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84rules
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Joined: 26 Jul 2004
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
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 Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: Why did George Elliot retract his criticism of John Kerr |
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Just a guess on my part . . . .
As some of you may know, there was somewhat of a rift between various factions of the SBVT when those guys were beginning to organize.
Some guys wanted to focus only on Kerry's post-war activities. Others want to include his wartime exploits.
Perhaps Elliot is having second thoughts on the direction some of this is taking.
Perhaps he heard what was being said on Hannity's radio show, where (in my opinion) there were, to quote a former poster here, some "lies and innuendo" being tossed about.
It was all done indirectly, which is to say no one actually lied directly, but some blatantly false statements from others were introduced . . . . and I could hear Adm. Hoffman interupting when he realized things were getting out of hand. He knew some of this wasn't true, and in his own way he stopped it -- this was partly due to what Hannity was saying, and Van Odell (sp?) was replying, and getting in over his head from what I could see.
Anyway, I agree with what Bill O'Reilly and Dick Morris said last night on O'Reilly's show.
Doug |
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carpro
Admin
Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 1176
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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Drudge is now reporting that Elliott is standing firm. No retraction at all.
_________________
"If he believes his 1971 indictment of his country and his fellow veterans was true, then he couldn't possibly be proud of his Vietnam service." |
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Navy_Navy_Navy
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Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: Why did George Elliot retract his criticism of John Kerr |
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| 84rules wrote: | | What gives? This story is starting to overshadow the SwiftVets ad. |
Well, for a few minutes it did. LOL!
Now, the big story is that Mr. Elliott retracts NOTHING, stands by his story and further seems to ask what can you expect from one of the Kerry campaign biographers?
Kranish is also writing the official campaign book of the Kerry/Edwards tour, called Kerry Edwards - $10.36 on amazon.com
"Veteran Retracts Criticism of Kerry?" Not according to Mr. Elliott, TODAY - he says that the story badly misquoted him and he retracts nothing.
Hey, Senator - there are some pots better left UNSTIRRED. 
From Drudge: www.drudgereport.com
| Quote: | ANTI-KERRY VETS HANG TOUGH
Fri Aug 06 2004 13:37:12 ET
The following statement from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth concerns an article appearing in morning edition of the BOSTON GLOBE, written by GLOBE reporter and author of the official Kerry-Edwards campaign book, Mike Kranish.
"Captain George Elliott describes an article appearing in today’s edition of the BOSTON GLOBE by Mike Kranish as extremely inaccurate and highly misstating his actual views. He reaffirms his statement in the current advertisement paid for by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Captain Elliott reaffirms his affidavit in support of that advertisement, and he reaffirms his request that the ad be played.
“Additional documentation will follow.
"The article by Mr. Kranish is particularly surprising given page 102 of Mr. Kranish’s own book quoting John Kerry as acknowledging that he killed a single, wounded, fleeing Viet Cong soldier whom he was afraid would turn around.
"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has more than 250 supporters who are revealing first hand, eyewitness accounts of numerous incidents concerning John Kerry’s military service record. The organization will continue to discuss much of what John Kerry has reported as fact concerning his four-month tour of duty in Vietnam."
END |
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 396
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 9:52 pm Post subject: Re: Why did George Elliot retract his criticism of John Kerr |
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| Navy_Navy_Navy wrote: | | 84rules wrote: | | What gives? This story is starting to overshadow the SwiftVets ad. |
Well, for a few minutes it did. LOL!
Now, the big story is that Mr. Elliott retracts NOTHING, stands by his story and further seems to ask what can you expect from one of the Kerry campaign biographers?
Kranish is also writing the official campaign book of the Kerry/Edwards tour, called Kerry Edwards - $10.36 on amazon.com
"Veteran Retracts Criticism of Kerry?" Not according to Mr. Elliott, TODAY - he says that the story badly misquoted him and he retracts nothing.
Hey, Senator - there are some pots better left UNSTIRRED.
From Drudge: www.drudgereport.com
| Quote: | ANTI-KERRY VETS HANG TOUGH
Fri Aug 06 2004 13:37:12 ET
The following statement from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth concerns an article appearing in morning edition of the BOSTON GLOBE, written by GLOBE reporter and author of the official Kerry-Edwards campaign book, Mike Kranish.
"Captain George Elliott describes an article appearing in today’s edition of the BOSTON GLOBE by Mike Kranish as extremely inaccurate and highly misstating his actual views. He reaffirms his statement in the current advertisement paid for by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Captain Elliott reaffirms his affidavit in support of that advertisement, and he reaffirms his request that the ad be played.
“Additional documentation will follow.
"The article by Mr. Kranish is particularly surprising given page 102 of Mr. Kranish’s own book quoting John Kerry as acknowledging that he killed a single, wounded, fleeing Viet Cong soldier whom he was afraid would turn around.
