SwiftVets.com

[cedarford]

I would appreciate it if anyone can steer me to the truth of this Kerry story that I haven't seen discussed here or in the MSM:

I just had a chance to read the Dick Cavett Show Kerry- v. O'Neill Debate 6/30/71 transcript. Much has been brought out, but I noticed another possible not yet debunked Kerry Whopper in the transcript.

MR. KERRY: ......(regarding free fire zones and other activities Kerry said violated the Hague and Geneva Conventions) The fact of the matter is that the members of Coastal Division 11 and Coastal Division 13 when I was in Vietnam were fighting the policy very, very hard, to the point that many of the members were refusing to carry out orders on some of their missions; to the point where the crews started to in fact mutiny, say, "I would not go back on the rivers again;" the point where my commanding officer was relieved of duty because he pressed our objections to what we were doing with the captain in command of the entire operation.

MR. CAVETT: The man above you was relieved of duty?

MR. KERRY: That is correct. The man above me was finally relieved of duty.

So, can anyone here who is better informed on this, is actually a SBVT member who was there, or someone on the ADMINISTRATOR staff - help with these questions?

1. Who Kerry's CO was. And was he relieved of command for protesting his men being ordered to engage in atrocities?

2. Were there mutinous Swift Boat crews who refused orders??

3. This Kerry accusation wasn't discussed in "Unfit for Command", was it?

4. Is this a major lie on Kerry's part, readily debunked, that should also be brought to public attention by a statement from his former CO and former crewmates dispute his version of a CO relieved of duty for protesting atrocities and crew mutinies?

[jwbarden]

Another Kerry lie.

LCDR G. M. ELLIOT was COMCOSDIV11 14AUG68 to 6MAY69. retired as CAPT in 1985. LCDR J.W. STREULI was COMCOSDIV13 16AUG68 to 3NOV69, retired as CDR 1972. LCDR G. W. HIBBARD was COMCOSDIV14 12JAN68 to 10JAN69, retired as CDR, 1981.

Somehow, none of the other Swiftvets recall their COs being relieved during this period.

[cedarford]

Thank you Jwbarden! Perhaps Hibbard, Strueli, and Elliot should consider issuing a statement under SBVT auspices, along with members of the affected boat crews, denying anyone was removed from command or any crew mutinied because of higher-up orders to commit atrocities.

Mutiny in wartime, removal from command in wartime are significant, grave charges - and Kerry made them on a national TV broadcast no doubt to give more significance to his VVFW claims of widespread atrocities.

The two charges have been left lying without formal rebuttal as far as I know. It might be covered in "Unfit for Command", but my book copy won't arrive for at least 2 more weeks.

[GT]

Kerry said "...my commanding officer was relieved of duty because he pressed OUR objections to what we were doing...". This sentence comes right after his saying the crew was starting to mutiny. Is he referring to the crew he was with?

[manelly]

Another bold faced lie
_________________
Enlighten the people, generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like spirits at the dawn of day.
- Thomas Jefferson

[lobster]

There is a some more information from a Boston Globe article written June 16 that might help somebody recall this meeting, if it occurred. Quoting from the Globe:

... Kerry said he was appalled that the Navy's 'free "fire zone"' policy put civilians at such high risk. So, on Jan. 22, 1969, Kerry and several dozen fellow skippers and officers traveled to Saigon to complain about the policy in an extraordinary meeting with Zumwalt and the overall commander of the war, General Creighton W. Abrams Jr.

(End quote). Apparently the meeting didn't go very well because the Globe wrote that "Within days of the Saigon meeting, he joined a five-man crew on swift boat No. 94. ... Starting in late January 1969, this crew completed 18 missions over an intense and dangerous 48 days, almost all of them in the dense jungles of the Mekong Delta."

(End Quote.)

The story about how Kerry got his first purple heart doesn't seem to match at all with what's known now. That perhaps indicates Kerry was trying to cover up that he may not have earned his first Purple Heart.

Link:
http://www.boston.com/globe/nation/packages/kerry/061603.shtml

Also the Globe article includes a link to a transcription of part of Kerry's own type-written log which he kept while in Vietnam - for Christmas, 1968. In the last paragraph Kerry's own log never refers to being in Cambodia, but instead Kerry writes of being near a Vietnamese outpost celebrating Christmas. That's when Kerry radioed out a message "Merry Christmas from the most inland Market Time unit."

[jrsdad]

[lobster]