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inlikeflint
Seaman Recruit


Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 20
Location: KCMO

PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rbshirley wrote:
.

joppa wrote:
Kerry had the right to oppose the war in Vietnam but he was dead
wrong in asserting the war crimes he and the men in Vietnam may
have committed while on their tour of duty. This is the issue that
should have been attacked not his actual service records

I will hold my final judgement until all the facts have been presented

inlikeflint wrote:
I agree with Joppa 100%.


Do you really think this advertisement is the only chapter in this discussion?

"Unfit for Command" will hit the book stores by this time next week.

Just a few chapter headings from the pre-released section of the book:

o War Crimes

o Kerry' Anti-war Secrets

o Kerry's Communist Honors

o Unfit for Command

With approximately sixty documents and affidavits sent out with this first ad,
you can take it to the bank that the book will be backed up by the same type
of reference material. As will the follow on ads addressing Kerry's 70's activity.

Again: Be careful what you ask for. Because you surely will receive it.


.



#1. You can't always believe what you read.
#2. If he is Unfit for command, why was he allowed in a command position in the Navy?
#3. Communist... Why are you going there? He is another Vet just like the purported majority of this site.
#4. If Kerry is so awful, then why has he been alowed in the political arena to begin with?
#5. How do I know that you and other Swiftvets do not have your own political agenda to sway voters to Bush?
#6... (Hypothetical) If Kerry becomes president, will you support America any different than you have in the past? ... or is the group extreme enough to perform assassination?
#7. Why do you think for one minute that one man is any better than the next?

I want to believe you guys, but a lot of things are not fitting together...
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11-B. Ground Pounder- Nasty Gaurd 00-01

Bosnia 95-96 Z.O.S. Mutants -Too much butter to list.

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carpro
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Joined: 10 May 2004
Posts: 1176
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

inlikeflint wrote:
carpro wrote:


At this late date... why are you "undecided" at all? Have you always been undecided or did something happen recently to put you on the fence?


This late in the campaign to reveal this kind of information has me in question. If there is any truth to this, then why was this not brought up while he was beginning in politics? It's kind of like letting a wound fester. The wound does not get better by saying it will go away over night.

By saying that he is unfit for president, you are also saying he is unfit for any kind of political position. Evidently his track record says different...

Okay- Defend! Defend!


The answer to your question is very simple. Most people don't care who serves as senator of Mass. Millions of people care who is the CIC.

Yes, he is unfit to be president or any other political position, but as long as he wasn't my senator, who cares? Let the people of Mass. select their own senators. My God! Look who the other one is! Embarassed

If you think his track record says different, you aren't paying attention. Very Happy
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Navy_Navy_Navy
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

inlikeflint wrote:

#1. You can't always believe what you read.


Especially if it's written by a co-author of a campaign biography and the paid author of a campaign book. Wink

Quote:

#2. If he is Unfit for command, why was he allowed in a command position in the Navy?


You'll notice that he was NOT in a command position for very long. Please read the latest statements from CDR Wright re: Kerry's command ability.

His own shipmates apparently had trouble with him - he was a loose cannon and had trouble following orders.

Also read the analysis of Kerry's fitness reports here on this site.

Rather telling that the first page of his worst fitrep is not available on the Kerry site... only the part that looks to civilians as if he was a model officer.

Quote:
#3. Communist... Why are you going there? He is another Vet just like the purported majority of this site.


You don't know anything about Kerry's meetings with the enemy in Paris? Really?

Quote:
#4. If Kerry is so awful, then why has he been alowed in the political arena to begin with?


That's a pretty simple answer if you live in Massachussetts. Kerry was a Kennedy protege' since he was a very young man.

In a state where a drunk driver can cause the death of a young woman and not only get away with "leaving the scene of an accident," but being elected to the Senate and staying there for all these years, it pretty much stands to reason that what a Kennedy promotes gets advanced.

Quote:
#5. How do I know that you and other Swiftvets do not have your own political agenda to sway voters to Bush?


You can read. Read the entire site - press releases, lists of signers, etc.

You can watch the Swifts' press conference. It's available from the main index of this site.


Quote:
#6... (Hypothetical) If Kerry becomes president, will you support America any different than you have in the past? ... or is the group extreme enough to perform assassination?


In-friggin-credible that you can even ASK that.

KERRY is the only name I know of at issue who has participated in any discussion of assassinations. I would bet my last dollar that not ONE of the Swifts were at that VVAW convention.


Quote:
#7. Why do you think for one minute that one man is any better than the next?


Because I read. I listen. I watch. I compare.

I will put George W. Bush's leadership of the war on terror up against John Kerry's leadership of the VVAW any day.

And that's really the main issue, with me.

