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jwb7605
Rear Admiral
Joined: 06 Aug 2004
Posts: 690
Location: Colorado
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 Posted: Wed Sep 20, 2006 11:54 pm Post subject: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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I need some thoughts on this:
Ahmadinejad "invited" Bush to convert to Islam (to no avail!).
Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez are apparently close buddies (allies, at any rate).
I wonder if Ahmadinejad "invited" Chavez to convert?
I don't even know what Chavez' religion is. (I don't even know if he is religious.)
If Chavez was "invited", I wonder what his response was?
What I can't get a mental grasp on is how Chavez could be so friendly with someone like Fidel Castro (communism == atheism), and also so friendly with someone like Ahmadinejad. It seems like one or the other "has to go" (one is apparently on the way out ...).
What's up with these (unholy?) alliances?
is Chavez that stupid? He'll end up being conquered by Muslim extremists ... he's got to know that much.
is Ahmadinejad that embracing?
how can Ahmadinejad publicly proclaim friendship with and support for an atheist or (more likely) a non-practicing Christian?
how can someone get up at the U.N. and give such weird speeches and still get 'thunderous applause and approval'?
Where is all this going? |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 12:15 am Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| jwb7605 wrote: | | Where is all this going? |
All this is going nowhere. Period. Bush seems to take up unholy alliances and then we wonder why there is all this confussion? This is what Bush said today about Abbas, the man whos 'thesis' was that the "Holocaust" never happened!
| Quote: | | Bush and Abbas met for 40 minutes on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly. Bush called Abbas a "man of peace" (Emphasis mine) -- a show of support for the Palestinian moderate, whose Fatah Party lost elections last January to the militant group Hamas, which wants to destroy the state of Israel. Continued |
Even Bush is flip flopping. We will NEVER win the war on terror this way, NEVER! Our lack of border security is just more proof that Bush ran out the front door to fight this war on terror and left the back door open, which is an open portal to drug lords, drug traffic, al Qaida, the MS-13 Gang, and scores of illegals. We are safer than on September 10, 2001, but much more could have been done this past year that was also neglected. Policies that would have secured our borders and secured our safety.
Then we wonder why the world is laughing at us. We look stupid all because of our appeasement politics. That my friend is suicidal any way you looik at it.
To say this politely, I am extremely disappointed in DUBYA---our 2004 COWBOY has turned into a D.C. politician. I thought Bush had more hutzpah than that. I was wrong.
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Last edited by Doll on Thu Sep 21, 2006 12:56 am; edited 5 times in total |
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NortonPete
PO2
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 385
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 12:21 am Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| jwb7605 wrote: | I need some thoughts on this:
Ahmadinejad "invited" Bush to convert to Islam (to no avail!).
Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez are apparently close buddies (allies, at any rate). |
I think just your garden variety American Hater.... No connection after the protest rally breaks up and the signs are discarded.
| Quote: |
What's up with these (unholy?) alliances?
is Chavez that stupid? He'll end up being conquered by Muslim extremists ... he's got to know that much.
is Ahmadinejad that embracing?
how can Ahmadinejad publicly proclaim friendship with and support for an atheist or (more likely) a non-practicing Christian?
how can someone get up at the U.N. and give such weird speeches and still get 'thunderous applause and approval'?
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Pay it no mind. I recall Fidel Castro in NY plucking a chicken and getting rave reviews at the UN.
One day the dwarf jihadist will be threatening to cut off fat boy Chavez's head.
| Quote: | | Where is all this going? |
Basically nowhere but we need a leader like GWBush. The kids know they can play
and be bad at the back of the class but the "Teacher" can box their ears. |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 12:35 am Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| NortonPete wrote: | Basically nowhere but we need a leader like GWBush. The kids know they can play
and be bad at the back of the class but the "Teacher" can box their ears. |
What news are you reading? No offense, but we have an Iranian President on our home soil insulting an American President, in effect insulting the American people. We have a Venezuelan President calling our President a devil on our home soil and all the while the American political machine grins and bears it to the shame of our political, social, and religious structure. This is not taking the higher ground--this is called stupidity.