"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has more than 250 supporters who are revealing first hand, eyewitness accounts of numerous incidents concerning John Kerry’s military service record. The organization will continue to discuss much of what John Kerry has reported as fact concerning his four-month tour of duty in Vietnam."
END |
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This is interesting, as Kranish is a stickler for details and seems to be very thorough -- at least from my experience, as I had spoken to him for several hours in the course of him researching the Globe's biography on Kerry.
But I am seeing a misleading, bordering on outright false, statement at the bottom of the post above. It appears to be from SBVT. And if they're going to get picky about whether the VC was shot in the back (and I could care less if he was or not), then this should be noted: The SBVT does NOT have 250 supporters who are revealing firsthand, eye-witness accounts . . . . . it's a little closer to 5-10. They're off by about 240, if anyone's counting.
Doug |
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ASPB
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 1680
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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Doug,
Check out Eliott's sworn statements, including the one today about Mike Kranish's article.
Tom.
http://humaneventsonline.com.edgesuite.net/unfit_aff.html
_________________
 On Sale! Order in lots of 100 now at velero@rcn.com Free for the cost of shipping All profits (if any, especially now) go to Swiftvets. The author of "Sink Kerry Swiftly" ---ASPB |
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DukeofEarl
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 1
Location: florida
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Whatever the true story, it flushed Kranish out of the woods..... |
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chief8
Seaman Recruit
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:39 pm Post subject: Kranish |
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It is now being revealed Mr. Kranish is not only a left-wing reporter, but as I understand it, he has been hired by the Kerry Campaign to do a bi-line for one of Kerry's campaign ads.
In either case, Capt. Elliott has apparently retracted what was written by Mr. Karnish. |
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 396
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:43 pm Post subject: Re: Kranish |
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| chief8 wrote: | It is now being revealed Mr. Kranish is not only a left-wing reporter, but as I understand it, he has been hired by the Kerry Campaign to do a bi-line for one of Kerry's campaign ads.
In either case, Capt. Elliott has apparently retracted what was written by Mr. Karnish. |
That just isn't true -- He is hardly a left-wing reporter.
Doug |
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 396
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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I have seen that already, Tom. I was hoping you had something more current. I anxiously await their "additional documentation".
That bit towards the end of that statement about SBVT having 250 "first hand eye-witnesses" is still flat out false.
I'll have to assume it's a mis-statement -- inadvertant. Otherwise, I'd have to say I am very disappointed.
Sort of how I felt yesterdays when I saw Drudge quoting John O'Neill as saying we had a conversation, on a topic, that we just never had.
I fear SBVT, and it might seem strange for you to think I care about this, but I do . . . . . I fear SBVT is destroying their credibility.
Doug |
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Navy_Navy_Navy
Admin
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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Kranish co-wrote a campaign biography of John Kerry.
Kranish was hired and paid to write the official campaign book for the Kerry Edwards 2004 campaign.
Kranish wrote a story which attempted to discredit a Swifty's sworn affidavit.
If he isn't a left-wing reporter, he is at the very least sympathetic to Kerry's election hopes.
(Forget what they SAY - watch what they DO.)
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
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ASPB
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 1680
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| Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| DougReese wrote: |
I have seen that already, Tom. I was hoping you had something more current. I anxiously await their "additional documentation".
That bit towards the end of that statement about SBVT having 250 "first hand eye-witnesses" is still flat out false.
I'll have to assume it's a mis-statement -- inadvertant. Otherwise, I'd have to say I am very disappointed.
Sort of how I felt yesterdays when I saw Drudge quoting John O'Neill as saying we had a conversation, on a topic, that we just never had.
I fear SBVT, and it might seem strange for you to think I care about this, but I do . . . . . I fear SBVT is destroying their credibility.
Doug |
250 Eyewitness to what Doug? Obviously not 28 Feb or 13 Mar. But did 250 serve with Kerry in COSDIV 14,13,and 11 and were eyewitnesses to "at least some of " the events surrounding Kerry's manufactured record or his overall behavior?
Are you forgetting that those speaking out have signed sworn affidavits as to the accuracy of their statements?
And a really important question. Why was Kerry shuffled between 3 divisions in 4 months when most served in one unit for their entire 12 month tour? Actually he had 4 transfers in 4 months. From 14 to 11 to 13 and back to 11 before getting out. Nobody wanted this guy Doug. That's why after he got scratched (or made up scratches) 3 times they told him to go home. That's by sworn statements. Want to litigate? Kerry doesn't even want his entire service record released. Who's hiding the ball here? I spent a year on the boats in 2 divisions as a Patrol Officer. Why 2? Because we gave the Ist one, RivDiv92 to the Viets.
Your candidate is a liar and a fabricator imho. I said this in published writings before I even knew about Swiftvets. You know why I believe this and so do the guys that are facing a democratic Tammany Hall attack machine for standing up for what they believe.
