SwiftVets.com

[SharpTalons]

Qnick, How would you feel if were a swiftboat veteran, clicked on the TV to watch the DNC and then heard John Kerry state the following after his traitorous and overly ambitious actions 33 years ago???? I bet you would be pretty angry watching a man who turned his back on his country so many years ago brazenly draping himself in its sacred colors for political gain. V

"I'm John Kerry, and I'm reporting for duty.
We are here tonight because we love our country. We're proud of what America is and what it can become....................................................

Our band of brothers doesn't march together because of who we are as veterans, but because of what we learned as soldiers. We fought for this nation because we loved it, and we came back with the deep belief that every day is extra. We may be a little older, we may be a little grayer, but we still know how to fight for our country.............................

You see that flag up there. We call her Old Glory, the Stars and Stripes forever. I fought under that flag, as did so many of those people who were here tonight and all across the country. That flag flew from the gun turret right behind my head and it was shot through and through and tattered, but it never ceased to wave in the wind. It draped the caskets of men that I served with and friends I grew up with."

[RIslander]

Osama bin Laden was one guy in the middle of the desert. Does that mean he was not a threat to this country? By Q Nick's logic, that is the case. I guess the rest of us are just suffering from some sort of illusion when we see an empty space where the World Trade Center used to be.

[mcb58]

Right-on Navy,
the problem with the under 30 group is that they respect nothing.

I really beleive that John F___ing Kerry is doomed, but in the event the Dems steal the White House, those that put him there will live to regret it for sure.
_________________

THE GREAT FIFTY-EIGHT

[fortdixlover]

[rlmorel]

[fortdixlover]

[Theresa Alwood]

I am a VET and I SUPPORT AND HONOR THESE VETS WHO HAVE SERVED IN VIETNAM!!! I know the moderators sent us messages and said to ignore these trolls...But I am sorry when jerks like this discredit what the men and women of this country do on a daily basis to protec this country really makes me mad as hell!

John Kerry is the one who keeps bringing up his Vietnam serving over and over and over again. The honorable men, the swiftvets, came out only as a response to protect those of us who have served and taking all this hate that the liberal left gives. John Kerry can get off my back because he is not getting my support, nor the majority of the men and women who seved (everyone I know either active, retired or otherwise that has served is voting for Bush).

Look at John Kerry's voting record in the senate. He has voted against everything that made our military strong. John Kerry is not strong on defense and if he gets elected the war that we are winning on terrorism is all but lost and we are all in serious trouble. Our country will go down the slopes really, really fast and you can expect terrorism to be coming at us from all angles. I know President Bush will stand firm and stand tall.

I am damn proud to be a vet...and I will defend her today.
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Born to raise a little hell!

[B-57BummerJohn]

Q Nick - I became responsible for my actions as an independent man at age 18 as is required in the state of Illinois. I would assume that you and Mr. Kerry were and are held responsible for your actions.

Mr. Kerry's ( that is the most respectable name I can use here )
questionable military honors aside, gave false statements under oath in regards to actions he avowed he committed himself and made accusations against Vietnam Veterans as a whole.

He consorted with, and gave aid to, the enemy by his false testimony and caused pain and hardship to his fellow veterans who were captives at that time. He also helped to turn the emotions of a very divided nation against it's own defenders.

Have you taken the time to educate yourself on the history and voting records of Mr. Kerry?

Have you ever met a Vietnam era P.O.W. or even read any of their stories?
I have.

Have you ever served your country in any capacity, military or otherwise?


The veterans here have. The men and women that you think should get over it and move on have.

The Swift Boat Vets in particular and Vietnam veterans as a whole have been dishonored and falsely accused by Mr. Kerry.


I applaude them for making a stand and restoring their honor.
I stand behind them 100%.
I am one of the thousands accused of Rape, baby killing, destroying villages etc.

I am a Vietnam Veteran. We Are over it. We are not forgetting.