We do not need a George Bush we need a George Washington!
I bet our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves!
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Schadow
Vice Admiral
Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 936
Location: Huntsville, Alabama
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:06 am Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| jwb7605 wrote: | | I don't even know what Chavez' religion is. (I don't even know if he is religious.) |
Apparently some variety of Catholic. As he was referring to Bush as the devil and that the smell of sulfur still lingered about the speakers podium, he crossed himself, apparently his comical attempt at exorcism.
Of course, Ahmadinejad had been at the podium after Bush was, but - never mind.
Rush is right. The UN and all its "excellencies" resemble the Star Wars bar scene to a "T".
Doll, go easy on the Prez. One has to do the insane dance of the weird world of 'diplomacy' if only to make the contrast with the Chavezes and Ahmadinejads more stark. In the car and back on the plane, he is doing what needs doing for our best interests.
Schadow
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Capt, 8th U.S. Army, Korea '53 - '54 |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:16 am Post subject: |
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I do not necessarily agree with you Schadow on that one. Just look at our border situation. Is that doing the best he can for Americans? Allowing fascists to come on our soil and insult this great nation is not allowed anywhere in the world, except in the U.S. Why should any one respect us when we do not respect ourselves by NOT allowing such fascists to do what they do in the U.N.
W talks the talk and has only walked HALF the walk.
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Schadow
Vice Admiral
Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 936
Location: Huntsville, Alabama
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:45 am Post subject: |
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| Doll wrote: | | .... Just look at our border situation. Is that doing the best he can for Americans? |
Unfortunately, we have a Congress, only slightly less dysfunctional than the UN. And, although the President's party has a majority, we all know how the minority is fully capable of mucking things up. By the way, on 16 September the House passed a bill by 260 to 159 authorizing construction of 700 miles of reinforced double fencing. It's a start if the Senate Democrats can't find a way to scuttle it.
| Quote: | | .... Allowing fascists to come on our soil and insult this great nation is not allowed anywhere in the world, except in the U.S. Why should any one respect us when we do not respect ourselves by NOT allowing such fascists to do what they do in the U.N. |
Unfortunately, the UN is currently based in New York, therefore the environs of New York within a certain distance of UN HQ is sacred international territory. About the only thing the president can do about that is to do whatever's necessary to end their lease. When the day comes when the UN leaves for Paris or some other place with nightlife suitable for the "excellencies", we're stuck with them and the various tyrants and loonies that Kofi wants in.
Schadow
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Capt, 8th U.S. Army, Korea '53 - '54 |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:57 am Post subject: |
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| Schadow wrote: | | Doll wrote: | | .... Just look at our border situation. Is that doing the best he can for Americans? |
Unfortunately, we have a Congress, only slightly less dysfunctional than the UN. And, although the President's party has a majority, we all know how the minority is fully capable of mucking things up. By the way, on 16 September the House passed a bill by 260 to 159 authorizing construction of 700 miles of reinforced double fencing. It's a start if the Senate Democrats can't find a way to scuttle it. |
True, but the problem lies in IF it will be funded, if ever. Right now it is doubtful it will be funded anytime soon and the construction will take up to five years.
| Schadow wrote: | | doll wrote: | | .... Allowing fascists to come on our soil and insult this great nation is not allowed anywhere in the world, except in the U.S. Why should any one respect us when we do not respect ourselves by NOT allowing such fascists to do what they do in the U.N. |
Unfortunately, the UN is currently based in New York, therefore the environs of New York within a certain distance of UN HQ is sacred international territory. About the only thing the president can do about that is to do whatever's necessary to end their lease. When the day comes when the UN leaves for Paris or some other place with nightlife suitable for the "excellencies", we're stuck with them and the various tyrants and loonies that Kofi wants in.Schadow |
That is true, but that does not mean we just sit back and take it. After all we are funding the U.N. with taxpayer dollars, government resources, and it is time that the poo poo is given notice. Leases can be broken. The U.N. can be booted out of New York, but it comes down to politics and the political god of our country and every other, money.
