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Leeman
PO3
Joined: 08 Nov 2004
Posts: 265
Location: Connecticut
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TEWSPilot
Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 1235
Location: Kansas (Transplanted Texan)
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 Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:48 am Post subject: |
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| Maybe the atheists could get someone from the Hemlock Society to commit suicide and then get a psychic to hold a seance and ask the deceased what it was like after death, if there were any signs of God. For added effect, the deceased could even try to interview deceased veterans and ask how they felt about allowing the Cross to stand. They could play the whole episode on "Coast to Coast AM" overnight, and whatever they found out, they could present with their brief before SCOTUS....meanwhile, just let the land swap proceed and the problem goes away. |
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LewWaters
Admin
Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 4042
Location: Washington State
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 5:38 am Post subject: |
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This case is a pure travesty. The retired Civil Servant bringing the suit through the ACLU says it was due to a Buddhist Stupa being denied built nearby.
A Stupa is not a Memorial but a domed building holding Buddhist artifacts.
When Frank Buno, the one claiming "injury" retired from the National Preserve, he headed straight to the ACLU who demanded removal of the Memorial. In spite of any claims to the contrary, no requests or suits were ever filed to allow other "religious" symbols in Honor of War Dead be erected, just the total destruction of this Memorial, 11 miles off of the main road.
Congress ceded 1 acre of land the Memorial sits on to the VFW in exchange for 5 acres to satisfy the cry of a "religious" symbol on public land.
Buno and the ACLU took it back to court to have the transfer ruled unconstitutional, which shows their only intent is destroying a 75 year-old Memorial.
I've been fortunate to have befriended a former ACLU attorney who argued in Federal Court on behalf of the Mt. Soledad War Memorial in San Diego, saving it from the fate they intend on this one.
Of the cross used he says, | Quote: | "Symbols have meaning in collective life. People die for them. For instance, the Flag. The Cross manifestly has a religious aspect. But, equally manifestly, it conveys a secular meaning -- the meaning of selfless service and sacrifice for others, and is so understood. Universally. Beyond language barriers. In fact, there is not other symbol so universally recognized as representing selfless service and sacrifice for others, including the ultimate sacrifice of one's life. That is how it is understood at veterans memorials, and why it is the symbol so often chosen to honor the war dead.
When I argued the the Mt. Soledad National War Memorial Case in the 4th District Court of Appeal in California, I challenged the justices to identify any other symbol universally recognized as representing selfless service and sacrifice for others, saying we would withdraw our opposition to destruction of the Cross if they, or anyone, could name any other symbol other than the Cross. They could not. No one has." |
and | Quote: | | "The Cross, too, has acquired a secular meaning--the meaning of goodness, of self-sacrifice for others. Tear down the Cross and you are left with the absence of any symbol adequate to honor the service and sacrifice of veterans." |
I don't think I need quote his over all opinion of many of his fellow attorneys, especially those from the ACLU. 
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Clark County Conservative |
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TEWSPilot
Admiral
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 1235
Location: Kansas (Transplanted Texan)
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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From Sweet Spirits of Amonia blog
| Quote: | "One of the great myths of the 20th – and now 21st – century is the belief that the American Civil Liberties Union was an organization that had a noble beginning, but somehow strayed off course.
That myth is untrue. The ACLU set a course to destroy America – her freedom and her values – right from the start."
Read the truth about Roger Baldwin and Crystal Eastman, the founders. Learn more about the relationship to Earl Browder, Emma Goldman and Margaret Sanger.
What is the conclusion?
"Instead of being an organization that simply took a 'wrong turn,' the ACLU has devoted itself from the very beginning to the devastation of America's most cherished traditions, values, and laws."
And, when you are done with that, visit Stop the ACLU and find out what you can do to help fight subversion in America. Remember, our traditions, values and freedoms are at stake. |
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Schadow
Vice Admiral
Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 936
Location: Huntsville, Alabama
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| Posted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 4:24 am Post subject: |
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The entire transcript of the oral arguments before SCOTUS is found at:
http://www.supremecourtus.gov/oral_arguments/argument_transcripts/08-472.pdf
I slogged through the whole thing and, surprisingly, came away optimistic about the eventual ruling. Most of the questions dealt with the transfer to the VFW of the acre on which the cross stands. There was little if any typical ACLU blather about the offensiveness of the cross to atheists or anyone else.
Out on a limb, I'm predicting a win for the cross and the VFW by 5 to 4 or possibly 6 to 3.
Schadow
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Capt, 8th U.S. Army, Korea '53 - '54 |
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