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JimRobson

I realize that in the war the "Welcome to Cambodia" signs were probably shot to hell, but I just can't imagine that while in a river, they couldn't figure out where they were.

What was the range of the radar on a SWIFT boat? The PTF boats had about 25 miles and we relied on it for normal navigation, and otherwise we used dead reconing. (I was the radar operator and navigator on our boat and I'm not saying that I was perfect Wink

)

I also realize that there were probably no marker bouy's and the charts, if any, were probably very primative, but gimme a break.

I don't buy the "maybe we were, maybe we weren't in Cambodia" on Christmas or any other time.

Maybe one of you Swifties could shed some light on the navigational norms in rivers.
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ASPB · Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2004 8:24 am Post subject:

Don't go there! Laughing

He was 56 miles from the border in Sa Dec. His own diary says so (its been reported), Brinkley says so, Zaldonis, Wasser, and Gardner have all said so.

To answer your question though, there was of course no GPS. Loran A was available but I don't recall if Swifts were so equipped. ASPBs and PBRs weren't.

The navigation was by dead reckoning...(speed - time thus distance plus compass heading), not hard to do with good charts on the songs and dhongs. I updated my DR every 12 minutes (2 tenths of an hour) in unfamiliar areas. Radar was available to assist. The charts were French and very good.

He could not have crossed the border on that river. PBRs first and secondly anchored gun barges would have stopped him up river. Sa Dec was the inland border of 13's AOR. He was 3 to 4 hours minimum from the border by Swift boat.

Even if there were covert border crossings (which there were on such rivers as the Vam Co Tay) they didn't start until about March of '69. ASPBs or PBRs would have been used there. Wink

Swifts wouldn't have been used because they're too bloody loud.
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ASPB · Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2004 8:55 am Post subject:

My memory is vague on radar range but if I had to guess either 16 or 24 nautical miles. Definitely no more than 32 nautical miles.
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Indianbaboon · Lieutenant Joined: 04 Jul 2004 Posts: 234

this is from another thread, but since you're getting technical here, i'll throw it in,

if Kerry was now with 2 PBR's...y?

if it's a covert op, wont' you want to absolutely limit the number of people who knew?

at a minimum this now means that the two PBR guys, Kerry, and their respective COs know. instead of 2 boat crews and a higher up, your up to 3 boat crews and two higher ups, increasing number of peopel who know by like 7 or 8.

Also, weren't PBRs bigger than swifts? I just can't see any logical reason why you'd used a mixed group for a covert drop

ASPB · Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2004 9:35 am Post subject:

PBRs were much smaller, faster, and quieter. For small group insertions they were the best choice. 2nd choice would have been ASPBs but I don't believe any were down near An Thoi at the time in question (January and February...for now). Lots of them were around the COSDIV 13 AOR.
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On Sale! Order in lots of 100 now at velero@rcn.com Free for the cost of shipping All profits (if any, especially now) go to Swiftvets. The author of "Sink Kerry Swiftly" ---ASPB

Indianbaboon · Lieutenant Joined: 04 Jul 2004 Posts: 234

found a webpage immediately after...
that story is just so full of holes, it's even worse now that he's tried to patch it up, it reminds me of one of those cartoons where Bugs Bunny plugs a leak with a finger and then two more sprout up, and then all of a sudden Bugs is using all his appendages his ears and his tongue and there are still leaks springing up

rbshirley · Founder Joined: 07 May 2004 Posts: 394

FF1047 · Lieutenant Joined: 11 Aug 2004 Posts: 222

If you expected to be able to get any air support you would have to keep pretty good idea of your location ... That would be one of the most important things the boat Captain would handle in an operation, the lives of his men would depend on it ... So either he was a rotten naviagtor, a scary thought if you were on his boat, or he is full of it.
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JJC
USNA class of 1980