So much for wasting our breathe!
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Navy_Navy_Navy
Admin
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Doll wrote: | | What news are you reading? (snip) This is not taking the higher ground--this is called stupidity. |
No, it's not called "stupidity," unless you're over on duhhhhhmie-land - it's called "diplomacy."
If it isn't courageous for a leader of a Muslim country to admit that they are in "dire need" of our help to reestablish the peace process, then I must admit that I don't know what courage is. Any leader who speaks of the US with even the smallest iota of respect is hanging by a thread - of course we need to be encouraging them!
Good heavens - none of us can even imagine the combination of tightropes that our leaders must walk every minute of the day, especially in a world where the flame-throwers are ready to take offense and start killing us over a misunderstanding.
We let Bill Clinton slide on every last thing, but you're going to judge the President on his choice of words in such an incredibly touchy situation? Really?
In an ideal world, there would be several things I would change about this administration's policies, but trying to promote diplomacy in this world-gone-mad is not one of them.
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~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
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shawa
CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 2004
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Good heavens - none of us can even imagine the combination of tightropes that our leaders must walk every minute of the day, especially in a world where the flame-throwers are ready to take offense and start killing us over a misunderstanding. |
Well said, EJ.
President Bush talks the talk and ALSO walks the walk VERY CAREFULLY, through mine fields everywhere he turns. And with a Congress that is NOT a majority when you've got so many RINOS stabbing him in the back.
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“I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. ‘Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.” (Thomas Paine, 1776) |
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Ohio Voter
PO2
Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 360
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 5:18 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Doll wrote: | [
What news are you reading? No offense, but we have an Iranian President on our home soil insulting an American President, in effect insulting the American people. We have a Venezuelan President calling our President a devil on our home soil and all the while the American political machine grins and bears it to the shame of our political, social, and religious structure. This is not taking the higher ground--this is called stupidity.
We do not need a George Bush we need a George Washington!
I bet our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves! |
We need a George Bush because he is the current, modern, president in a modern world that is very unlike that of George Washington. To win a war we also need support of the loyal opposition so that two cent worth dictators don't think they can come here to get support of dissatisfied Americans. They read the liberal MSM and listened to hollywood and decided we don't like our president.
BTW, the liberals stuck their finger in the air and determined that their base is outraged at what tinhorn dictators have said on our soil. Now the liberals are coming out against Chavez and saying they are for Bush. Go figure.
They did not come at the invite of the US government. It is the UN soil they are on that is located in the US, at great expense to US tax payers. |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:03 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Navy_Navy_Navy wrote: | | Doll wrote: | | What news are you reading? (snip) This is not taking the higher ground--this is called stupidity. |
No, it's not called "stupidity," unless you're over on duhhhhhmie-land - it's called "diplomacy." |
Hiding behind dipolmacy failed us in the past and it is failing us now. This is a crazy world yes, and fighting every battle makes no sence, and true, in some cases diplomacy works. However, there must come a time when our leaders must do more than hide behind diplomacy and stand up to what is wrong. And fighting the war on terror is not enough. Our politics of late and our failed immigration measures is duhhhhmie-land. You cannot use DIPLOMACY with people that DO NOT know what DIPLOMACY is. 9/11 proved that and sadly we are headed towards another 9/11 at the rate this country is going. So much for this kind of 'diplomacy'.
I suggest for those that have not read this book to read it. "They Just Don't Get It" by Col. David Hunt (U.S. Army Ret.)
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The HILL Chronicles
Soldiers' Angels
"Wednesday Hero - Google It!"
