SwiftVets.com

[the0point]

I'm not that familiar with these military documents. Can someone please verify what exactly Druge is saying?

http://www.drudgereport.com

Do the Kerry people have egg on their face?

[neverforget]

I sent him few e-mails about they should be printing the truth, rather than just DNC talking points and threats and accusations.

Someone else on the forum posted the link to the pdf.
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US Army Security Agency
1965-1971

[neverforget]

He was in the Air Force Reserves for pilot training.
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US Army Security Agency
1965-1971

[Hammer2]

He was on active duty in the Air Force for training.



In my best Snidely Whiplash voice:

Curses, Foiled Again!
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"The price of freedom is eternal vigilence" - Thomas Jefferson
"An armed society is a polite society" - Thomas Jefferson
"The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it won't be needed until someone tries to take it away." -- Thomas Jefferson

[FF1047]

Drudge is pointing out that Bush was active duty Air Force during his 120 training ... so the Dems charge that he "lied" about serving in Air Force (during 1978 campaign) is lame ...
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JJC
USNA class of 1980

[Daniel J. Hutchison]

The National Guard is a State organization commanded by the Governor with the responsibility to defend the State. Thus, when anyone looks into President George W. Bush's National Guard service they should also include his years as Commander-in-Chief of the Texas National Guard, as well as his time as a young officer.

The National Guard can also be commanded by the President of the United States when called to active duty. With the current deployments of National Guard Units President George W. Bush has also been Commander-in-Chief of many guard units.

To the casual observer the National Guard and the Reserves appear to be the same, however, they are not. Every officer serving in the National Guard has the obligation to defend the constitution of their State as well as the constiutuion of the United States. As an officer in the National Guard your rank is established by the state and you report to the Governor. In order for the National Guard to quickly function under a federal (national) callup and report to the President, the National Guard Officers also receive "Federal Recognization" of their rank upon completing the same requirements as active duty or reserve officers. The bottom line is the National Guard officer has a much larger responsibility than their active duty counter part.

While some of the training for National Guard Officers is conducted with in the state organizations, much of the training is conducted along side the active duty or reserve counter parts. In time of a national emergency a National Guard Officer is called to duty along with the unit. However, for individual training, and with the approval of the Governor, a National Guard Officer can be assigned to an active duty unit for training.

In the case with George W. Bush, the State of Texas assigned him to flight training along side the active duty and reserve Air Force students. For the period of training (over one year) George W. Bush was assigned to the United State Air Force for flight training. During this training he had the same duty, pay, obligations, living conditions, training, etc as any other United States Air Force Officer. Upon completion of flight training he was returned to his National Guard unit and the command of the Governor of the State of Texas, while the acitve duty or reserve officers went on to their next assignments. Bottom line: George W. Bush did serve in the United States Air Force.

Under the current regulations any time spent in a Federal status of over 90 days is documented on a form 214. Active duty time of less than 90 days is not documented on a form 214.

[air_vet]

It's all just another example of how poorly the DNC understands the military!

[TEWSPilot]

Basically, that form is the same committment every reservist and guardsman had to sign when going to training. We trained with an active duty Field Training Detachment. For example, as an Air Force ROTC cadet during college, I had to sign a two year contract stating that if I flunked out, I would immediately be placed on Extended Active Duty as an Airman slicksleeve and report for bootcamp to Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio. Upon graduation from college and the ROTC program, I was commissioned a 2ndLt (sorry, can't superscript, hehehe) and again was placed on Extended Active Duty and ordered to report for 53 weeks of Undergraduate Pilot Training. Every second counted as active duty with the Air Force. We had Air National Guard students in our class, and they were on Extended Active Duty just the same as I was. I continued to serve in every assignment as a Reserve Officer on Extended Active Duty. We were later offered an opportunity to become "Regular" Officers, but I stayed a Reservist. My year in Vietnam was as a Reserve Officer on Extended Active Duty. My entire time in the Air Force, all of the time on Extended Active Duty and including my final 3 years in the Inactive Reserves, was spent as a Reserve Officer. The same would have been true for a Guardsman called to Extended Active Duty.

Anyone familiar with the procedure for requesting assignments during that time frame should be familiar with the various "Palace" programs. "Palace Cobra" was the program for going to Vietnam. "Palace Chase" was the program to transition from active duty to the Guard or a Reserve unit. In spite of what Bill O'Reilly has said about "checking the box", the form had two options: Volunteer for SEA (Southeast Asia) and Non-Volunteer for SEA. Each had a "box" to check. SEA included ALL of Southeast Asia, not just Vietnam. That's all there was to it. As a volunteer, I was simply relieving the Air Force of any obligation to first send me to some other assignment based on having met my remote or overseas assignment obligations. If I had already served an overseas or remote assignment, they would have to send someone else ahead of me without that "Volunteer" statement. There was a whole protocol to assignments and overseas assignments and remote assignments, so the "Volunteer" statement was essentially a waiver to allow the Air Force to disregard that protocol. Even with a "Volunteer" statement on record, the Air Force was still under no obligation to send me if my specialty wasn't needed. If it wasn't needed, I had very little chance of being allowed to go unless I was willing to change specialties. A Non-Volunteer could still be ordered to go AHEAD OF ME if his specialty was needed and mine was not. The "Volunteer" statement simply offered the Air Force an option to send a person, but it was at the pleasure of the Air Force, not the individual. The Air Force could send anyone they wanted, "Volunteer" statement or not. I'm sure the same held true for the other branches of service. Thus ends the Bill O'Reilly myth of "checking the box."

Now for a sidebar to the question at hand about GW Bush and 120 days of "Active Duty": More that 30 years ago, GW Bush would have had to spend 53 consecutive weeks on active duty during Undergraduate Pilot Training to become a qualified pilot, but this was not in Vietnam. John Kerry spent a year on a ship near Vietnam, so for all intents and purposes, neither served a year in Vietnam based on that duty. Kerry's time may have counted as a tour, and that is fine with me, I just thought you might want to see the way the two men spent one year of their service laid out side by side. By the way, during my 53 weeks, 4 fatalities and 3 serious injuries occurred at our base; and we used newer airplanes than Bush's class. I don't know the statistics from his class. We started with 80 and graduated 40.

GW Bush spent 120 days on active duty training in the F-102 in a Field Training Detachment. His chances of being killed in a training accident were probably less than those of John Kerry being killed on a Swiftboat patrol mission, but I don't know the exact probabilities. Hostile fire increases the odds for the Swiftboat missions by a large factor. John Kerry came home early from Vietnam after 4 months (30 days longer than Bush's 120 days mentioned above) and, well, you know the story. GW Bush did not serve in Vietnam but was available to go as I have outlined above in the "Volunteer" statement explanation. Since that time, he has been Governor of Texas and President of the United States during one of the most dangerous times in American history but has never showcased his military service. John Kerry has been a Lt Governor under Michael Dukakis and a United States Senator for nearly 20 years, but he has never mentioned any of that service and constantly trumpets his 4 months in Vietnam. Having said all that, considering the totality of time spent in military and public service and the accomplishments of each, which of the two principles has served his country more successfully and honorably?
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