We intend to hold Mr. Kerry Responsible for his actions, the same way you and I must be accountable for ours.

I am not asking you to vote or support Mr. Bush. I am not requesting that you slam the Dems . either. Please just get some more information on the records and history of Mr. Kerry.

Have you ever seen a sign that said SELF SERVICE?
John F. Kerry has a Masters degree in it.

Thank you for your support.
John D. USAF Vietnam 8th & 13th Bombardment Squadron, Weapons tech.
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Swiftvets has it right on the money!
KERRY IS......NOT FIT FOR COMMAND.

[Q Nick]

[prdCOmom]

I am gonna keep this short and sweet for our young originator of this thread.
I am the mother of a United States Marine.
My Father is a World War II Veteran.
My Brother is a Viet Nam Veteran.
On March 23, 2003, my Godson, LCpl Thomas J. Slocum was killed in Iraq.
One thing that all four of these people understood was that your freedom to tell people who have sacrificed so much for your right to post such crap did not come free.
I was struck by your pioty to decide who should enjoy freedom and who should not.
Afgans deserve it but Iraqis do not.
As an American, we all have a duty and an obligation to our commitment that all people are created equal and have the same right as we do to freedom.
It is what makes America so amazingly wonderful.
Now you may not like war...None of us do...but bottom line....I want the guy who win this war. I want the guy who will give my son what he needs to help win this war.
John Kerry has already proven to us all how you help to lose one.
John Kerry has already shown me with his voting record that he will not give my son what he needs to help win this war.
I WOULD ASK YOU...WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR YOUR COUNTRY TODAY?
What have you done that would make you think you have a right to come to this website and tell these brave men to...."give it a rest"
You are obviously to young and to niave' to understand what John Kerry took from this generation. He took Honor, Integrity, Courage, Commitment right out of an entire generations vocabulary.
You vote for Mr. Kerry.
That's your right but you have to understand that a vote for Kerry sends us a little further behind in acquiring those important attributes back for our society.
Way to Go!!!!!!!!!
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[RocketFett]

Since someone felt the need to bring up Iraq, as being an unjustified war, grab a seat get some lunch and read all this. This is the full justification for war in Iraq. And it would be old news and an long over argument if the media hadn't gone so far out of their way to bury all this stuff, and it's all fact with pictures and cited sources. And the U.N. resolution 1441 did call for there to be "dire consequences" if hussein did not comply. Six months later, the U.N. inspectors were being given the run around just like always. So read all this, and all the lurch lurkers here just try to disprove this and then tell me how unjustified it is. Serbia anyone? Saying that Iraq isn't justified, while Serbia somehow was, is like saying we shouldn't have opposed the Soviet Union in the cold war, but we should have gone to war with Sierra Leone because of the massive threat they posed to the U.S.. Whatever!

If this is too long for someone to read, I apologize, but if you want to know things that you haven't been told about Iraq, and see proof to back them up, then please read it all. It's worth a few minutes to learn the truth isn't it? Also, and most importantly, if any of the links I provided do not work due to time elapsed since they came out, please e-mail me and I will be happy to e-mail them to you. I have them all on my computer also.

I’ll start out by saying I think it’s hilarious that the 9-11 Commission full final report, found that Bush wasn’t responsible and had no fault for anything that happened leading up to 9-11, and it totally contradicts EVERY point in michael moores fictional conspiracy freak crockumentary flick, fahrenlie 9-11. Ha ha! And the 9-11 Commission did find fault with congress and specifically the pre-911 Senate Intelligence committee, which democrat vp candidate john edwards served on. So he is one of the people the 9-11 commission has found responsible for 9-11 happening, but somehow he is qualified to be president? Whatever. kerry would likely have more blame assigned to him if he were ever in the senate, but he has the worst voting record of any senator in the Senate so he’s barely there, and when he is, he votes more liberally than any other Senator. Big surprise.

