue to be a threat of critical debris generation."
A spokesman at Johnson Space Center in Houston told Reuters he had not yet seen the Times report and could not comment.
This last article doesn't add up, no matter how you see it.
!. Collins knew the security blanket posed no threat, even while NASA was making the decision for the go or no-go spacewalk; or:
2. In one of their last public announcements, it would be an environmental speech.
In either case, the public wasn't fully informed.
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I B Squidly
Vice Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 879
Location: Cactus Patch
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 1:08 am Post subject: |
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In the original Nixon budget NASA put all of its eggs in the shuttle basket. It promised 20 flights per vehicle per year ....and each shuttle would carry a 'patch kit' to repair damaged heat tiles. So much for promises. Unmanned space, military launches and commercial applications all were back-ordered or contracted out to the European Space Agency or anywhere else that could deliver what the Shuttle never could. It's time for a new program and it's time for NASA to take it's dead hand off the monopoly. As NASA's creation derailed the X program's 'fly to space' program so today it sucks the initiative from private capital.
Environmentally, every space launch releases god awful amounts of volatile, caustic pollutants (equal to about 15 nano-seconds of Pinatubo). and that's why the Japanese and Ariane launch in South America without unrealistic regulation. EPA would not approve Cape Canaveral today though 40 years don't seem to have hurt much. There'ld never have been a space-program if the EPA was around. Funny, the observations of the astronauts on environmental degradation. Did they notice the goat herds of the ancient Greeks that left their islands barren rock? How do the describe the 'Land of Milk and Honey' the arabs found in Palestine? Where went the lions and 20 fold crop yields of Babylon? What of the swamp land that was Rome? I'l bet Chernobyl still looks green from space and free of human depradation.
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GenrXr
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 1720
Location: Houston
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| Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2005 1:45 am Post subject: |
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| I B Squidly wrote: | In the original Nixon budget NASA put all of its eggs in the shuttle basket. It promised 20 flights per vehicle per year ....and each shuttle would carry a 'patch kit' to repair damaged heat tiles. So much for promises. Unmanned space, military launches and commercial applications all were back-ordered or contracted out to the European Space Agency or anywhere else that could deliver what the Shuttle never could. It's time for a new program and it's time for NASA to take it's dead hand off the monopoly. As NASA's creation derailed the X program's 'fly to space' program so today it sucks the initiative from private capital.
Environmentally, every space launch releases god awful amounts of volatile, caustic pollutants (equal to about 15 nano-seconds of Pinatubo). and that's why the Japanese and Ariane launch in South America without unrealistic regulation. EPA would not approve Cape Canaveral today though 40 years don't seem to have hurt much. There'ld never have been a space-program if the EPA was around. Funny, the observations of the astronauts on environmental degradation. Did they notice the goat herds of the ancient Greeks that left their islands barren rock? How do the describe the 'Land of Milk and Honey' the arabs found in Palestine? Where went the lions and 20 fold crop yields of Babylon? What of the swamp land that was Rome? I'l bet Chernobyl still looks green from space and free of human depradation. |
Well written I B.
I would like to add that Burt Rutan's Space Ship One is a beautiful work of engineering, and the Discovery channel special covering the last days of the X-prize is a must see.
Black Sky: The Race for Space & Winning the X-Prize
http://shopping.discovery.com/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10000&storeId=10000&langId=-1&productId=56717
Brought tears to my eyes and convinced me we can do better then the STS.
_________________
"An activist is the person who cleans up the water, not the one claiming its dirty."
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to stand by and do nothing." Edmund Burke (1729-1797), Founder of Conservative Philosophy |
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