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Becky Seaman
Joined: 24 Aug 2004 Posts: 179 Location: Georgia
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Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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dmackto wrote: | It's a very powerful and upsetting story. Thank you for sharing it and for all you have done for the cause. Congrats on your retirement as well. |
Just visited your site with article and follow links. Excellent! _________________ “In the beginning of a change the patriot is a
scarce man, and brave, and hated and
scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid
join him, for then it costs nothing to be a
patriot.”
- Mark Twain |
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NavyChief Rear Admiral
Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Posts: 627 Location: Boise, Idaho
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Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 10:17 pm Post subject: Re: ...small world |
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1991932 wrote: | Fascinating post, Chief. You highlight the political realities in our world.
Was this the same Commission that resulted in Colliers International getting that huge real estate deal from the Vietnamese government back in 1992? Colliers, of course, is run by John Kerry's cousin Stewie. That happened after the Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA's shut down. It sounds like they are two different commissions, however. Anyway, it's very seedy stuff.
Did Donald P. Bellisario use your account as the basis for a couple of episodes on JAG a few years ago? They often take stuff from the real world for their story lines. This particular one dealt with an F-4 pilot who was shot down over North Viet Nam and ended up in the hands of the Soviets. He eventually died there. I know I just confessed to watching CBS, but JAG is a great and patriotic show.
This was my first time (posting). Do you mind if I smoke? |
The Presidential US/Russia Joint Commission on POW/MIAs was separate from Kerry's Senate Commission. We certainly tried to work together but Kerry wanted the lime light from his commission. We had to let him do his thing. At the same time, he was a Commissioner on our commission. But he was reponsible to us as far as the Russian/US side was concerned. Many do not realize or know the extent of the Russian involvement in Vietnam. LTCOL Il'ynikh was a Russian Missile Defense Officer who shot down 14 of our planes in Vietnam! The Russians were fighting us with some 4000 Soviet Troops at the time. They were mostly Missile Defense Officers who were shooting down our planes and trying to capture the survivors for interrogations. The Russians began to modify their missiles so they wouldn't completely destroy our aircraft -- leaving a good chance of survival for the pilots so they could capture them.
I like JAG as well, but I have no idea if they used one of our cases.
- Chief _________________ Working with Senator Kerry four years in the POW/MIA Office left me thinking -- when did the man ever do any work? |
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CTW Rear Admiral
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 691
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Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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NavyChief: Page 62-64 of Patterson's book Reckless DisregardHe writes of the believed suppression of the evidence of alive POW's ( aprox 1992) and of the committe that was formed Senate Select Committe on POW/MIS Affairs 1991-1993 with Kerry selected as chair 1992. Colonel Millard Peck, head of the Pentagon's POW/MIA office, resigned in disgust after 8 months: "The mind set to debunk is alive.... a cover up may be in progress." He then continues to talk about Kerry's committees actions and Colliers etc. Back later. CTW |
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SangRun Hunter PO1
Joined: 10 Sep 2004 Posts: 462 Location: Zinzinnati
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Posted: Sat Oct 02, 2004 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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I'm just speechless for the first time in a while I want to go out on my porch and smoke a cigaretgte, but I quit 3 months ago.
It's at the point where people should be in the streets demanding justice from the like of Kerry and Clinton.
There is no reason to not believe the story as I've heard others like it, but people would rather deny all the bad stuff that goes on in politics.
Thank you Navy Chief for standing up and out to tell the story. _________________ Mad as Hell! |
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SBD Admiral
Joined: 19 Aug 2004 Posts: 1022
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:42 am Post subject: |
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Kerry's work on his Senate Commission was just as bad. According to this Attorney on the Commission, Kerry ordered their report destroyed.
I posted the first of the three memorandum below.