Now then, this is very long I know, and I apologize, but there is such a huge mountain of facts and evidence defending this war in Iraq, being brief would mean being vague and not backing up what I say with fact, and I believe if you are going to say something, you should back it up. It's nothing that can be put into just a couple paragraphs. So if everyone till take the time to read it, there is likely much here that most people don’t know.

The Iraq war and the progress being made is NOT being reported in the popular media (the networks, cnn, msnbc, and most paper media). Even FOX News doesn't report everything, but every soldier I have talked to and heard from that has come back from the war, paints the same picture: "It's not that bad over there, hasn't been that bad over there, and I'm more scared seeing it on TV being reported than I ever was when I was there". That says it all truthfully. When a soldier who was there for a full year in the area of Baghdad, you can believe it. Personally, I don’t even see why the Iraq war has to be defended, especially among people who are supposedly Christians. As an American, I would be ashamed to oppose this war for a host of moral and ethical reasons. Not to mention the need to defend the U.S. from another attack, as Russian President Putin warned that hussein was planning after 9-11 happened. First off, anyone who opposes this war, needs to go read this article on Worldnet Daily:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38213]Iraq’s WMD found.

This isn’t unproved. This isn’t rah rah stuff. This is all documented reported WMD findings that the media has deliberately refused to report, even though it's been handed over to the U.N. and the Senate and House, and proven to be FACT. Liberals want to see a stockpile of banned weapons all found in the same place at the same time that's enough to overflow a barn. Well that's not just naive', it's an intentionally impossible demand. The whole reason hussein was able to hide them from the u.n. was by making them easy to hide and not having large numbers of anything in the same place. But if you were to get ALL the banned weapons that have been found hidden in iraq the past year and a half, they would fill more than one barn, and that is a stockpile of illegal banned weapons that have been found in Iraq. These are the things in that article that have been found in Iraq, documented, presented to the U.N., and used as concrete proof of hussein’s blatant material breach of SEVENTEEN U.N. resolutions. The smoking gun was found many months ago and has been smoking like a chimney that whole time, but the media won’t report it, because it doesn’t help john kerry. It helps President Bush. And the mainstream media, the networks, cnn, msnbc, cnbc, npr, and most newspapers, are blatant kerry supporters and admit that. In a recent poll, only 8% of media who voted identified themselves as conservative, and something like 57% said they were liberal. So does anyone here actually think that the media would report the truth in Iraq, when all they care about is removing President Bush from office?

Another reason that I would be ashamed as an American not to vote for President Bush, is because of the people with whom I would be voting if I voted for kerry. whoopie goldberg! linda ronstadt! hannoi jane fonda! Socialist foreigner george soros! Buddhist richard gere! And the list goes on and on. As aAmerican, I’d be ashamed to appear with any of those people on the same side of an issue, so why in the heck would I want to vote with them for a candidate who clearly shares their morality and not the moralitthis country was founded upon? So don’t just pick who you are voting for. Look at who you are voting with when you pick a candidate and decide if you really feel comfortable agreeing with the people who are also voting for that candidate.

There is also an amazing amount of hypocrisy involved in the iraq debate when it comes to the anti-war sentiment. Anyone here who is against the war in iraq, tell me please, were you as stridently against the "police action" in Serbia? It was a war, if you’re in uniform and you’re being shot at, it’s a war. There was NO protesting against the Serbian war. Which, by the way, then President clinton promised it would only be a one year deployment, and we STILL have military personnel there eight years later, and they were there for over five years of his "presidency". All through the iraq war no one has had any problem with the military being in Serbia, and that’s pretty hypocritical.