If Kerry's biography were a truthful reflection of his life, it would spend eight times as many pages on VVAW as it did on his four months in Vietnam.


Quote:
I want to believe you guys, but a lot of things are not fitting together...


All you have to do is ask a specific question. Name one thing that doesn't fit and someone who knows something about it will answer. Then name the next thing, and so on.
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inlikeflint
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are all good points... but to find the truth in these, it may take more than reading a book, or reading a site that is itself seeking the truth. (Somebody has to see the irony in this.)

I don't think I could blame someone who does not endorse war. To scale it down on a one to one... it's like a fist fight. If one can avoid getting into the fist fight, it prevents feeling like you have been run over by a Mack Truck in the morning... if at all possible you negotiate... Busting people out for war crimes is a whole different thing, but then again those things Kerry discussed did occur... but it may not have occured with the particular people he named. I cannot know for sure, as I was not there to see for myself.

The scales are unbalanced, and I am waiting for members whoi served under him to spill the beans, and not someone who was a Rear Admiral who claims his wounds were not great enough for a Purple Heart... I am kind of Ranting- just go with it. Very Happy

To say that Kerry is Unfit but has a track record, you have insulted the state of Mass... and last time I checked... this place we live in is called the United States... We are United Americans who stand for Ideals set forth in the constitution. If the Ideals are off in a state, then something is wrong... Kerry was elected in that state and has to follow some sort of ideals... how communistic is the state of Mass? (Zero... they are capitolist.) (( John Ashcroft's Patriot Act is close to Fascism, but I don't go around calling the man a Nazi.)) If the guy is as bad as everyone lets on, how did he manage to get past all of the encumbants months ago? ( I don't know the details myself... I have no desire to run for public office, or have any idea of how hard it is to get the position of President... I't does seem however to be something that drags everyone and everything through the mud if you are the canidate running.)

I pose the question of What If Kerry Becomes Elected, because I do not know if anyone has thought that far... I don't know who I am talking to... nor do I know that after the dust settles, if swiftvets will be able to accept Kerry suposing he wins...

I am not too sure why people support Bush when he only thinks about Americans as "Consumers." I would like to think there is more to being American.

(I am related to Bush jr... though his mother's side from the Ward house in Salem Mass... The house is right up the block from where the witch trials took place.) When I say I don't trust bush, I really mean I don't trust him... but I support the country by being pro-active... So I am not knocking vets or SV's in their efforts to make sure that we do not get a weak leader. Kerry is a vet, and Bush was a part time Nasty Gaurdsman who did not show up to drill... On this alone, I want to go with someone who has at least has served... he know's something of combat. 4 days- 4 months 4- years 4 whatever... he went... Bush did not.

Evidently Kerry was bothered by what went on over in Vietnam... he tried to do something about it... I think I commend him for at least attempting to prevent more of his battle buddies from comming back all dorked, or killed. Vietnam was wrong... MacNamera even agrees.
If Kerry is as bad as the SV's let on, then why would he even bother comming back to the United States?

If Kerry is all these things and a bucket of worms, then what is his agenda?

Anyway... I'll read some more and shoot some more questions, but I think some things really need some better support... I trust vets, but Kerry is a vet, so how do I trust vets who do not support vets? Wink
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CTRP 1/1 CAV 1st sqd - 1st reg of Dragoons of the 1st AD
19-D. Cavalry Scout 94-97
11-B. Ground Pounder- Nasty Gaurd 00-01

Bosnia 95-96 Z.O.S. Mutants -Too much butter to list.

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carpro
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

inlikeflint wrote:


To say that Kerry is Unfit but has a track record, you have insulted the state of Mass... and last time I checked... this place we live in is called the United States... We are United Americans who stand for Ideals set forth in the constitution. If the Ideals are off in a state, then something is wrong... Kerry was elected in that state and has to follow some sort of ideals... how communistic is the state of Mass?

If Kerry is all these things and a bucket of worms, then what is his agenda?

:


That horse you are sitting on is awful high up, flint. Be careful you don't fall off. You may not be as cool Cool as you think you are. Very Happy
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inlikeflint
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Joined: 07 Aug 2004
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Location: KCMO

PostPosted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

carpro wrote:


That horse you are sitting on is awful high up, flint. Be careful you don't fall off. You may not be as cool Cool as you think you are. Very Happy



If you can't question, then the answer can only be given, but not discovered... Wink

Nice Cav Ref! I'll only be cool when I end up at Fiddlers Green... stiff too.
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CTRP 1/1 CAV 1st sqd - 1st reg of Dragoons of the 1st AD
19-D. Cavalry Scout 94-97
11-B. Ground Pounder- Nasty Gaurd 00-01

Bosnia 95-96 Z.O.S. Mutants -Too much butter to list.

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