SwiftVets.com

[borninthe50s]

I'm not a Kerry supporter, but I have to give him credit for having the courage to take a stand against a war that was terribly wrong. If the US had withdrawn sooner, as hundreds of thousands of protesters tried to pressure the government to do, thousands of young American lives would have been saved.

I was a teenager during the war and had a lottery number, fortunately a high one. What the Swift Boat Veterans For Truth are doing is wrong, because by attacking what Kerry did they are also attacking what I and thousands of others did to pressure the government to bring our troops home. Do they really think we should have continued the war? That would have been insane.

I admire the Swift Boat veterans and every soldier that served in Viet Nam. When I see a Viet Nam veteran or purple heart license plate, I have instant respect for whoever's driving the car. They were heroes, no question about it. And when I talk to Viet Nam veterans, even today, I thank them for their courage and service, for I saw in daily, vivid TV reports and newspaper articles what they endured. It wasn't fair what our government did to them. The right thing to do was bring them home as soon as possible. It took way too long for that to happen.

Swift Boat Veterans for Truth: please leave this whole thing alone. The Viet Nam war was wrong and should have been stopped much earlier. Hundreds of thousands of Americans were right to protest the war, and were instrumental in stopping it. Kerry was just one of them, and I believe he should be commended for it. If you're a Bush supporter and that's not an option, find more legitimate criticisms of Kerry. This one is just plain wrong.

Admin Note: While we will entertain your opinion, we are under no obligation to billboard your contention that John Kerry is something less than a fraud and a liar who opportunistically smeared a generation of his peers with his calumny. This topic has been edited.

[Paul R.]

So... Kerry was right to falsely accuse his comrades of widespread / commonplace atrocities?
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Paul R.

[MrBuzzcut]

How many millions perished after we pulled out? Their blood is partially on the hands of people like you and Kerry.

Tragically, he's reprising his act today ...
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Visit The Ponderosa -- http://www.vandelay.com

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

Did you realize when you were "trying to bring the men back home" that you were parroting KGB-scripted propaganda?

Did you realize that you were supporting the people who were killing our men?

Did you realize that you contributed to their ostracization and marginalization when they returned?

Did you realize that the anti-war movement was never about PEACE, or about "bringing our boys home," but about discrediting our government and our military.

Do you have any idea how much people have suffered because so many thousands of you took to the streets in support of the Viet Cong?

You need to educate yourself.

You clearly have no clue about any of this except as it pertains to YOU.

Support your boy. Vote for him. The rest of us deserve better.
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~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[arkadyfolkner]

Funny, you don't stop a war by maligning a country's soldiers and inflaming the antiwar effort by making those soldiers out to be criminals, savages and baby killers.

Which Kerry Did.

You also don't stop a war by getting in with a rabid group of communist-backed protestors who will even consider treasonous acts like assasination of government officials which support the war.

Which Kerry Did.

And finally you don't stop a war by meeting with the leaders of the enemy without authorization by your nation's delegates.

Which Kerry Did.

[Nomorelies]

Dear Borninthefifties:

First you need to be made patently aware that the SBVT is not aligned with the Bush campaign. While the marjority of us support Bush you miss the point. This is about Stolen Valor. This is about a man who grossly exagerrated his activities during his very brief 4 months in country. This is about a man who turned on his country and committed what many, many people believe to be treason. This is about a man who returned from the war and accused his brothers of atrocities and all manner of horrific acts. These brave men and women have endured abuse and slander for over 35 years because John Forbes Kerry placed a higher value on furthering his political ambitions than he did for his fellow band of brothers. I do not for one minute believe that John Kerry's actions were forged out of love for his country. I do not believe for one minute that John Forbes Kerry cares one whit about the United States of America and or his fellow countrymen. If you believe him to be a man of integrity that's fine and dandy. Stay there. I don't agree. I think John F. Kerry is a pompous fraud.

You are centainly entitled to hold whatever opinion you desire. We would appreciate if you stop trivializing our opinions. We are absolutely entitled to believe as we do and furthermore to voice our opinoins. We have every right to run the ads, print and distribute Unfit For Command and our leaders have the right to go on television and explan our point of view. We have every right to come online and donate our hard earned money for a cause in which we believe with all of our hearts.

And I have every right to tell you that I would rather lay down my life than see my grandchildren live in a country that has as its leader a traitor and fool such as John F. Kerry. You can take that statement to the bank.
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Nomorelies Make a donation HERE

[LewWaters]

Born, yours is one of the few appeals we see here that is not over the top and filled with hate. However, feelings are real deep on this matter.

Allow me to point out a few things.