There were never any terrorists in Serbia, but Iraq was crawling with them before the war started last March. The man in charge of the Achille Laurel hijacking was found dead in the streets of Baghdad after the start of the war. Dozens of al quaeda training camps were destroyed in Iraq in the opening days of the war. Terrorists are the only ones who have need of a Boeing 707 fuselage sitting in the middle of the desert in a well concealed training camp. Wonder if that’s where the 9-11 terrorists trained. Someone who is against the war should be thinking about that when they vocalize their opposition to the war. More terrorists came in after the war, to try and stop the democratization of Iraq, so they don’t lose a good ally and a safe harbor they’ve had for a decade. But they were there before the war, and that has been proven and documented. The U.N. and Congress has thousands of documents from Iraqi government buildings which are documents from the former hussein regime, which outline years of complicity between al quaeda and various other terrorist networks and the hussein regime’. Just because the liberal elite media wing of the democrat party has chosen NOT to report any of these things, does not make them untrue.

Also, there were never purported to be WMD in serbia and they posed no thread to America whatsoever. And as that report I provided the link to above, WMD have been found all over Iraq, hundreds of examples of chem, bio, and nuke program items that have been found and cataloged in Iraq over the past year and a half, and according to the hussein regime’ before the war, none of those things were in iraq. There were no WMD of any kind ever found in serbia. No liberal protests. There have been banned illegal weapons and weapon systems, including chem, bio, and nuke weapons program elements found in iraq all over the place, but there are protest against that war. But none found in Serbia. NONE, nada, zilch. If there had been nothing illegal in Iraq, we wouldn’t have live satellite feed video at several different sites of large covered trucks leaving out of the back exits of military installations, while U.N. inspectors come in the front. We also wouldn’t have found illegal weapon systems buried all over the desert sands in iraq, some of which hadn’t been buried for more than a year. Either the sands of Iraq are unique in their ability to grow jets, missiles, chem, bio, and nuke weapon components, or hussein was in willing and intentional material breach of SEVENTEEN U.N. resolutions, and needed to be dealt with once and for all. Anyone want to claim those things just sprouted up in the sand? And the human rights violations in Serbia are NOTHING compared to what happened in iraq under the hussein regime’ on a daily basis, especially all through the 90s, and through until 2002 when he was removed from power, which by the way wouldn’t have been necessary if he had stepped down and left the country which was a chance he was given and he ignored it. So he brought this war on himself, it was his to avoid, and he gave the world the collective finger, and some in the supposed civilized western democratic world were okay to let him get away with that. Serbia was Neverneverland compared to iraq before the war, yet anti-war people never had any problem with going to war in serbia, but totally hate the war in iraq. The difference? Serbia wasn’t a threat to America and Israel, Iraq was, and it was a liberal lying immoral democrat who took us into Serbia, and a Christian Republican who took us into Iraq. That’s the difference. If it had been a Republican as President when we went into serbia, there would have been massive protests then also. It’s that simple and it makes me want to puke. I supported the action in serbia because people were being tortured and killed and because it was the right thing to do. I didn’t oppose it just because clinton was the president and I dislike him and his lack of morality and lack of any kind of Christian values and ethics. That’s something that anti-Iraq war people seem incapable of doing. The right thing to do is less important to them than their pure unadulterated venomous hatred for President Bush. And that is pretty pathetic.

Here is something anti-Iraq war people need to really study before they continue to oppose this war. It has now been proven that hussein was indeed trying to buy uranium from Niger, which has now been confirmed. This also has proven which the U.S. Senate Intelligence Committee found that former clinton ambassador joe wilson lied through his teeth in his testimony that there was no evidence that hussein tried to buy uranium. He also lied repetitively about not pushing his CIA wife for jobs. He’s the one that outed his wife’s work at the CIA, not the Bush administration. Go look on the Washington Post and the Chicago Sun Times at the links below. The full Senate Intelligence report is below also, confirming the CIA claims that President Bush repeated in the State of the Union speech that hussein was trying to obtain uranium from Niger. Someone definitely did lie to the American people. Their names are john kerry, joe wilson, and michael moore.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/novak/cst-edt-novak15.html
Chicago Sun Times: Uranium story

Washington Post: Uranium story
E-mail me for the complete article. I have it cut and pasted but don't have the url anymore.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/nation/documents/senateiraqreport.pdf
Senate Intelligence Committee 521 page report, supporting the statements made by the President.