Everyone that visits here should get a clue. This is not politics. It's about Kerry's lack of honor. He could spend the next 20 year in the Senate for Mass. I could care less. But POTUS....NO BLEAPING WAY!
Best personal regards always,
Tom
_________________
On Sale! Order in lots of 100 now at velero@rcn.com Free for the cost of shipping All profits (if any, especially now) go to Swiftvets. The author of "Sink Kerry Swiftly" ---ASPB
Last edited by ASPB on Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:47 am; edited 5 times in total |
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 396
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| Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:38 am Post subject: Re: Why did George Elliot retract his criticism of John Kerr |
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| Navy_Navy_Navy wrote: | | 84rules wrote: | | What gives? This story is starting to overshadow the SwiftVets ad. |
Well, for a few minutes it did. LOL!
Now, the big story is that Mr. Elliott retracts NOTHING, stands by his story and further seems to ask what can you expect from one of the Kerry campaign biographers?
Kranish is also writing the official campaign book of the Kerry/Edwards tour, called Kerry Edwards - $10.36 on amazon.com
"Veteran Retracts Criticism of Kerry?" Not according to Mr. Elliott, TODAY - he says that the story badly misquoted him and he retracts nothing.
Hey, Senator - there are some pots better left UNSTIRRED.
From Drudge: www.drudgereport.com
| Quote: | ANTI-KERRY VETS HANG TOUGH
Fri Aug 06 2004 13:37:12 ET
The following statement from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth concerns an article appearing in morning edition of the BOSTON GLOBE, written by GLOBE reporter and author of the official Kerry-Edwards campaign book, Mike Kranish.
"Captain George Elliott describes an article appearing in today’s edition of the BOSTON GLOBE by Mike Kranish as extremely inaccurate and highly misstating his actual views. He reaffirms his statement in the current advertisement paid for by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Captain Elliott reaffirms his affidavit in support of that advertisement, and he reaffirms his request that the ad be played.
“Additional documentation will follow.
"The article by Mr. Kranish is particularly surprising given page 102 of Mr. Kranish’s own book quoting John Kerry as acknowledging that he killed a single, wounded, fleeing Viet Cong soldier whom he was afraid would turn around.
"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has more than 250 supporters who are revealing first hand, eyewitness accounts of numerous incidents concerning John Kerry’s military service record. The organization will continue to discuss much of what John Kerry has reported as fact concerning his four-month tour of duty in Vietnam."
END |
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OK -- Now I'm really confused.
1. I just now here on the tube that Mrs. Elliot says her husband stands by the ad.
2. I read, more closely now, what the SBVT said in their statement (above), with this statement regarding Mr. Elliot catching my attention: "He reaffirms his statement in the current advertisement paid for by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Captain Elliott reaffirms his affidavit in support of that advertisement, and he reaffirms his request that the ad be played."
3. It appears to me, that in the Kranish article, Elliot isn't retracting his support for the ad, just part of what was in his affadavit.
Here is a part of the article:
Yesterday, reached at his home, Elliott said he regretted signing the
affidavit and said he still thinks Kerry deserved the Silver Star.
''I still don't think he shot the guy in the back," Elliott said. ''It
was a terrible mistake probably for me to sign the affidavit with
those words. I'm the one in trouble here."
Elliott said he was no under personal or political pressure to sign
the statement, but he did feel ''time pressure" from those involved in
the book. ''That's no excuse," Elliott said. ''I knew it was wrong . .
. In a hurry I signed it and faxed it back. That was a mistake."
4. What am I missing here? Elliot didn't withdraw support of the ad according to Kranish's article, but the wording regards Kerry and the VC.
Is he denying he said that (what I have above from Kranish's article) or am I missing what the heck is going on here?
Doug |
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Navy_Navy_Navy
Admin
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
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| Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:45 am Post subject: |
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Exactly, Doug,
Elliott denied that he ever said what was reported in the Globe and said that they had completely misrepresented his interview with them.
I only hope that he had a tape recorder going. That'll be the next nice thing to hit the fan.
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
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DougReese
Former Member
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 396
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| Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:45 am Post subject: |
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| ASPB wrote: |
250 Eyewitness to what Doug? Obviously not 28 Feb or 13 Mar. But did 250 serve with Kerry in COSDIV 14,13,and 11 and were eyewitnesses to "at least some of " the the events surrounding Kerry's manufactured record or his overall behavior?
Are you forgetting that those speaking out have signed sworn affidavits as to the accuracy of their statements?
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250 eyewitnesses to something Kerry did, I suppose. Kinda difficult if you never met the guy in Vietnam. I believe that's the case for the majority of those 250. It's the case for John O'Neill.
And I'm sure they signed affadavits. I just don't expect to see anywhere near 250. I'll be shocked if there's more than 40, and many of those would not be "testifying" to anything of import.
Doug |
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