You can read all of them at
http://www.powmiafamiliesagainstjohnkerry.com/evidence/evidence.htm
April 27, 1992
Memorandum for: Vice Chairman, Senate Select Committee on Prisoners of War and Missing in Action
From: John F. McCreary
Subject: Legal Misconduct and Possible Malpractice in the Select Committee
1. As a member of the Virginia State Bar, I am obliged by Disciplinary Rule DR-1-103(a) to report knowledge of misconduct by an attorney "to a tribunal or other authority empowered to investigate or act upon such violations." Under Rule IV, Paragraph 13, of the Rules for the integration of the Virginia State Bar, this obligation follows me as a member of the Bar, regardless of the location of my employment, for as long as I remain a member of the Virginia State Bar. Therefore, I am obliged, as a matter of law and under pain of discipline by the Virginia State Bar, to report to you my knowledge of misconduct and possible prima facie malpractice by attorneys on the Select Committee in ordering the destruction of Staff documents containing Staff intelligence findings on 9 April 1992 and in statements in meetings on 15 and 16 April to justify the destruction.
2. The attached Memoranda For the Record, one by myself and another by Mr. Jon D. Holstine, describe the relevant facts, which I summarize herein:
a. On 9 April 1992, the Chairman of the Senate Select Committee, Senator John Kerry of Massachusetts, in response to a protest by other members of the Select Committee, told the Select Committee members that "all copies" would be destroyed. This statement was made in the presence of the undersigned and of the Staff Chief Counsel who offered no protest.
b. Later on 9 April 1992, the Staff Director, Frances Zwenig, an attorney, repeated and insured the execution of Senator Kerry's order for the destruction of the Staff intelligence briefing text. I personally delivered to Mr. Barry Valentine, the Security Manager for SRB-78, the original printed version of the intelligence briefing text. I also verified that the original was destroyed by shredding in the Office of Senate Security on 10 April 1992, along with 14 copies.
c. On 15 April 1992, the Staff Chief Counsel, J. William Codinha of Massachusetts, when advised by members if the Staff about their concerns over the possible criminal consequences of destroying documents, minimized the significance of the act of destruction; ridiculed the Staff members for expressing their concerns; and replied, in response to questions about the potential consequences, "Who's the injured party," and "How are they going to find out because its classified." Mr. Codinha repeatedly defended the destruction of the documents and gave no assurances or indications that any copies of the intelligence briefing text existed.
d. On 16 April, the Chairman of the Senate Select Committee, Senator John Kerry, stated that he gave the order to destroy "extraneous copies of the documents" and that no one objected. Moreover, he stated that the issue was "moot" because the original remained in the Office of Senate Security "all along."
e. I subsequently learned that the Staff Director had deposited a copy of the intelligence briefing text in the Office of Senate Security at 1307 on 16 April.
3. The foregoing facts establish potentially a prima facie violation of criminal law and a pattern of violations of legal ethics by attorneys in acts of commission and omission.
a. It is hornbook law that an attorney may not direct the commission of a crime. In this incident two attorneys, one by his own admission, ordered the destruction of documents, which could be violation of criminal law.
b. Neither the Staff Chief Counsel nor any member of the Select Committee made a protest or uttered words of caution against the destruction of documents, by admission of the Chairman, Senator Kerry. The Chief Counsel has an affirmative duty to advise the Staff about the legality of its actions, and, in fact, had earlier issued the general prohibition to the Staff against document destruction.
c. The Chief Counsel's statements during the 15 April meeting to discuss the document destruction showed no regard for the legality of the action and displayed to the Staff only a concern about getting caught. By his words and actions, he presented to the Staff investigators an interpretation of the confidentiality and security rules that the rules of the Select Committee may be used to cover-up potentially unethical or illegal activity.
d. The Staff Director's action in placing an unaccounted for copy of the intelligence briefing text in the Office of Senate Security on 16 April constitutes an act to cover-up the destruction. Throughout the 16 April meeting, all three attorneys persisted in stating that the document had been on file since 9 April. This is simply not true.
4. I believe that the foregoing facts establish a pattern of grave legal misconduct - possibly including orders to commit a crime, followed by acts to justify and then to cover-up that crime. Even absent criminal liability, the behavioral pattern of the attorneys involved plays fast and loose with the Canons of Legal Ethics and establishes that one or more of the attorneys on the Select Committee are unfit to practice law. I am obliged to recommend that this report be filed with the appropriate disciplinary authorities of the State Bars in which these attorneys are members.