And something else WOMD related for anti-Iraq war people. Our supposed "allies" who opposed the war in Iraq. Gee, why would they oppose the war? Moral reasons? Whatever. Three countries responsible for most of the major wars loosed on this world that killed hundreds of millions of people the past five hundred years, now suddenly they’ve found some kind of morality in the value of human life? Whatever. The three of them are pathetic and should no longer be considered allies because they don’t behave as allies, added to the fact they are all three blatantly anti-semetic and anti-Christian, and any nation that is like that, is a nation that we don’t need or want as an ally. The day that America sides with a france like nation over Israel, is the day I move to Israel, because the soul of America and the Christian foundation that our founding fathers built it on have been killed. Now about our wonderful "allies". All this is true. Why else do you think they no longer oppose the war in Iraq, and voted unanimously to support the American led Coalition military presence in Iraq? Because they got nailed with their hugely illegal actions, and they knew it!:

germany: a nation that wouldn’t exist as it currently is if not for the blood and billions of dollars from the United States, who enjoys what they currently have, FREEDOM, thanks to the very process that Iraq has been undergoing for the past year and a half They also made no small amount of money form the corrupt hundred billion dollar palaces for food program, what they liked to call oil for food program.

france: Basically the same as germany. A bunch of coward ingrates who would not have what they have today were it not for the sacrifice of Americans, TWO TIMES in the same century. They also made tens of billions of dollars in the U.N. palaces for food program, and ironically enough, some french made weapons systems, as well as detection gear, chem and bio weapons antidotes, and protection suits were found in Iraq and have kept turning up. Things that the SEVENTEEN U.N. resolutions forbid countries to sell to iraq.

russia: Same as france and germany. They made tens of billions of dollars in the U.N. oil for palaces program, and the iraqi people got NADA! They also seem to have misplaced about a dozen MiG-25R class Foxbat Mach-3+ interceptors with FRENCH avionics, which appeared this past few weeks in the desert where the U.S. Air Force dug them up. Funny thing about the R model of the MiG-25. It didn’t first go into production until sometime in 1996, four years after the first Gulf War, but WELL after the U.N. resolutions were passed which forbid the sale of such weapon systems to iraq. It's a $10+ BILLION each platform. I have provided three pictures of those jets being dug out of the iraqi desert at the end of this paragraph. The big irony with russia, russian President Vladimir Putin last month confirmed that russian intelligence had evidence that hussein ordered his forces to prepare for clandestine attacks in America, after the 9-11 attacks had occurred. So, after 9-11, it has been proven that iraq was planning to attack us, yet it wasn’t okay for us to attack them and remove the regime that was planning to attack us? Are we only allowed to attack a nation after there are thousands of dead Americans in the streets? I guess for some people, if it’s not their loved ones dead in the streets, the answer is "no".

http://users3.ev1.net/~rfet/misc/foxbat1.jpg Russian MiG-25R #1
http://users3.ev1.net/~rfet/misc/foxbat2.jpg Russian MiG-25R #2
http://users3.ev1.net/~rfet/misc/foxbat3.jpg Russian MiG-25R #3

So I find it funny how the nations which we are supposedly isolated from because of President Bush’s policy in the war on Terror, which started when 3,000 American’s were slaughtered in planes and buildings which we didn’t provoke. These nations which we are supposedly isolated from are either harborers of terrorists, or nations which deliberately have violated U.N. resolutions against iraq, like germany, france, and russia. I find it ironic that our allies that most opposed us going into iraq are the same ones who had their arms elbow deep in the cookie jar making billions of dollars by collaborating with saddam hussein while he raped, murdered and tortured his own people. So, whom are we exactly isolated from that is behaving in such a way that we would want to be intermingling with them in the first place? Nations like those three who vote in support of U.N. resolutions and then get in bed thick as thieves with the same evil regime’ they just voted to sanction in the U.N.? Countries like that we should strive to isolate ourselves from so that their blatant immorality does not lead us down the path of the Mongols, Romans, Greeks, Persians, and every other immoral unethical civilization in history.