John F. Kennedy took over Vietnam from Eisenhower, who had just a few advisors in the country. He vowed we would support struggles for freedom, regardless of price. Due to efforts of the anti-war left, we abandoned that war and the people of that country, costing some 3.5 million lives in Vietnam and Cambodia, after the fall of Saigon.

After the Noth's defeat, yes, defeat, in the Tet of 68 offensive, General Vo Ngyuen Giap, Commanding General of the North Vietnamese Army, was going to seek a surrender as he realized he could not defeat the US on the battlefield. However, he got wind of Walter Cronkites famous broadcast declaring it a victory for him and started paying attention to the war protestors back in the US. Colonel Bui Tin, the Officer that accepted the surrender of Saigon and later defected away from the Communists to France, confirmed that the Norths victory over the South was due largely to the efforts of the anti-war left.

At the time of Tet of 68, American deaths were approximately 15,000 or so. Once we left, they were 58,000. Do the math for yourself. It would have been over before Kerry ever got to see a Swift Boat. The war was prolonged, not shortened.

As to the worthiness of that war, is ever worthless to fight for others freedom from oppression? Should we have avoided fighting Germany as Hitler never attacked us and had no means to attack the US?

America has a long history of helping others in their struggles for freedom and Vietnam was no different.

As for Kerry, his actions after his time in Vietnam were in violation of his oath as an Officer. His exploits in Vietnam are highly questionable and he shows a history of opportunism over devotion to duty. His anti-war actions deeply hurt millions of veterans and many of us see him as unfit.

I invite you to search through several articles here and discover why we see him as unfit instead of pleading with the SBVT to cease their assault. Kerry brought this on himself and has never apologized for slandering all of us, Swift Boat veterans and Vietnam veterans in general. Some have managed to forgive, the majority haven't.
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Clark County Conservative

[Paul R.]

The Vietnam War DID slow down communist expansion: Places like Thailand and The Philippines stayed free (ok, yeah, we should have booted Marcos out of RP a LOT sooner.) And, we sapped the communists perhaps more than we knew -- probably hastened the eventual fall of the Soviet Union by a little bit. What we did wrong was not fight for VICTORY by, say, '68. And we should have forced corrupt elements out of the South Vietnamese gov't. (I can hear the cries of "colonialism" now!)

Oh, heck, there are a lot more people on this board who can argue this better than I! But, I do know one thing: We have an even more serious war to fight, now. And it isn't just Iraq, and it won't be just a few years.
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Paul R.

[borninthe50s]

I can fully appreciate verterans' sensitivity regarding Kerry's assertions about atrocities. Yes, it was certainly an exaggeration and a mistake. But we all say things "in the heat of battle" that we later regret. I don't think anyone, including Kerry, believes for a minute that there were scores of atrocities committed by US soldiers. I think Kerry was attempting to save the lives of fellow soldiers by endoing the war. His actions can and perhaps should be criticized, but I don't believe his intentions should be questioned.

I believe WE ALL have blood on our hands. We're all responsible for Viet Nam lasting as long as it did.

As for the history lesson. I sincerely appreciate the time you took to reply, but I remember those years very well, and it was clear to me at the time that the war eventually became the US vs. Communist China. This was a war we could not win without losing hundreds of thousands of lives. Yes, we lost lives by pulling out, but not near as many as the socres we would have lost if we had continued the fight and actually tried to defeat Communist China.

[Navy_Navy_Navy]

You've just said that you think that John Kerry lied.

This is at the heart of the whole argument between SBVFT and John Kerry.

They know he lied, too. They're still bearing the scars.

I was 12 in 1969. I have no blood on my hands. But, if I let this lying, scheming traitor get into the position of Commander in Chief without putting up one hell of of fuss, then I certainly will have.

We're not here to re-fight the Vietnam war. It was politically micro-managed and it became a war that the military was not allowed to win - even though it never lost a SINGLE battle.

We can't let the same mistakes be made today, in Iraq and that's exactly where Mr. Kerry, the anti-military movement and the leftist media are trying to take us.

We can't let them do to this generation of Armed Forces members do what they did to those in the Vietnam era, but again, that's exactly what they're trying to do.

The same types of communists, socialists and anarchists that funded and equipped the anti-military movement back then are providing the funding and propaganda for the anti-military movement, today.

Those who don't learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat it.

"Never forget. Never forgive. Never relent."
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~ Echo Juliet ~
Altering course to starboard - On Fire, Keep Clear
Navy woman, Navy wife, Navy mother

[LewWaters]

B50s, actually, it was the US versus Soviet Communism, the ones we finally defeated in the Cold War.