Last edited by Doll on Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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NortonPete
PO2
Joined: 13 Aug 2004
Posts: 385
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Ohio Voter wrote: |
BTW, the liberals stuck their finger in the air and determined that their base is outraged at what tinhorn dictators have said on our soil. Now the liberals are coming out against Chavez and saying they are for Bush. Go figure.
They did not come at the invite of the US government. It is the UN soil they are on that is located in the US, at great expense to US tax payers. |
Yes, this non reaction by GWBush and others in the GOP can only help.
Had he gone on an attack everyone would have stood back and said "Its GWBush's fault no one likes us".
Remember we have elections in a few weeks.
I learned a bit about diplomacy during the many hours of grammar school detention. Someone said something about my Mother and I hit him, unfortunately a good shot. Well all the girls were helping him and hissing at me. Sister Agnes took me by the ear all the way to detention.
No one cared about what he said. |
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Navy_Navy_Navy
Admin
Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 5777
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:36 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Doll wrote: | | Hiding behind dipolmacy failed us in the past and it is failing us now. |
Who says that we're "hiding?" Who says that diplomacy is failing? It usually takes more than a few years to accurately analyze success and failure in any particular incidence.
| Quote: | | However, there must come a time when our leaders must do more than hide behind diplomacy and stand up to what is wrong. |
And you don't believe that the President is standing up against evil, now?
| Quote: | | And fighting the war on terror is not enough. Our politics of late and our failed immigration measures is duhhhhmie-land. |
I'm sorry, I'm not following you. You complained about the President's terminology and accuse him of hiding behind failed diplomacy, and I posted an alternate opinion. (And, "Duhhhhmie" refers to that place that shall not be named, not to you, personally, by the way.)
| Quote: | | You cannot use DIPLOMACY with people that DO NOT know what DIPLOMACY is. |
You don't use diplomacy on people who don't know what it is. You use it for the people who do. Most of the world still does.
| Quote: | | 9/11 proved that and sadly we are headed towards another 9/11 at the rate this country is going. So much for this kind of 'diplomacy'. |
You can't blame another 9-11 on failed diplomacy. Another 9-11 is coming at us no matter what we do and it's been coming at us for 1500 years. That's the nature of radical Islam and it always has been - to convert by the sword.
_________________
~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother |
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Doll
Commander
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Posts: 339
Location: The Beltway
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| Posted: Thu Sep 21, 2006 6:47 pm Post subject: Re: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Hugo Chavez |
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| Navy_Navy_Navy wrote: | | Doll wrote: | | Hiding behind dipolmacy failed us in the past and it is failing us now. |
Who says that we're "hiding?" Who says that diplomacy is failing? It usually takes more than a few years to accurately analyze success and failure in any particular incidence.
| Quote: | | However, there must come a time when our leaders must do more than hide behind diplomacy and stand up to what is wrong. |
And you don't believe that the President is standing up against evil, now?
| Quote: | | And fighting the war on terror is not enough. Our politics of late and our failed immigration measures is duhhhhmie-land. |
I'm sorry, I'm not following you. You complained about the President's terminology and accuse him of hiding behind failed diplomacy, and I posted an alternate opinion. (And, "Duhhhhmie" refers to that place that shall not be named, not to you, personally, by the way.)
| Quote: | | You cannot use DIPLOMACY with people that DO NOT know what DIPLOMACY is. |
You don't use diplomacy on people who don't know what it is. You use it for the people who do. Most of the world still does.
| Quote: | | 9/11 proved that and sadly we are headed towards another 9/11 at the rate this country is going. So much for this kind of 'diplomacy'. |
You can't blame another 9-11 on failed diplomacy. Another 9-11 is coming at us no matter what we do and it's been coming at us for 1500 years. That's the nature of radical Islam and it always has been - to convert by the sword. |
You may find it appealing to pick apart my beliefs. However, I stand by what I wrote. I do not believe in BLIND faith. Bush is failing us. Period.
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"Wednesday Hero - Google It!"
Last edited by Doll on Thu Sep 21, 2006 7:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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