An extra about germany, in 1945, 1946, and 1947 the same things happening in Iraq the past year since major unit opposed combat operations ended in around May of last year, were all happening in Germany. Snipers. Bombings. Mortor attacks. Assassinations of Ally friendly elected German leaders, road side bombs, EVERYTHING! All the same things were being done by former German SS agents, who were ordered by Gerbles to resist the Ally occupation in any way possible for as long as they can. And that went on for over two years after WWII ended, all the way through till late 1947. The only difference is that we have taken more casualties in that period in Iraq than in Germany in 46’ and 47. 600 in Iraq since major combat operations ended, vs. about 200 in Germany. The reason it’s that high in Iraq is because we have to play all nice nice and abide by the precious Geneva convention, while the Iraq terrorists and insurgents dress as civilians, and scurry in the dark like **** roaches, attacking their own mosques. In Germany, when there was an attack like that, a Tank platoon moved in and leveled buildings. THAT is how you put an end to guerrilla warfare tactics. You level buildings and crush the terrorist insurgents beneath them. I have an audio tape of a History Channel documentary that outlines all of these two years of insurgent attacks on the Allies after the end of WWII in 1945, if anyone would like it, e-mail me and I can give you my address and you can send me a couple dollars to cover the tape and shipping costs. It’s an amazing piece of historical fact that proves that what’s gone on in Iraq the past year isn’t something new. It all happened in Germany the same way 60 years ago. I guess maybe in 60 years Iraq will oppose us when we try and liberate some other oppressed and tortured people, because Iraq will have grown so self righteous and full of themselves that they think their freedom is theirs because they earned it somehow, just like germany and france.

And as for the horrible human rights violations, again, what was going on in Serbia was NOTHING compared to what was going on in Iraq under the hussein regime’. Brutal torture, chopping off of limbs, crushing of heads, using heavy carts to crush bones in bodies. Beheadings. Drownings. Electrocutions. And all of the brutal rapes and beatings of women and children, as young as 8! These are the things that would still be going on if we hadn’t gone into Iraq. Whatever happened to the supposed love for humanity that the liberal left had? If it was up to them all those above things would still be going on in Iraq. Yeah, they really love humanity. Whatever. I guess they only want to stop suffering if it’s a fellow immoral democrat calling the shots. I’m sure God appreciates that biased political hypocritical value on human life. Seems to me that as the most powerful nation on Earth, God would expect us to use that power to stop the brutal murder and torturing of His children no matter what political party is in charge. Under clinton, a million Christians were slaughtered in Rwanda and billy boy clinton did NOTHING to stop it, and it’s been proven by intelligence released that he knew about it. Of course muslim kofe anon at the U.N. didn’t stop it. He’s the one that disarmed the Christians in the north, and left the muslims in the south armed, so they could sweep up north and slaughter over a million of the Christians. And clinton didn’t seem to care about all the brutality in Iraq either. Or North Korea. It wasn’t until Bush took office that this kind of blatant human brutality was challenged, and in iraq, it’s over. I guess clinton was more concerned with chasing tail and selling nuclear secrets to china, another human rights violator. But I digress, there have been over 700 "SEVEN HUNDRED" mass graves found, photographed, and logged in Iraq, containing the bodies of over 400,000 people, many of them women and children. FOUR HUNDRED THOUSAND PEOPLE! There were no mass graves found in Serbia or anywhere else in former Yugoslavia! And that was one of the reasons given for going to war in Serbia! And they didn’t exist! To this day not one has been found! But over SEVEN HUNDRED of them have been found in Iraq! How can any Christian know this and oppose a military action to stop this nearly unprecedented brutality against other humans? I don’t care if someone is a Christian or not, I was brought up that people are God’s children and His creation regardless of what religion they are. They may be on the wrong path, but they are still His children and He loves them as much as He loves me and other Christians, and I feel an obligation to keep them from being so brutally tortured and murdered like hussein and his monster sons tortured the Iraqi people for so many years. If the stupid U.N. hadn’t forbed the removal the hussein regime’ after the first Gulf War, he would have been removed then, but the wonderful U.N., in their infinite wisdom, would not allow the removal of the hussein regime’, which is why we stopped before we got to baghdad in 91. That little fact was conveniently ignored by liberals and the media wing of the democrat party, and the mistake of not removing hussein was dropped in the lap of the first President Bush. So I guess all the liberals would have had him violate international law huh? Those same liberals now consider international law to be so important, but don’t want it to ever be enforced, wanted it violated 12 years ago to remove hussein, but didn’t want SEVENTEEN U.N. resolutions to be enforced and remove hussein now. That is so stinking hypocritical and ridiculous.