While you are welcome to your opinion, many of us were there and saw it firsthand, for a lot longer than Kerry. I have my own opinion as to his motives, different from yours. Sincerity doesn't appear to be his strong suit.

His actions before the Fulbright Committee were not "in the heat of battle," neither were his claiming to throw away his medals only to have them appear on his wall in the 80s when he ran for the Senate. Several of his speech's were also not "in the heat of battle," as was his making sure he stayed in a posh hotel while the rest of VVAW slept on the cold ground in the Mall in D.C. Still, if he made these statements "in the heat of battle," wouldn't he have apologized long ago and not recently come out and say he still stands by them and is proud of them?

He brags about volunteering for Vietnam and Swift Boats, yet, in 1986, admitted in a book, The Vietnam Experience, A War Remembered, that he volunteered when the Swift Boats were operating off the coast and were relatively safe duty.

He brags about 2 tours. A tour was a minimum of 12 months, unless wounded severely enough to be medevaced out. He spent 4 months in Swift Boats and prior to that, the USS Gridley that operated miles off the coast of Vietnam also for a few months, docking in Da Nang for one day, when he didn't even get off the ship. Thats a bit more than just an "exaggeration" made "in the heat of battle."

Bush has repeatedly said his service was honorable, which we disagree with. He has yet to say anything about Bush's service other than he can't account for his time or otherwise denegrate Bush's service.

While on the Senate Intelligence Committee, he missed the vast majority of all meetings and once, a staffer, or so they claim, tried to credit him with being co-chair of the committee, when in fact, it was Bob Kerrey, another Democrat Senator.

He currently claims to have the support of the "9-11 Familes," when in truth, 5 widows signed on to support him and over 150 familes have signed against him. That too is a bit more than a mere exaggeration.

If you haven't yet, obtain a copy of Unfit for Command and read through it and review this forum,a s well as wintersoldier.com, both are eye openers.

Ours, is a deep seated resolve that due to his past actions, he is unfit to command and we are exercising our constitutional right to protest his candidacy, as you claim was his right to protest us.
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Clark County Conservative

[Stop Hanoi John]

Kerry also 'vlounteered' for his service, so at one point he apparently thought it was the 'right thing to do'.

I don't think it was the first flip-flop of his lifetime, but it certainly set the stage for the grand waffle king he would later become.

The man also relied on the phony Winter Soldier report to accuse his fellow soldiers of war crimes in fron of the US Senate. Most of the men who testified in the Winter Soldier report never served. Those who did serve made up stories that were proven to be false when their military histories were checked.

While it may have been a blast for you to party, protest, and have orgies with the rest of the dirty hippy crowd - don't think you can speak for the rest of America.

What Kerry did was shameful to himself, his fellow soldiers, and his country. The SwiftBoatVets should be given 'Medals of Honor' for exposing this worm who has turned on his country before, and is willing to do it again.

[RMalloy]

Sorry, there is no blood on my hands. I am tired of this collective consciousness BS. We can argue Vietnam for ever but there is no
denying that one should be held responsible for their actions. John Kerry choose a coarse of action back then that was reckless in the extreme.
He slandered his fellow soldiers, he met with the enemy, he's continued
to embellish his time in Vietnam. He's finally being called on the carpet by the very men who in Kerry's own words, should be "unimpeachable"
because they served honorably in the war, instead his answer is to hide behind those who call the Swiftvets, liars and Republican hacks.

By the way, just what did Kerry discuss in Vietnam. Did he give any information to the Viet Cong that compromised our troops? I'd like to know. Kerry showed no courage, he showed a man willing to do or say anything to get what he wanted. Power and prestige. He is a total and complete fraud and sham and it makes me wonder about the DNC,
why they chose him in the first place.

[NAV307]

In the 50's ...

Two things:

1. John Kerry gave false testimony before the Congress of The United
States ... a felony.

2. John Kerry, while an Officer in The Uninted States Naval Reserve,
met with the enemy without authorization ... against Federal law,
and against the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Others hedge
because of technical definition ... but it is TREASON.

These are both Criminal Acts of great significance ... which are inexcuseable. Should a man who is involved with criminal acts of this magnitude ... even in "the heat of battle" ... be considered as President of The United States ... and Commander in Chief of the Armed Services? What would be his reaction when he is in even greater "heat of battle" with the leaders of other nations in his role as President?

A thought for you ... maybe Benedict Arnold had positive motivations about saving lives of soldiers in the Continental Army when he became a traitor ... "in the heat of battle" ... as our country was engaged in our war of independance. Had he been as successful as John Kerry in his treasonous act ... what would be your country of citizenship today?

NAV307
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NRA, SASS, Supporter of 2nd Amendment

[BC]