John F. McCreary, Esquire
SBD |
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no_1_momlandj Ensign
Joined: 03 Sep 2004 Posts: 56
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:50 am Post subject: |
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Chief,
I don't even know what to say. Kerry is the most immoral, disgusting, piece of.... How hard it must have been for you to know these things and not be able to do anything about it. I want to thank you again for your service to our country. With brave, honest men like you stnding watch, I feel there is still hope for us all. |
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Wynne Lieutenant
Joined: 19 Sep 2004 Posts: 228
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 4:33 am Post subject: |
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I can hardly express how I feel, reading this. Sad and angry, both. Very sad for the families of those POWs and MIAs. And so angry I want more than ever to do everything I can to defeat that disgusting hollow man JFK.
Chief, I have not been on here long and have just begun to learn about all the good you are doing -- you and the Swift Vets and the members of this forum and good people like you give me the only hope I have for the future of our country and for that I am so grateful! I just don't know how you stood it, working so hard on the POW-MIA situation and then to have it squashed like that. Good MUST come out of this -- it has to! _________________ TRUTH IS ALWAYS THE VICTOR |
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shawa CNO
Joined: 03 Sep 2004 Posts: 2004
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 8:51 am Post subject: |
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I too am reading "Reckless Disregard".
My emotions have been such disgust and anger!!
But Chief, with your post here-- OH DEAR GOD, MY HEART IS BREAKING!
12,500 men!! and Kerry just DISMISSED THEM?
Oh, my heart is breaking!
Those poor men! Those families!
JOHN KERRY IS SUCH SCUM!! HE IS EVIL!!
HE CANNOT WIN!! WE MUST DEFEAT HIM!!!! |
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kurtsprincess Seaman Apprentice
Joined: 15 Jun 2004 Posts: 80
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:31 am Post subject: |
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This should be a sticky!
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't McCain on this Committee? And if so, that might explain why they are friends and he feels the need to defend Kerry. Perhaps they colluded on suppressing evidence. _________________ KP
A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both.
History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid.
Dwight D. Eisenhower |
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Misty Lieutenant
Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 223
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:39 am Post subject: |
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I am numb. What can we do??? This sickens me. _________________ Misty
----------
Dad was in the Navy Pacific Fleet
Brother was on the USS Regulus - Vietnam
Husband was AirForce 3rd (34th) Tactical Fighter Wing - Security Police Bien Hoa Vietnam |
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srmorton PO2
Joined: 07 Aug 2004 Posts: 383 Location: Jacksonville, NC
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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Of course, this sickens me also, but what really makes me ill is the
role of the MSM in failing to uncover this as well as anything else
that might reflect negatively on John Kerry. This is a scandal that
far surpasses Watergate which made Woodward and Bernstein so
famous. Supposedly, reporters do not pass up a good story, so the
only explanation when they do not investigate something like this
is that they have a definite political bias. They do not want to uncover
the truth of what happened to over 12,000 brave men for fear of
how it will affect their chosen candidate. _________________ Susan R. Morton |
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WSue Seaman Recruit
Joined: 11 Sep 2004 Posts: 19
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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I would expect information of Kerry's abandonment of our POW/MIAs has gone out at least to Rush and Hannity. Yet, I don't recall either of them raising this issue. Am I wrong?
SueW |
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George F. Thompson Seaman Apprentice
Joined: 11 May 2004 Posts: 80 Location: Fort Walton Beach, Fl 32547
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 2:22 pm Post subject: It's a small world. |
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If you really want to become inscensed, check out this link.
www.villagevoice.com/issues/0408/schanberg2.php it will show up as unavailable, but if you put in Schanberg in the search box, 47 related articles written by Schanberg will pop up. Pay particular attention to the articles titled "Did America abandon Vietnam War P.O.W.'s Parts 1 & 2? I know you're probably thinking the Village Voice is a liberal rag, but you will be truly amazed at what you can find in there. There are a lot more cover ups going on and you will be amazed as too who are associated with them. As the old saying goes, " politicians make strange bedfellows".
Once again, the power of the internet should bust this wide open. I won't be holding my breath waiting on the MSM to report on this.
George F. Thompson |
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WSue Seaman Recruit
Joined: 11 Sep 2004 Posts: 19
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Posted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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Just finished reading the many POW/MIA articles at the villiage voice site....looks like many dirty hands in this, doesn't it.
SueW |
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tonkingulfyachtclub68_69 Seaman Recruit
Joined: 08 Aug 2004 Posts: 38
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