So lets recap. Serbia: No mass graves. No WMD. No massive human rights violations. No violated U.N. resolutions. No terrorists.

Iraq: SEVEN HUNDRED mass graves filled with over FOUR HUNDRED THOUSAND bodies many of which are women and children. WMD of all kinds found and cataloged, medium range missiles, chem and bio weapons agents, nuke materials, unmanned drones, all banned by the UN and illegal, many of them provided by U.N. security council members germany, france, and russia, who voted for all the U.N. resolutions against iraq, and then turned around and secretly violated them. Human rights violations of a magnitude not seen since WWII and the Jewish holocaust. Unless you count china and rwanda, which the U.N. sees fit to cover up and not deal with. The human rights violations are worse than anything we have ever done to the worst of our mass-murdering criminals. And last but certainly not least, SEVENTEEN VIOLATED U.N. RESOLUTIONS. SEVENTEEN OF THEM! Plus the fact which is no small fact that hussein ordered his military to fire on Coalition aircraft defending the U.N. sanctioned No Fly Zones all through the 90s and through until he was removed from power last year. That in and of itself is all the justification needed to declare war. That was all the justification President johnson used to drag us into Vietnam, and that was a lie. The U.S.S. Turner Joy was NEVER fired on by the Vietnamese. My father was there, it never happened. And that lasted over ten years, and never saw anywhere near the success that has been seen in Iraq. Thanks to President Bush. And there have been so many terrorist links between the hussein regime’ proven the past year that anyone who denies it truly is foolish. The U.S. Senate Intelligence Committee and the U.N. accept the reality that those ties existed and were a dangerous thing. When was the last time anyone heard someone from the U.N. dispute those ties? What’s that tell you? They know it’s true. And as I mentioned in the opening paragraph, Russian President Putin, who opposed the war in Iraq, later stated in a public statement, that he had intelligence that proved that saddam hussein ordered his forces to plan for an attack on U.S. soil after the 9-11 attacks took place. Serbia never had plans to attack us. It is not preempting when you know the people are planning to attack you. Would it have been preemption if the Navy had launched an attack on the eight carrier Japanese fleet steaming east on December 6th, 1941? NO! When someone is planning to attack you, you have every moral right to defend yourself and not let that attack take place, especially under Biblical principal. How many times did God allow Israel to defend attack other nations who were a threat to Israel? I can’t even count all the times. There’s dozens of them. I get so sick of people who have a loose flexible relationship with Christian principles and convictions talking about turning the other cheek as a weak reason for not going to war. When Jesus said that he was so obviously talking about how individuals deal with one another. Not nations. Just like "Thou Shalt Not MURDER" which is the correct translation, does not apply to nations at war, because a nation engaged in moral and just war where they do not target women, children, and other non-combatants, is not murdering. It’s engaging the enemy. If you are a Christian who opposes this war because it has killed people in Iraq, overwhelmingly most of whom deserved death for their horrible criminal actions, I would be very careful if I were you. How many women and children did God command the Israelites to kill in lands because they were idol worshipers and immoral beyond disdain? Hundreds of thousands at least, so be very careful opposing this war for that reason. We haven’t done anything near as seemingly bad as what Israel was commanded to do by God in the Old Testament. Tread lightly.

