SwiftVets.com

Dubious · Seaman Recruit Joined: 22 Aug 2004 Posts: 1

Admin note: Hearsay and unsubstantiated. Please do not post material that defames Vietnam era vets. If your story is true, then your acquaintance was an oddity. More likely he was lying through his teeth. Wannabe syndrome. People like him helped to contribute to the odious reputation with which vets of that era had to live when they returned.

joe_madeup · Seaman Apprentice Joined: 20 Aug 2004 Posts: 92

[This responds to a post from 'dubious' which apparently was just wiped out. If the moderator wiped it out, feel free to wipe this as well.]

Nobody is claiming that no atrocities were committed at all. I am told that a few are always committed, which is one of the reasons war is bad.

Having said that, I see a difference between atrocities as policy (Genghis Khan), vs. atrocities which are against policy, investigated and punished, because most of the guys serving are noble and professional. Kerry said it was the first one. And Kerry's (few) witnesses or informants were, upon investigation, discredited.

Herb · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:27 am Post subject:

I think that these elements are being UNDER WORKED

Bronze Star incident: Kerry MOVED his RICE wound from earlier in the day, moved it from another location to the fish weir, and moved it from BUTT to arm but doesn't have any medical records except a BRUISE on the arm.

This also discredits Rassmann's account of the "bleeding arm" but the KEY is the SELF-INFLICTED wound through his own negligence while not under enemy fire.

This is EVEN SHOWN in the WaPost map and article and none of the "Kerry Campaign Crew" have disagreed -- even Rassmann was with Kerry when Kerry almost blew HIM up while NOT under enemy fire.

Sandusky (Kerry's pilot) outed Kerry's campaign movie lie when he EXPLAINED WHY Kerry's boat was the only on to leave (and return) while the other boats rescued the 3-Boat and those in the water -- rather than the Kerry version (LIE) which had everyone else "fleeing".

Silver Star -- even ROOD proved that Kerry didn't chase down a "superior enemy force" or charge a "entrenched enemy positions" or do so alone.

Gardner's Account of the child killing in the sampan while Kerry was missing (probably asleep at his station).

The KEY here is not so much the KILLING of the child (and the father) but that Kerry LIED about it on the report claiming about a half dozen "VC" killed and claiming to have captured "more VC" (the mother and baby).

Gardner does a good job on this -- and bravely (IMO) admits straight out that HE (Gardner) fired the rounds that killed father and child. Kerry was supposed to watch the radar and give them several hundred yards standoff to prevent such firing being necessary.

Note: All that detail is too COMPLICATED for all but written accounts.
The KEY is "Sound Bites that BITE into Kerry's LIES"

True, overwhelming, concise, memorable, compelling.

Here is a way you CAN PROVE Kerry a liar to even the most bias listener (he might refuse to "count" them but he cannot refute them):

Kerry confessed to being a war criminal and committing atrocities -- he re-affirmed this even this year (2004) -- he is either a LIAR or a WAR CRIMINAL.

You can even hear and SEE Kerry lying in that add and his campaign material: He claims they were ORDERED to use 50 Calibre machine guns as their ONLY Weapon against civilians -- then he stalks around in his "home war movies" with an M-16 and discussing M60s and other firearms.

It's minor but it is ESSENTIAL to the lie: He claims a war crime with NO CHOICE given him and then proves it false over and over.
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Herb

frankenwil · Former Member Joined: 23 Aug 2004 Posts: 15

Yesterday I searched the web and found the transcript of Kerry's testimony as printed in the Congressional Record. His testimony referred to what other people had told him. Kerry never confessed to war crimes in his testimony to Congress.

Scott · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:47 am Post subject:

frankenwil,

When Kerry used the word "I" in his testimony, to whom was he referring?
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Bye bye, Boston Straggler!

4moreyears · Former Member Joined: 08 Aug 2004 Posts: 591

kerry...the voice of authority and conviction...

Now there's an idea...conviction...just what he needs for his admitted war crimes....

Of course he had to throw mud on all vets...so that no one would notice the dirt on him....
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kerry returned to the United States on July 22, 1971, held a press conference publicly calling on President Nixon... for the surrender of the United States to North Vietnam.

LewWaters · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:54 am Post subject:

Frankenwil, please read and note:

This is John F. Kerry's admission in his own words...

Herb · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 7:25 am Post subject:

Bhist · Lieutenant Joined: 01 Jun 2004 Posts: 228

Son Of The Godfather · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:29 am Post subject:

Tilly · Seaman Apprentice Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Posts: 97

Here's three things that we know for sure:

1) Kerry did not spend Christmas in Cambodia

2) Kerry's THREE purple hearts were earned in four months, including one month of training. He got them somehow without having to have a hospitalization, bullets and he didn't even have to miss a day of duty for any of them.

3) Kerry bashed his fellow servicemen when he came home, while they were on active duty.

Frankly, without the book, I wouldn't have known the first two things. And, believe me ... it makes a difference!

NavyChief · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:17 pm Post subject:

NavyChief · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:31 pm Post subject:

Polaris · Rear Admiral Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 626

Everyone,

NavyChief is right. Kerry's account of 13 March is a fraud. Just a smidgen of common sense and experience with assault rifles will tell you that. 75 yards (the width of the canal as I understand it) is point blank range for an AK-47 even for man sized targets much less a swiftboat.

If Kerry really had gone 3.2 miles (5000 meters) through heavy small arms fire, his boat should have looked like swiss cheese and his personelle casualties should have been severe.

The problem is the casualty and damage reports indicate no such thing. I consider that slam-dunk forensic evidence that shows that Kerry can not be telling the truth.
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-Polaris

Truth is Beauty

NavyChief · Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2004 2:57 pm Post subject:

Thanks Polaris. Wink

If anyone is still in doubt whether Kerry actually wrote the Market Time Spot Report for 13 Mar 69 action, let me know. I am working on a shortened version of the letter I sent to the Washington Post fisking Michael Dobbs story to prove once and for all that Kerry was the only author of the spot report and how that report would have generated the BS and 3rd PH recommendations. The incident was started with fraud and ended with fraud.

- instigator
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Working with Senator Kerry four years in the POW/MIA Office left me thinking -- when did the man ever do any work?