So, anyone opposing the war, and is really a committed American, I would strongly suggest you read all of these facts I have mentioned, and seriously consider them because they are fact. I don’t say things that I don’t verify as being true. And I’ve provided more than enough evidence to back it all up. If you still oppose this war, all I can say is that you need to be looking at the merits of this war and the fact that all the things that President Bush used as justification for the war have been proven. Human rights violations. Violated U.N. resolutions. Mass graves. And WMD which the media has just flatly refused to report, which were all cataloged and reported to the U.N. and the U.S. House and Senate. That’s reality. The overwhelming majority of people against the Iraq war are against it ONLY because it is a Christian Republican President who is in the White House. An altogether less threatening war was engaged for five years by bill clinton, and the anti-war radical liberals in America didn’t seem to have the time to oppose it. Funny how that works. When a liberal cheating on his wife and lying under oath goes off to war under false pretenses, nary an eyebrow is raised. But let there be a Christian God fearing President takes us to war, after we’ve been attacked no less, and the anti-war liberals go crazy. That speaks for itself as to their real motives. Liberals don’t care about suffering dying people in other countries, they just do fund raisers for hard working middle class people to send their money, and never give any of their millions. All they care about is making sure that no Christian based conservative convictions are followed by its leaders, turned into Policy in the U.S. by them. That is their agenda, and if you are against the war in Iraq, and not going to vote for President Bush, you have a serious moral dilemma, and I’d strongly suggest you consider it before you vote for kerry and put someone who has exercised no Christian or any kind of honorable values or convictions his entire life into the White House. Once it's done it can't be undone, and kerry is a mistake that this country cannot afford to make. One cheating, lying, lawyer democrat in the White House is enough for one lifetime.

[RocketFett]

Bravo PrdCOmom. That says it all. And a lot more politely than I would have been able to muster. These anti-war people seem to be under the impression that they're special and some people in the world don't deserve the same freedom we have, unless they say that do. The founding fathers of this country weep in the grave for the ignorance and stupidity that is in this country in the anti-war movement. Clearly four decades and a lot of pot and lsd hasn't served to clear their minds or bring them to a point of understanding what TRULY makes their freedom possible. No one ever preserved their freedom by being at peace. There's an old saying, I can't remember who said it but it stuck with me. When you want to prepare for peace, arm for war. When you want to prepare for war, talk peace. That's the reality of the world we live in. Peace is won by the threat, and sometimes, the use of force. That is where true peace and freedom comes from, and it is only enjoyed so long as a majority of a peoples are willing to defend it. The day most people in this counry come to the point they will not fight to defend someone elses right to freedom is the day that someone will come here and take it from America itself, because they will know on that day that America has lost it's backbone and it's spirit to defend the freedom that was fought, bled, and died for for over 200 years.

[prdCOmom]

Good Post. And I read every word.
I have come to the conclusion that these pacifist hate war no matter where it is or what the reason is.
You will never show them a good enough reason to fight for something.
Why should they fight when they can get it for free.
I see pacifist as incredibly selfish people.
They want things in this perfect bubble.
They have no clue how they got in that perfect bubble.
No war....No starvation....All we are saying is give peace a chance.!!!!!!
Peace is great...We all want peace.....but.....there is a price to be paid.
Many many here understand that price in it's real terms.
The pampered pacifists and liberals of today want to just exsist in their perfect welfare, social entitlement bubble.
I prefer the "get a fishing pole" approach myself.
I will catch my own dinner thank you......you keep your free fish.
I know where mine came from.
_________________

[Acksiom]

[brad]

ADMIN NOTE: You are NOT going to spit on the Swifts or on the veterans who participate here.

EJ